Industrial Action at Flybe?
Join Date: Jul 2011
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Two good legs to stand on thanks son 
Maybe getting a little knackered now though, its the knees you know... 
Lots of private messages thanking me for speaking the truth, thank you
everyone, no need to message me, just mark a X at YES
Maybe getting a little knackered now though, its the knees you know... Lots of private messages thanking me for speaking the truth, thank you
everyone, no need to message me, just mark a X at YES
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Well, I'm going to put my neck on the line here and say that I've actually voted in favour of this deal.
I don't like the scheduling side of it as it relies on too much good will being risked in order to get good will back (and as far as I recall, this has never happened!). And also the agreement uses terms which are open to incredible amounts of interpretation, and leave gaping holes in our defence. BUT... we do have the ace card here. If the company do not live up to these rules that they have set, then in 6 months time, then we can ballot for the strike then, on the idea that the agreement has been broken, or was never intended in the first place.
In reality, the pay side of things - well how much do you want? We all want more... and not a single one of us would turn down a 15% payrise if we were offered it? But is it correct? No. It's not... When the initial ballots came out, most of us said "We want RPI". So we get an offer at RPI, and now people are saying that it isn't enough. We'll never be able to extract more than 2% for the year that we've lost - there's no chance that will ever budge. I don't like next year being capped, but there's going to be little chance of getting that to budge too.
But we've also got to consider the Holiday pay which will add another little bit onto our figures too.
I'll be the first person to be critical of financial incentives offered to directors and high up management and the company. But in this case, we asked for an RPI linked payrise, and that's what we got.
It takes good will from both sides to make this work, let's just hope that it is shown from the company. If it's not, then we ballot for the strike and hit them then. It will give us a much firmer ground than the one we are on right now!
I don't like the scheduling side of it as it relies on too much good will being risked in order to get good will back (and as far as I recall, this has never happened!). And also the agreement uses terms which are open to incredible amounts of interpretation, and leave gaping holes in our defence. BUT... we do have the ace card here. If the company do not live up to these rules that they have set, then in 6 months time, then we can ballot for the strike then, on the idea that the agreement has been broken, or was never intended in the first place.
In reality, the pay side of things - well how much do you want? We all want more... and not a single one of us would turn down a 15% payrise if we were offered it? But is it correct? No. It's not... When the initial ballots came out, most of us said "We want RPI". So we get an offer at RPI, and now people are saying that it isn't enough. We'll never be able to extract more than 2% for the year that we've lost - there's no chance that will ever budge. I don't like next year being capped, but there's going to be little chance of getting that to budge too.
But we've also got to consider the Holiday pay which will add another little bit onto our figures too.
I'll be the first person to be critical of financial incentives offered to directors and high up management and the company. But in this case, we asked for an RPI linked payrise, and that's what we got.
It takes good will from both sides to make this work, let's just hope that it is shown from the company. If it's not, then we ballot for the strike and hit them then. It will give us a much firmer ground than the one we are on right now!
I REALLY SHOULDN'T BE HERE
Our terms and conditions are not going to go from second or third rate to BOAC overnight. If viewed in the context of an incremental improvement it is a fair (albeit not stellar) deal. As previously stated, if in six months time we - the union - are not satisfied that the company are adhering to the agreement, we can vote for IA.
When we go back to negotiate in eighteen months time I imagine we will find the management more willing to engage in meaningful talks. If not I will be looking to the CC to get tough a lot quicker than they have done this time around.
When we go back to negotiate in eighteen months time I imagine we will find the management more willing to engage in meaningful talks. If not I will be looking to the CC to get tough a lot quicker than they have done this time around.
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What you on about second or third rate?! It's fourth at best.
Just wait until all the FO's leave and your flying with a load of spotty MPL holders. Then it'll be fifth rate. Like I say Enjoy it! I'm sure half of you can find some positives in all this.
Also it's going to be good fun flying with Thomas cook B757 FOs I'm sure they'll have a good laugh at the flymaybe T&C's...
Just wait until all the FO's leave and your flying with a load of spotty MPL holders. Then it'll be fifth rate. Like I say Enjoy it! I'm sure half of you can find some positives in all this.
Also it's going to be good fun flying with Thomas cook B757 FOs I'm sure they'll have a good laugh at the flymaybe T&C's...
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No I just dont like the idea of the stick shaker going off every other sector, taking off with the wrong flap setting, alt busts, not being paid to act as a TRI, bleeds off at FL100, gear down in the cruise, flap 35 go arounds etc
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Look son, if you feel that MPL holders are in any way unsafe then
address your concerns to the CAA, they would like to hear from you... No? Didn't think so, you would rather come on here and spout hogwash.
Good to see some sensible responses to my common sense.
Time to stand up and be counted and take control of our own destiny.
address your concerns to the CAA, they would like to hear from you... No? Didn't think so, you would rather come on here and spout hogwash.
Good to see some sensible responses to my common sense.
Time to stand up and be counted and take control of our own destiny.
Join Date: May 2001
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I'll be voting in favour of the deal. It's probably as good as we're gonna get. I doubt it can get any more fatiguing to be honest, and any improvement is something in the current economic climate.
Mine went in the post today.
