Ryanair exodus, what is the plan?

[captainbirdseye9999]

How Ryanair ruined my life.

So here’s my story, and also why not to join possibly the worlds worst airline, all these points have been covered before, but ill give you an inside perspective.
I’ve always wanted to fly; I put my finances on the line just to get my licence. When I got a job with Ryan air, it was amazing, the jet, the logging of hours in my log book etc. id say I was on an ok number in my uk base, then the time came for command upgrade, 4 years in the company, 2 sick days, no no shows and an unblemished flying record, id kept my head down. I jumped at the chance of a command, thinking, if they move me, it cant be that bad, 12 months…what the hell so I did it, passed everything and got based abroad. At first it was great,sunshine,2 or 3 flights a day back home. But then after a while things just got s**t couldn’t get home enough on my 5/3 roster, my fiancée; love of my life couldn’t handle it and left. My pay rise, all of a sudden became the same take home as before, euros to pounds, mortgage in the uk and rental property abroad to live on my 5 days work. Also why am I getting 10% less than every other captain for doing exactly the same job?that grated on me as well! But still I go to work, save fuel, fly safely…why, because I think of myself as a professional and don’t want to let my FO or myself down. Yeah a great place to go on holiday, but to live and work here…no thanks…even the local cabin crew look at us with disgust. Why are you in our country…etc? The last couple of days I had a personal issue back home, and this is when it finally hit home, after trying crewing a number of times (no answer) finally get through to someone, they bark at me, and hang up the phone. No adhoc leave available…. so I find myself, head in hands, a grown man close to breakdown because this shower of s**t company has done this to me. I’ve never hated my job so much! knowing that guys straight direct entry out of other airlines get priority over bases before people that have worked up from the bottom makes me sick! Im here, they are where I want to be, life would have been so much simpler if I had just stayed an FO,5/4 and the same money, if only I could turn back time.
I’m looking, and when something comes up im off! And this s**t outfit can rot in hell; I just pray to god they don’t take any innocent people with them!!

Oh, and apparently its going to take 3 years to get back to my base……WTF!!

[Dan 98]

captainbirdseye9999

Sad to hear that it has that effect on you. I expect there are many reading your post in the same position. Fingers crossed you'll be in a position to move to something better in the coming months and FR will be left in the

Interesting previous threads make reference to Tube Drivers, there is one big difference between Tube/Train drivers and pilots, they stand together and take action!! The tubes were out on strike all day last week. Pilots moan and i include myself in that but we never do........! We only have ourselves to blame for putting up with the current state of our T&C's and nothing will change until aircraft are sat on the ground not moving with us refusing to fly them until things change.......we have the power but not the will unfortunately.

[Bokkenrijder]

captainbirdseye9999, sorry to hear your sad story. Unfortunately there is no shortcut to both 1) a quick command on a shiny jet and 2) a career airline where you are well treated and can work happily until retirement. Except for a few exceptions (small yet stable niche airlines) these two are mutually exclusive. For anyone thinking about it: escaping to Emirates (or Etihad, Qatar etc) will not change that, you'd just be even further away from home, treated like sh!t, yet with 4 stripes on a shiny (wide body) jet. On top of that, if a lot of RYR people do not feel at home in Southern Europe, why would they feel at home in the Middle East?

Callsign Kilo:

You know, I laugh when people exclaim on here that we should all grow some backbone and stand up to management.

I'm actually quite shocked by such a cynical statement. It reminds me of some (religious?) fatalist nutcases who never put up a fight, yet resign to the fact that some higher power is in charge of their fate. Is that how the average FR pilot would also handle an double engine failure (New York...Hudson...) by exclaiming: "we're doomed, I have no backbone, I give up?" I seriously doubt it. I believe that when the pressure get's big enough then people can and will do extraordinary things, even in Ryanair. Obviously the abuse and pressure is not great enough yet at RYR...

