A-320 Fam. IAE V2527 EA5
TOGA will show up on ECAM if you push that T/L all the way forward but TOGA THRUST may or may not be obtained.

A certain Mach and or altitude will limit first to MCT and then a higher Alt to Climb. ( Mach no longer a factor here)

MO

@manuel

TOGA, MCT or Climb thrust, that wasn't the main concern of my thread. The point is, engine two with its thrustlever in the climb detent will follow the thrust command of thrustlever #1 set to TOGA and running at same rpm like ENG #1.

regards

Catchup,

Must say I don't agree with your second statement.

Here's what I would expect:

Engine two with its thrustlever in the climb detent will just stay or accelerate to its corresponding thrust lever angle position, Climb detent in this case.

Why? Well, selecting #1 T/L to TOGA will make auto thrust inactive, it will go to it's Armed mode making each engine go to its TLA thrust.


#1 can now give you either TOGA, MCT or CLB ( TOGA displayed on the upper ECAM)
Again...#2 will NOT really "Follow" now #1 !! Its just going to it's thrust lever angle thrust.
Could they both go to TOGA thrust ?
NO ( #2 is limited by its detent)
To MCT ?...........NO ( Same as before )
To CLB ?...........Yes, that could be seen and knowing that TOGA will show up on the upper ECAM and that both RPM's could now be seen accelerating to the same RPM is something which can create confusion.

That´s the way I see all this.


Brgds.

Manuel Ortiz

@manuel

BOTH engines follow the TOGA thrust command of TL #1. TL #2 in CL detent.

I've obseved this in flight on A320/319/321 with both, CFM and IAE.

By the way, if you look to the post of "preppy" he/she confirmed it in the SIM.


regards

Have tried it in the sim again and the thing is that there is (obviously) very little difference between the TOGA demand and CLB rating at altitude. On first glance it does indeed look as though the #2 (in your example at CLB notch) goes to TOGA and the thrust rating value on the upper ECAM changes as one would expect to TOGA.

In fact closer inspection of the EPR doughnuts (and finally EPR value) shows that #2 stays at CLB rating and that there is a (albeit) very slight difference between the two engines, #1 being at TOGA.

The way to absolutely confirm this of course is to do it at low level but have not had the chance to do this yet...will report further.

Just tried it out in the SIM and reafirm my posts. Worked as it should.

Preppy, maybe you were kind of in a rush or at high altitude were this all can get misleading. Suggest you check it out again.

Manuel

manuel ortiz & idg & Catchup

OK. I've had another & more careful look at it in the sim. At FL 100, the indications that I saw today are exactly as idg describes in his most recent post.

:)

IDG & Preppy,

Good job !!

Manuel

From A330-300 FCOM:

Best regards

CS-TMX

We know that much, that's not the question.

Flaps One, sorry, do you feel Catchup´s misunderstandings have not been allready covered as to understand the real thing which goes on when he sets one T/L to TOGA with other one at CLB?

Nope.

Just pointing out, that section of the FCOM does not give the answer to this question.

manuel

Yeah, that's the point. One engine follows the thrustlever command of the other engine. That's what me surprised. But it's interesting to see how it is desribed in the manuals and how it is understood by the users.

regards

Catchup,

You still wrote: .... One engine follows the thrustlever command of the other engine.
---

Don´t know what goes in your mind when you say that but believe the statement can be very misleading.

Two guys tried this in the SIM and both had to correct their initial observations so just in case something is still not making sense for you feel free to say it. That´s what this is all about.

Your thread was/is very good food for thoughts.

[email protected]

Dear all

The thing is, the scenario as described, IS NOT covered in the manuals at all.

The FCOM refers to

BOTH levers.........BOTH engines operating
or
1 LEVER ..............1 Engine operating

Buit not 1 LEVER, BOTH engines operating.

So the Sim might be right, but who cares? Why would you want to do it anyway?

F1,

I initially thought as you do...who cares and why would you want to do it anyway?!

Then it occurred to me that it would actually be easy to knock just one of the levers to the TOGA detent...a slip as a hostie passed a meal tray, someone stumbling as they tried to get into the seat etc.

If it was done unintentionally, as we have seen in the sim, apart from the FMA, the indications on the engines are quite symetrical so no obvious clues there. Main thing is that the autothrust is no longer active and the aircraft will accelerate towards Mmo and an overspeed.

Agreed not likely....but possible!

idg
;)

F1

How about also a TOGA take off, high vibration on one Eng and you at some point during your second segment wanting to try lower RPM´s on the shaking one with still TOGA on the other.
The message which I felt was about to be left here was that going i.e. to CLB detent would still provide TOGA RPM´s.

Manuel
X-320

Unfortunetly I don't have the opportunity any more to check it out on the A340. TL one to TOGA and three more engines will follow to what ever thrust.....?

regards

Unless I'm mistaken, TOGA is not normally available above 14,000 ft. I think that one of the changes needed to operate the A319 at Bangda - the only airport that is over 14k methinks - is to mod the FADEC(s) to get TO thrust at this altitude. Who needs TOGA when you're not doing a TO or a GA? So, when you're looking at this in the sim, you just may get different things either side of the 14k line.

@saman

quote

<Who needs TOGA when you're not doing a TO or a GA?>

Again, that's not the point.

Who expects engine two to follow thrust command of thrustlever one? (And vica versa)

That's the point.

regards