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BA 767 Lifestyle & Roster

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BA 767 Lifestyle & Roster

Old 1st Jun 2011, 00:02
  #1 (permalink)  
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BA 767 Lifestyle & Roster

Hi everyone,

For those of you who are sharp-eyed, you may have noticed that I started the now very informative thread running about the BA 747 Lifestyle & Roster. My dilemma is that whilst I am 767 rated, I have been offered a place on the 747, however the permanent long-haul aspect is a concern, and isn't quite what I had in mind when I applied. Without getting into the debate about being mad to turn down a 747 course, please would any BA 767 guys post some examples of rosters/lifestyle for a junior chap, so that I can make a direct comparison between 747 and 767. Only then can I really start the thinking-things-through process properly! In general are the day-trips achievable for junior people, or are the long-haul trips all that are left after the senior guys get their pick. Is it possible to make cap just doing the day-trips, etc?

Many thanks in advance.
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Old 2nd Jun 2011, 10:48
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Shortcut

You need to factor in the demise of the 767 fleet - all being replaced by 787s which arrive next year. The company has already said that the 787 will not mix shorthaul routes and thus expect that side to be taken up with Airbus equipment.

Although the changeover would take time you need to think how your career would progress if you delayed joining BA whislt waiting for a 767 place (which might never be offered)..............
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Old 2nd Jun 2011, 11:33
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Also all planned DEP slots on the 767 for this training year have been filled. So you may be waiting some time....
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Old 2nd Jun 2011, 12:03
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Not strictly related to 767 lifestyle but screw that!!! If I were you I'd take the 747 position, do 5 years of seeing the world and when your freeze is up after 5 years you can move back to shorthaul with some seniority if you want to. The 767 is a dying fleet and there's every chance in two years time when the 787s arrive you could find yourself directed off the fleet (ie another conversion course!) on to the 747 or 777 or A320 anyway.
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Old 2nd Jun 2011, 13:15
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I know a long list of people who delayed applying to/joining BA for various reasons and subsequently lived to regret their decision.

If you ultimately want to fly for BA, then my advise would be to take the first start date they offer you, regardless of fleet. If you aren't too fussed about BA, then you can afford to be a bit more picky.
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Old 2nd Jun 2011, 20:23
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The current planned retirement date for the 767 is 2018, that is dependent on Boeing actually managing to deliver a 787 in 2012 which is far from certain - talk of BA taking Thomsonfly aircraft is wishful thinking. The current plan calls for 14 of the current 21 767 aircraft to have a refit - the remaining 7 are due to be replaced directly by incoming 787s. There are people who've been on the fleet over 11 years and if anyone will be leaving the fleet it will be them rather than directions from the bottom - nearly 40 guys moved off between November and February and there have been no directions off the fleet despite the end of the 757. Anyone who claims the 767 is a dying fleet only needs to look back at a bit of BA history, the most recent case being the 757 which was a dying fleet in 2002 and lasted until late last year, then there was the 737 which is still going strong at Gatwick and talks with the manufacturers about a replacement are only just starting.

In the meantime the 767 has some great routes and trips which even as a junior FO you will see. I was, until last month, in the bottom 1/5th on the fleet and haven't done a blind-line (zero control over your final roster) in 3 years. Yes you won't see every corner of the world but when you get to most of the further destinations you'll have plenty of time to explore and, if you don't want to spend 4 days playing golf in Zambia, you can do a short-haul tour instead which currently give you a day off in Madrid or Athens over a 4 day tour. In the meantime the talk from the junior guys on the 777 and 747 is of deep discontent with their lot on permanent blindlines.

That said if BA are only offering a 747 course then take it, when I joined the company we were told by the recruitment bod that one of our joining course was missing as they had turned down an A320 course because they only wanted long-haul. Turns out they never got their course and eventually fell out of the hold pool when we stopped recruiting. Seniority is king at BA when it comes to lifestyle and it's not likely to change much in the next 5 years by which time you'll be able to bid off the fleet if you hate it.