By avoiding the pressure (escape to the Middle East) people will only buy one a little bit of extra time, but sooner or later pilots in the Middle East will also experience similar stories like those of captainbirdseye9999...

[Carmoisine]

if I had just stayed an FO,5/4 and the same money, if only I could turn back time.

This is fast becoming a reoccurring theme.

The penny is starting to drop with a few command upgrade ready First Officers, or "low hanging fruit" as they are known to senior members of the training department, that a command on less money then they are making now in their base of choice is probably not worth it anymore as they will be on 5/3 in a far flung siht hole with no chance of a transfer back as direct entry Captains slide into the desired bases.

It get's better too. When PB was on his charm offensive, touring the bases to raise morale he stated that amongst others Fes and Marrakesh were future bases.

A cynic might suggest that this is a deliberate "environmental push factor" as a deviant manager in Aer Lingus once put it. Deliberately push people to breaking point, send them to a base which will put their family and social connections under strain of breaking until they are forced to leave and replace with a cheaper replacement. The race to the bottom continues, PB gets his bonus.

I couldn't comment.

[cumulustratus]

Hopefully we'll soon see a change

A large amount of union-refusing skippers at RYR are soon about to change sides. I'm talking about the vast majority of "older" skippers sitting on the old lucrative BRK contracts that are about to expire in a year or so. When they no longer will be able to continue their 'creative tax management' and enter the reduced rates with the Irish tax and accounting bs, they will be ready to take action. Today these pilots are the ones crying the hardest when any union talk comes up on the f/d. Specially the ones on IAA license validations that are today extremely careful no to lose their jobs as it would mean a one way ticket out of the dear old EU.

The villas and X5's and plastic surgery girlfriends (+wife) and kids in boarding school all dig out of their pockets. Can they afford to stay quiet?

[zerotohero]

€35 per hour for first 500?

That was just while line training then its €55 until 500 hours, tell me thats not changed now on the contracts?

that really does make the whole think pointless.

[Skyhigh86]

35 Euro P/H from Safety Pilot release until Line check(and end of month)

55 Euro P/H until 500 hours(and end of month)


Hasnt changed.

[captainbirdseye9999]

I just dont understand how an airline that claims it "the biggest and best in europe" can be so shortsighted.I can imagine PB now breathing a sigh of relief now that the summer is almost over,"we got away with it,again!".This company appears to run on a week-by-week basis,maybe even day-to-day (most likely)
Everyone i have spoken to knows at least 2 people who are leaving,indeed,speaking to a couple of Captains the other day that have been here 10+ years,they are going to go to an Emirates road show "for a look see"!! I dont know what PB plan was with that rubbish memo....18 peple are leaving! bul s**t,this company literaly has no respect for its workforce and just assumes we are thick!!believe it or not,i think Airline pilots might fall under the category of "slightly inteligent" as opposed to some jumped up farm boy who thinks hes running a fleet of combines in some bog ridden back end of ireland.

I hear on the grapevine that a UK operator is about to put in an order with Boeing for a large amount of 73NGs also with VS Blue and others buying up airframes at a great rate (no wonder MOL cant get a "deal",real airlines are buying them all!) i suspect that a type rated FO with 1000+ hours is going to be in a great position over the next year or so....he may get his wish,Cabin crew might have to sit in the right seat!!!
And the crazy thing is,it would only take a few small things to make this place a little better,5/4 in all bases,some kind of seniority type list as far as base requests go,NOT PUTTING DIRECT ENTRY CONTRACT CAPTAINS WHERE THEY WANT TO GO!! and giving us an easier/transparent leave system (at the moment its more covert than the bloody SAS!)



Good luck.

[fireflybob]

I was on the assessment for a pilot position one month ago in STD.

Wow, Ryanair have expanded into Venezuela then! Or should that be STN?

[Falcone]

To JPK110,

If you are DEC, then this is info you are looking for.

There is reduced recruitment requirement for DEC. At least according Peter Bellews` memo dated on 27th Aug 2010.

