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When do we announce V1 & rotate on A320
When do we announce V1 & rotate. Some people say , announce it 5-7 kts before reaching that vspeed .
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5-7 knots..... who is saying that? just announce it as close to the speed as you can. You still have the recognition/response delay from certification up your sleeve For a go or no go decision. personally I prefer an earlier go decision 1 second prior to V1, than no go at V1 + 3 seconds. Both are certified, one gives a lot more margin. |
Originally Posted by adnanaviators
(Post 10332681)
When do we announce V1 & rotate. Some people say , announce it 5-7 kts before reaching that vspeed .
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When do we announce V1 & rotate. Some people say , announce it 5-7 kts before reaching that vspeed . So you know, it is assumed there is a 7 second delay, so when the ac says rotate, it assumes it takes 2 seconds for the pilot to comprehend, 2 seconds to move the controls, and 3 seconds for the ac to respond.... |
Since around 15 years ago, and I seem to recall it came out of either a safety forum related to the rejected takeoff issue or it was from Flight Safety Foundation, it was RECOMMENDED to actually utter the word VEE- ONE at the computed V1 minus 5 knots.This is very good practice and should be applied everywhere.The reasoning is the V1 does not change at all, however the words VEE ONE will be stated by the PM just prior to V1 thus allowing the pilot in the left seat to make his go/no go decision at or before, but not later.Many many times in the simulator I have seen pilots try to reject just slightly after V1 and while most of the time with long runways you get away with this but in the most limiting cases you run the serious risk of an over run/crash.
I am aware of many airlines having this technique in their SOPs but everybody should apply this.Its safer. |
What about calling V1 when at V1, and Vr when at Vr???
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There is no reason to call Vr early, so why would you? |
There is no reason to call Vr early, so why would you? |
I agree with Feather44. Call it when it your at V1. What next, make adjustments for someone's rate of speech? Intonation? Dialect? Cant even believe it Is worthy of any other consideration. To suggest any other option is madness and lunacy and to enter the world of a test pilot.
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What sort of stupid second guessing question is this? The A330 and A350 all have auto V1 callouts and they occur AT V1....not before...... Stop trying to complicate things. just do what Airbus and your training department tells you. |
Personally, as PF, I keep half an eye on the ASI anyway so if anyone forgets to call V1, calls it late or early then I’ve already made my mind up what I’m going to do. And let’s not pretend that actual performance matches exactly that which was calculated so keeping an eye on your speed and runway remaining will allow you to make a judgement call at the time. |
Our SOPs require us to make the call at V1-3kts |
Well the Airbus opinion on the matter (refer the STOP/GO FOBN) which reflects regulatory definitions of V1 being the maximum speed at which a takeoff may be discontinued is: V1 is considered to be the end of the STOP or GO decision-making process. Therefore, at the latest, this decision must be made at V1, so that the Captain can initiate the STOP actions as close to V1 as possible: V1 is indeed a decision/action speed. Having said that, look at the ASI permitted discrepancies from CM1 to CM2 ... |
Originally Posted by Bula
(Post 10332890)
than no go at V1 + 3 seconds. Both are certified, ... |
Why not? If you call V1 at the speed exactly, then you simply do not stop once the words are spoken.
Anyways, I was trained to announce so that the callout is finished by the time we are passing the last action speed (v1). Guess about 1 sec is needed. Any captain is surely looking at his ASI at that stage, there is little practical benefit in digging deeper. -7kt would be definitely non-compliance. AFAIK Lufthansa uses a different call, and I admit to love their thinking. Same time, same use, yet another word. It is one syllable, so the timing becomes irrelevant. It removes ANY ambiguity about the decision/action meaning. They say ........ “go”. Vorsprung durch Expertise, there you have it. In that light a “vee-one” call or this discussion is quite 1950s. |
They say ........ “go”. |
Auto call outs do it at V1. Ive seen a lot of airlines SOPs. Probably 60 or more over the years. Most call AT v1. A couple of years ago some changed to calling x kt before but most have changed back to At. Some changed to "go" some of those have changed back to "V1".
All much of a muchness really. As PF don't reject above V1. Simple. |
Auto call outs do it at V1. |
Might just be me but the V1 call is only part of the go-nogo for me. What defines the go-nogo is the actual indicated speed. If the PM chooses to call V1 early I will assume the ASIs are reading differently for some reason and be prepared for unreliable airspeed. If I am handling I will have the ASI in my scan and know when I am through 80kts, am passing V1, and rotate. If you are dependent on the V1 call or rotate call you will have lost an opportunity to find out that your pitot is blocked..
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Originally Posted by compressor stall
(Post 10333135)
Careful. The 2 seconds acceleration after V1 certification was amended in the early 90s to be replaced with a distance equal to 2 seconds of travel at V1 speed. Not the same. |
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