Last edited by StudentInDebt; 2nd Jun 2011 at 22:46.
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Old 6th Jun 2011, 10:20
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Shortcut

You say you are rated on the 767. How did you manage to apply before and got an offering on the 747? I thought the 747 recruitment was for rated pilots only?
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Old 6th Jun 2011, 10:57
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Answer question

A bit sad to see a lot of personnal opinions and no info concerning rosters. I would appreciate to have this kind of info aswell...
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Old 6th Jun 2011, 14:13
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Jet Fuel Addict

I thought the 747 recruitment was for rated pilots only?
It was - now public knowledge that we didn't get enough suitable applicants so trawling the next nearest type.
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Old 6th Jun 2011, 18:53
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Certainly true. Common knowledge that a couple of FOs in FR were offered 744 courses in September. Right place, right time.
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Old 6th Jun 2011, 22:04
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Junior rosters will consist of probably 3 out of 4 weekends. Most destinations do tend to filter down to the junior lines, since all people on the fleet seem to want different things. Looking quickly at last months most junior rosters there was a complete spread of destinations even including the traditional popular ones of LUN, DAR & NAS.

JED & TLV on the weekend will feature a lot since they tend to be unpopular due to the low credit associated with them.

Much less shorthaul on the fleet now only shorthaul nightstops are MAD, LCA, FCO, ATH and ARN occasionally. Currently we do far more longhaul than shorthaul as a % of work, yet this will sway bac as the 787s come in and replace longhaul 76s

High credit day trips especially in the week are senior, in particular DME & IST. 3 crew trips tend to be more popular than 2 for obvious reasons yet having said that they still appear on blind lines.

Drop me a line if you want more info.
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Old 7th Jun 2011, 11:33
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Right place, right time

It was - now public knowledge that we didn't get enough suitable applicants so trawling the next nearest type.
Nice.

I take it though that these guys applied as 737/757/767 rated pilots back in early October, and then got offered 747 slots? Not that these guys somehow managed to wiggle their way into the 747 recruitment when that opened online?

Sorry if the questions seem a bit simple minded, its just that if there is any way in at the moment without 767/757 rating, I would like to know. I'm still kicking myself for not seeing the closed date shortened when they were looking for 737 pilots...
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Old 7th Jun 2011, 11:40
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I applied back in October, within a few days of the main recruitment starting. I was 757-rated and got through into the hold pool in April. I was expecting a 767 position, as BA were known to be recruiting directly onto type, however in became clear that there were not enough internal transfers onto the 747 to satisfy the requirement, and so I think a number of 757/767 rated guys were offered 747 positions.

I know of someone who was 767 rated trying to apply during the 747 window, but he was flatly turned away.

Thanks to everyone who contributed to the Roster/Lifestyle discussion btw.
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Old 7th Jun 2011, 11:42
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I would imagine BA may need to recruit again in 2012. It may not be type specific this time around. Who knows?
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Old 7th Jun 2011, 11:54
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Thanks for the replies guys

Sooo... About that 767 roster / lifestyle again...
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Old 7th Jun 2011, 14:09
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You are joining an Airline, not a fleet. If you do not understand the difference you should stay where you are.

To quote from another thread..

I'm now 3 weeks into my course and the mantra throughout the company is "seniority is everything". You are joining a company not a fleet so just take whatever you are offered, get in the front door and you can move around later till your heart is content - the date you joined the company means everything - not the date you join a particular fleet.
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Old 8th Jun 2011, 09:00
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As L337 said. Join ASAP, be available to move your course date sooner if the opportunity arises. Only one thing matters in BA and that is DoJ. Get in now and don't worry about what fleet it is!
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Old 11th Jun 2011, 15:18
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I know it's a repeat/quote of what BusdriverLHR said but he summed things up succintly and accurately. I would take his advice if you're thinking of joining BA.

If you ultimately want to fly for BA, then my advise would be to take the first start date they offer you, regardless of fleet. If you aren't too fussed about BA, then you can afford to be a bit more picky.
Company or just another airline flying the aircraft you're rated on??

Which is it?
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Old 14th Jun 2011, 17:08
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Join Date: Apr 2002
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At the bottom expect plenty of weekend working. BWI, PHL, JED, TLV.
You'll also get to see NAS in the stormy season.
Are you familiar with how bidline works? Worth buying any BA mates from any the LHR fleets a beer for an hour or two of their time.
I left the fleet a year ago to get more seniority on a junior fleet (320) and hence control of days off.
If you have no mates already in BA then pm me.
Good luck
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