Ba's DEP fleets
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Ba's DEP fleets
Hello all!
I am a B737 pilot who has just applied for BA's DEP scheme.
I was wondering weather someone may be able to clarify the following issues:
1)What sort of fleet may DEP's go to?, is there any possibility of going strait on to a B777 for example?
2)what sort of loss of income/licence insurance does BA use?
3)what is the new pension plan all about?
3)how many pilots is BA looking for?
Thanks for any info!
cheers!
Pulman
I am a B737 pilot who has just applied for BA's DEP scheme.
I was wondering weather someone may be able to clarify the following issues:
1)What sort of fleet may DEP's go to?, is there any possibility of going strait on to a B777 for example?
2)what sort of loss of income/licence insurance does BA use?
3)what is the new pension plan all about?
3)how many pilots is BA looking for?
Thanks for any info!
cheers!
Pulman
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Pullman, (0/10 for question numbering by the way)
1) Probably your current type. i.e. you would go to LGW on the 737.
2) Believe 150k FO, 200k Capt.
3) Dunno.
3b) 100+
1) Probably your current type. i.e. you would go to LGW on the 737.
2) Believe 150k FO, 200k Capt.
3) Dunno.
3b) 100+
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Cough, thanks for the info!
I am working on my question numbering, so I have prepared another two.
1)What sort of annual salary can a year 1 F/O bring home after tax including all allowances?
2)How many years to command on the short haul fleet?
Hopefully I will score better this time!!
Thanks!
Pulman
I am working on my question numbering, so I have prepared another two.
1)What sort of annual salary can a year 1 F/O bring home after tax including all allowances?
2)How many years to command on the short haul fleet?
Hopefully I will score better this time!!
Thanks!
Pulman
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pulman,
1) Not working there yet, but from what I can gleam average Gross including flight pay for a year one FO short haul should come out at £54000, so I'd say £2900-3000 p.c.m. There is a payrise (to be backdated) about to go through too. Heres the breakdown :
Basic = £40,500
Flight pay (fully taxed) = ~ 750hrs * £8 = £6000
Time away from base (estimated 2500-3500) = 3000 * £2.58 = £7740 (Only taxed at about 7%)
Total Gross= £54,240
2) A long time. In past in has been very short, but now more than 10 years, but of course the tide comes in and goes out again every so often.
1) Not working there yet, but from what I can gleam average Gross including flight pay for a year one FO short haul should come out at £54000, so I'd say £2900-3000 p.c.m. There is a payrise (to be backdated) about to go through too. Heres the breakdown :
Basic = £40,500
Flight pay (fully taxed) = ~ 750hrs * £8 = £6000
Time away from base (estimated 2500-3500) = 3000 * £2.58 = £7740 (Only taxed at about 7%)
Total Gross= £54,240
2) A long time. In past in has been very short, but now more than 10 years, but of course the tide comes in and goes out again every so often.
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1) There's no recruitment on to the 737 at LGW, the fleet is in surplus already. New entrants will go to the A320, 777 or 747. The company would like type rated pilots to go to the long haul fleets, but strangely enough none are applying. There is still immense demand for a 747 position within the company so I'd expect the majority of new DEPs to go the 777 or A320 where they're needed most.
2) Dunno off the top of my head.
3) New pension plan is gash. Its a defined contribution scheme, you pay a bit, the company pays a bit, then at the end of your career you take all the cash and buy an annuity, which I think is a sort of contract for another company to pay you £X per year until you die. I think current annuity rats are around £100K to buy a £3K p.a. annuity, so work out how many millions you'd need to save to retire comfortably. The BA contribution is 12% of pensionable pay which is only actually about 75% of basic, so the real contribution rate is 9%. This is significantly lower than Virgin and GB.
4) About 200 I think.
For your next set of questions:
1) Probably about £3000pcm at a rough guess.
2) Currently at least 10 years short haul and 15 years long haul. If the retirement age restriction is lifted in 2006 then add a minimum of 5 years to that. Bear in mind that there are probably the best part 1000 pilots in BA who are 30 or younger. They will get a command before you and if you are over 30 then they will also outlast you in BA.
If all you want to do is long haul then go to Virgin. Fly less hours with better cabin crew and you don't get the constant sh1t you get flying for BA.
2) Dunno off the top of my head.
3) New pension plan is gash. Its a defined contribution scheme, you pay a bit, the company pays a bit, then at the end of your career you take all the cash and buy an annuity, which I think is a sort of contract for another company to pay you £X per year until you die. I think current annuity rats are around £100K to buy a £3K p.a. annuity, so work out how many millions you'd need to save to retire comfortably. The BA contribution is 12% of pensionable pay which is only actually about 75% of basic, so the real contribution rate is 9%. This is significantly lower than Virgin and GB.
4) About 200 I think.
For your next set of questions:
1) Probably about £3000pcm at a rough guess.
2) Currently at least 10 years short haul and 15 years long haul. If the retirement age restriction is lifted in 2006 then add a minimum of 5 years to that. Bear in mind that there are probably the best part 1000 pilots in BA who are 30 or younger. They will get a command before you and if you are over 30 then they will also outlast you in BA.
If all you want to do is long haul then go to Virgin. Fly less hours with better cabin crew and you don't get the constant sh1t you get flying for BA.
