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-   -   Interesting scenario A320 (https://www.pprune.org/tech-log/600138-interesting-scenario-a320.html)

vilas 11th October 2017 11:37

lurkio
It is true They are described as manoeuvre speeds. Airbus 17th Performance and operations conference Dubai gives a detailed description of what they are and how to use them. Extract below:

• Flap maneuvering speeds are recommended to fly the aircraft in a given flaps configuration for:
• Comfort in aircraft maneuver:
• Green Dot, S, F are comfortable
• Particularly in turbulent conditions, or
• For turns at high bank angle
• Flap maneuvering speeds are not limitations:
It is safe to fly between VLS and VMAX (VMO, VLE, VFE) :
The required aerodynamic margin is properly ensured.

lurkio 14th October 2017 17:37

Vilas, thank you for that. You have mentioned this conference a couple of times, where can we have a look at the report or details?
Always good to learn.

vilas 15th October 2017 05:44

Check the other thread I quoted some more info about this. You can check on this: https://www.scribd.com/document/1829...tic-speeds-pdf

lurkio 15th October 2017 14:06

Sincere thanks vilas.

PILOTINHO 16th October 2017 07:42

Low Speed Protection
 

Originally Posted by Bkdoss (Post 9908801)
Hi Charlies Angel. Thanks for your reply. I'm sorry I didn't paraphrase my question correctly. Say you're at 2500 feet when your G/S intercept altitude is 3000. You're on glide and suppose the Go Around altitude is 7000'. Then you're in a mess having retracted flaps to zero.

In this case as the VLS increase the airplane will pitch down to let the IAS increase together with the VLS. Anyway there is also another procedure that airbus use for this kind of scenario, the name is discontinue approach (you simple press approach and the airplane goes back to heading and vertical speed, no flaps retraction anything, then if you need to climb just pull for open climb and that is all).

vilas 16th October 2017 08:55

PILOTINHO
This discussion is going round in circles like a cat trying to catch it's own tail. To recap everything, it started with, we are at 2500ft at CONF1 (below FAP of 3000ft) and ATC gives you speed constraint of 150kts. First, no constraints are given once on the glide. Second, if constraint was given the obvious course is to select CONF2, albeit 500ft higher or 30seconds earlier from the desired height of 2000ft. If you are that fuel conscious delay the gear a bit. Third, If asked to GA just leave the flap as it is since it is retracted purely for MA gradient. Now you are suggesting open climb which is in THRCLB. What happens to the gradient? If it meets then why we GA with MAN TOGA at all? Discontinue approach is an option only if FCU altitude is at or below aircraft altitude. Below FCU altitude standard GA is mandatory.

EcamSurprise 16th October 2017 09:19


First, no constraints are given once on the glide.
ATC giving you speed constraints of 160 to 4, 170 to 5 or 180 to 6 on the glide is a normal daily occurrence in Europe at busy airports. It's either published in the AOI of the airfield or they'll instruct it once you're establishing.

PENKO 16th October 2017 13:40


Originally Posted by aerobat77 (Post 9920741)

who gives toga being at 2500ft and roughly 6-8 miles from the threshold at 160 kts ?

this scenario and the thoughts about it seem to be purely theoretical.

best regards

Unfortunately it is SOP in my company, one of the largest narrow isle Airbus operators, to TOGA our way out of every missed approach.
We used to be able to discontinue an approach (pushing V/S 0 etc), but that was taken away from us when below missed approach altitude. Now it's TOGA, even 6 miles out.

IcePack 16th October 2017 16:30

Aerobat 77. I’d be interest how you are going to get the bus out of the approach phase by doing that.

PENKO 16th October 2017 17:36

Activate the secondary..or enter a new cruise alt.

IcePack 16th October 2017 22:06

Or tap toga :)


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