Mine went in the post today.
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As good as we can get, for now.
Its up to us (not the people on this thread who do not even belong
to the flybe family), to get a CC elected who will fight for the
improvements we deserve at the next pay talks.
This company has expansion plans, just read through the
info which PBM's have provided in the crew rooms, you will see
that Flybe Nordic alone will be nearly the size of the UK operation
in as little as 3 or 4 years. There are other deals in the pipeline
too.
By accepting this offer we are seen as team players, but then we
can get our ducks in a row for the next talks, the economy will
be improving by then, other airlines will be recruiting, everything will
be in our favour, right now the environment favours the mismanagement.
Vote YES, but if you have not by now you are too darn late!
Its up to us (not the people on this thread who do not even belong
to the flybe family), to get a CC elected who will fight for the
improvements we deserve at the next pay talks.
This company has expansion plans, just read through the
info which PBM's have provided in the crew rooms, you will see
that Flybe Nordic alone will be nearly the size of the UK operation
in as little as 3 or 4 years. There are other deals in the pipeline
too.
By accepting this offer we are seen as team players, but then we
can get our ducks in a row for the next talks, the economy will
be improving by then, other airlines will be recruiting, everything will
be in our favour, right now the environment favours the mismanagement.
Vote YES, but if you have not by now you are too darn late!
Join Date: Mar 2001
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My guess is Winter this year
I have no specific info from the inside other than as a line pilot I know the majority of FO's/SFO's I am acquainted with and a moderate % of Captains have been polishing their application forms for BA. As other carriers open their doors too this Winter I would expect an significant number of current Flybe pilots to apply to Easy/exec jets/charters etc.
On this basis I think it highly likely we will be reopening the doors to recruitment this year, however I wouldn't expect many DEC's because there a huge number of command ready FO's already here so expect recruitment to be FO level only
On this basis I think it highly likely we will be reopening the doors to recruitment this year, however I wouldn't expect many DEC's because there a huge number of command ready FO's already here so expect recruitment to be FO level only
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[quotewill fight for the
improvements we deserve at the next pay talks.
][/quote]
As mentioned above it's a real shame to be accepting this derisory offer when you are already looking ahead to when it can be improved. Do you honestly think that by rolling over now at the first sign of actually having to do anything other than put a cross in a box you are sendig a message to the management which says you won't be messed with? Or are you in effect saying that you're a weak group so string us along for a while then make the offer you no doubt had in mind from day one.
Do you honestly think that having not accepted any offers until now management think you are 'team players'.!!!! Do you think they care at all? Given your sceduling agreement I would think not. And common sense would contradict your argument re future recruitment. If I ran a small airline where people traditionally moved up to bigger and better things I would address the package now to try and stop people even looking. But Flybe is a training airline in the management eyes, always has been and will be so I suspect you'll find they won't care what the market does.
DP I hope you're right. But given the level of respect you have been shown by management, and given that it will be generally skippers who leave first as better airlines snap up your experienced guys, don't be surprised to find that there is a need for Captains immediately, leading to DEC recruitment to fill the gap.
Anyone who thinks that the crew have scored a victory here is an apologist. Flybe are making a fortune, buying up airlines where the crews earn a lot more, and keeping you on low pay. Whilst the management reward themselves massively. Now I accept they take the risks hence they have a right to better remuneration, but come one, where does it stop when JF earns more than Willie Walsh. BA pilots wouldn't stand for what you do, grow some backbone for your own sakes.
improvements we deserve at the next pay talks.
][/quote]
As mentioned above it's a real shame to be accepting this derisory offer when you are already looking ahead to when it can be improved. Do you honestly think that by rolling over now at the first sign of actually having to do anything other than put a cross in a box you are sendig a message to the management which says you won't be messed with? Or are you in effect saying that you're a weak group so string us along for a while then make the offer you no doubt had in mind from day one.
By accepting this offer we are seen as team players, but then we
can get our ducks in a row for the next talks, the economy will
be improving by then, other airlines will be recruiting, everything will
be in our favour
can get our ducks in a row for the next talks, the economy will
be improving by then, other airlines will be recruiting, everything will
be in our favour
however I wouldn't expect many DEC's because there a huge number of command ready FO's already here so expect recruitment to be FO level only
Anyone who thinks that the crew have scored a victory here is an apologist. Flybe are making a fortune, buying up airlines where the crews earn a lot more, and keeping you on low pay. Whilst the management reward themselves massively. Now I accept they take the risks hence they have a right to better remuneration, but come one, where does it stop when JF earns more than Willie Walsh. BA pilots wouldn't stand for what you do, grow some backbone for your own sakes.
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What a load of drivel 
Like I said, ignore the uniformed tosh from people outside.
The future is bright, the future is a sky blue colour...
(Good luck to those that want to go to BA, Easy etc,
but it will be f/o's they recruit, maybe younger Capts,
the crusties are going no where, so I am bugg@red).
Like I said, ignore the uniformed tosh from people outside.
The future is bright, the future is a sky blue colour...
(Good luck to those that want to go to BA, Easy etc,
but it will be f/o's they recruit, maybe younger Capts,
the crusties are going no where, so I am bugg@red).