Couldonlyaffordafiver
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Mentioned this in the past:
If you join BA tomorrow, you will not get a command for a very long time. Hand Solo is probably about right. Since the new pay deal, a SH command occurs at LGW at a seniority number of approximately 1800, SH LHR at 1400, LH LHR at 1000 (ish). If you join tomorrow, you seniority number will be 3100 ish. As the large retirement bubble ends (plus the advent of new legislation in 2006), your seniority number will not change by very much (probably around 50 places per year). You do the the maths.
Keep in mind that there are a lot of senior guys aged around 30. For example, I flew with a 777 skipper the other week who was 36. He will be a long haul captain for 19 to 26 years, depending on when he retires. Bear in mind, he joined at 19 or thereabouts so it's taken him 17 years. Talk about "right place at the right time".
DEPs will almost certainly join on the A320 or the 777. There is enough demand from within to fly the -400.
If you join BA tomorrow, you will not get a command for a very long time. Hand Solo is probably about right. Since the new pay deal, a SH command occurs at LGW at a seniority number of approximately 1800, SH LHR at 1400, LH LHR at 1000 (ish). If you join tomorrow, you seniority number will be 3100 ish. As the large retirement bubble ends (plus the advent of new legislation in 2006), your seniority number will not change by very much (probably around 50 places per year). You do the the maths.
Keep in mind that there are a lot of senior guys aged around 30. For example, I flew with a 777 skipper the other week who was 36. He will be a long haul captain for 19 to 26 years, depending on when he retires. Bear in mind, he joined at 19 or thereabouts so it's taken him 17 years. Talk about "right place at the right time".
DEPs will almost certainly join on the A320 or the 777. There is enough demand from within to fly the -400.
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Seeing as there seems to be a number of BA crew replying to this post, I might just hi-jack it! Seems that now the DEP scheme for type-rated pilots has closed, BA have asked Oxford for 24 graduates from the APP scheme. How come BA haven't advertised for non-type rated pilots first, who perhaps have lots of experience just not the required type-rating??
If anyone can give an idea as to whether they might advertise for such great people like myself (!) then please let me know!
Ta!
If anyone can give an idea as to whether they might advertise for such great people like myself (!) then please let me know!
Ta!
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I thought the last DEP recruitment drive widened the criteria to those with a 737 or 757/767 rating as well? BA's priority in recruitment has always been DEPs and CEPs, but as the CEP program is gone they seem to be trying to substitiute it with the Oxford graduates. It'll be interesting to see if they get 24 takers as the new entrants would join on a significantly reduced salary (only slightly greater than CEPs) with the same long time to command. They'd get more cash and a quicker command at Easy! When that source of recruits runs dry then BA will have to consider their position again.
Couldonlyaffordafiver
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I thought the last DEP recruitment drive widened the criteria to those with a 737 or 757/767 rating as well?
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The DEP recruitment asked for anyone with a type rating on either the 737, 757/767 or 777 or the A320.
This application closed yesterday.
Why would they now take guys straight out of training school when they could advertise for crew with so many hours, airline experience but who don't have the necessray type-rating. Am pretty sure there's lots of us who would apply and pay for the type-rating - after all pretty much every other airline asks you to. BA would be no different.
Oh, and am pretty sure that any of the OAT graduates who got offered a job would take it!
This application closed yesterday.
Why would they now take guys straight out of training school when they could advertise for crew with so many hours, airline experience but who don't have the necessray type-rating. Am pretty sure there's lots of us who would apply and pay for the type-rating - after all pretty much every other airline asks you to. BA would be no different.
Oh, and am pretty sure that any of the OAT graduates who got offered a job would take it!
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Why would they now take guys straight out of training school when they could advertise for crew with so many hours, airline experience but who don't have the necessray type-rating.
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The BA recruitment of 24 fATPLs from FTOs (not just Oxford) seems to be primarily aimed at recovering some of those who were dumped from the CEP scheme after 9/11. In other words, they are a known quantity as they've been through all the BA recruiting procedure before.
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In BA's quest to save money, they have been very clever with both CAP manipulation and the posting of pilots from surplus fleets. This has meant that recrutment has been pushed from sept 04 to jan 05.
The response for type rated pilots for 777 and 747 has been poor, therefore expect to see more freeze waivers from the SHAG fleet onto these types circa jan 04. The 737 trainers have been told to expect 6 DEPs per month from spring 05. Well that was last weeks plan
EDIT Seems that the students from OATS/WMU will be destined for SHAG....... just a guess
The response for type rated pilots for 777 and 747 has been poor, therefore expect to see more freeze waivers from the SHAG fleet onto these types circa jan 04. The 737 trainers have been told to expect 6 DEPs per month from spring 05. Well that was last weeks plan
EDIT Seems that the students from OATS/WMU will be destined for SHAG....... just a guess
Last edited by Da Dog; 2nd Oct 2004 at 08:05.
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Hand,
The 737 was going to be in surplus, but now that the bus is not coming to LGW and the leases on the -500's have been extended (poss 73NG's) I leave you to guess the rest... (C/DEP's for LGW)
The 737 was going to be in surplus, but now that the bus is not coming to LGW and the leases on the -500's have been extended (poss 73NG's) I leave you to guess the rest... (C/DEP's for LGW)