See this extract from memo:

[B]... The rate of pilot resignations/retirements (currently 18 out of over 2,300) is running at less then 3% of the annual rate which is a fraction of normal planning levels.

This has reduced our recruitment requirement and last six Direct Entry Captain OCC Courses sheduled from October 2010 to March 2011 are now not required.

For the remainder of current aircraft order, the vast majoriy of Captain positions are planned from current poll of co-pilots, with very limited external recruitment........[/B]

So, long story short.

No more DEC in Ryanair for foreseen future. Ryanair F/Os have turned nasty recently and twisted Peters` hand. So, Ryanair decided to stop recruiting DEC. For time been.


Question; What means for time been?

Answer; Nobody knows.

Offcourse in Ryan nothing is forever.



Another question; Would anyone believe in Ryanair propaganda?

Another answer; Take your own choise.

[737Jock]

That is so smart, if the co-pilots actually believe it. They will upgrade some FO's from October-march and then train some DEC's (much less training) over April and may to meet summer demand...

[Nicholas49]

It's a shame that "Peter Bellews" cannot write a sentence using correct English grammar, nor spell "scheduled" properly.

I assume he holds a senior position in the airline?

[ryanairpilotSTN]

I fear worse news is coming as PB and Eddie Wilson were on a secret visit to Bergamo today to warn of further cuts.

The full text of the now infamous memo is below from off the internal intranet.


Attn: All Pilots
From: Peter Bellew
Date: 27th August 2010
Re: Pilot Recruitment

Dear Ladies and Gentlemen,

Thank you to the many Ryanair pilots who have directed their colleagues to the Ryanair recruitment website and the following is the updated position.

• The rate of pilot resignations/retirements (currently 18 pilots out of over 2,300) is running at less than 3% of the annual rate which is a fraction of normal planning levels.

• This has reduced our recruitment requirement and the last six Direct Entry Captain OCC Courses scheduled from October 2010 to March 2011 are now not required.

• For the remainder of our current aircraft order, the vast majority of Captain positions are planned from the current pool of co-pilots, with very limited external recruitment.

• External schools will continue to offer a reducing number of 737 Type Rating course places for co-pilots. Applicants should apply via the school links on the Ryanair website.

• Ryanair is an equal opportunities employer. Applications for employment can only be made through the channels detailed on the Ryanair website. Applicants who canvass (by phone, direct contact or through existing employees) will be disqualified.

Best regards

Peter Bellew
Deputy Director – Flight Operations

[flycheaper]

So 3 months after....seems to continue...not a day without meeting a FR jockey actually leaving the company...BA, Emirates, Norwegian, Qatar, Aerologic, Aer lingus, Jet2...
Would be really interested to have real figures because 18 seems so unrealistic, should be more around 10% of the pilot workforce by now...but it's just a guess

[Skyhigh86]

2 BC's certainly involved in a very public walkout to the sandpit, fair play to the lads.
Says a lot when two people of these stature are quite happy to head back into the RHS!

[YYZ]

Im not seeing that many, more than PB says but still not the mass as expected?
Maybe people are playing the old cards close to their chest??

[McBruce]

theres a few guys in my base with a couple of interviews lined up in the next few weeks...

[dire straits]

Best move I ever done was to leave FR, from where I was based at least 7 pilots has left this year. Thats approx 10% of pilots at that base, have met several pilots that used to be with FR, so pretty sure PB's 18 is a dreamnumber. Left them and get paid better than a FR captain plus I get crewfood, medical, all the water I can drink, pension and LOL.
Guys come on, get out of there and get a better life!

[fastidious bob]

A close friend of mine said there were 12 Pilots leaving his base alone, mainly Captains. You can't blame people, especially with the Irish tax set up and only being paid per scheduled block hour. Rubbish

[DirectDIKAS]

Dire Straits, so where is this better life then? Where you working, Id love to know