Depends on the routes. CDG-FRA-CDG-AMS-CDG-MAN (or similar) those extra 5 minutes on the ground do make a lot of difference. For SOF-STR-SOF-KBP-SOF, hell yes why not keep one engine running.

Re cockpit preparation; we used to do everything else, but we would leave the fuel pumps off.

Just before PF called for the Before Start checklist, they would double check the overhead panel for any white lights and put the pumps on then. And start the APU as well, if it had not been started already.

Can't remember if this was our Airline SOPs or just something we did.

Absolutely, i rather do four short domestic sectors than a 5 hour out and back day. Even better if they switch to just two short domestic sectors ;)



Sounds sensible.

Thanks guys. Really eye opening. Very different operating culture on this side of the Atlantic. We’re not usually as concerned about departure time- then again the cockpit crew isn’t usually the time limiting factor in our turns.

I'd bet you won't find an aspect of the job we did not manage to make less rewarding or more demanding.

I wouldn't say that. It's my understanding that you guys don't usually do overnights on narrowbodies. I find that very appealing. At most airlines in the US, that kind of flying is very senior. Many people will bypass upgrading to captain or larger airplane in order to enjoy being home every night.

I also think commuting is less prevalent across the ocean. That's immensely stressful.

We do at Legacies ; rosters are pretty much always 3 to 5 days trips on short - medium haul and the same (obviously) on long haul. LCC's have a different business model with a multi base scheme, that is why they rarely go on layover.

It depends. As sonicbum has mentioned it is quite common in legacy carriers to be on the road for a few days, between 2 and 6 on narrowbodies and up to 15 days on widebodies. But yes, LCCs usually have a multibase strategy and try to plan without layovers as much as possible. And i honestly didn't know the difference until i switched from legacy to lcc. Now i jump on my bike, cycle to the airport, fly a few hours, cycle back and enjoy my own life at home. Whereas before i always had to pack my suitcase, get it to the airport, sleep in horrible hotels if sleeping is possible at all and usually do a shift pattern change during every rotation (early to late or late to early). Of course a fixed roster pattern, which is quite common in LCCs, does help a lot too for quality of life. The difference is of course hub based traffic vs pure point to point connections.

Commuting is not as easy on this side of the atlantic. That said, it is still done a lot. However, as many options include paying for the fun of it there is not only the loss in quality of life to consider, but also the financial implications that effectively reduce your take home pay, even if it is tax deductible.

It takes about a minute of idle operation for the engine to flame out after closing the spar valve or LP fuel valve only (not the HP valve in the engine HMU) because that's how long it takes to suck the remaining fuel out of the fuel line between the LP valve on the rear spar and the fuel pump to the point where LP stage of the fuel pump receives excessive vapor and sends vapor to the HP pump. It takes a similar amount of time on the Boeing airplanes.

Hi Dave,
I agree as to where the fuel comes from - but my real question is: What "replaces" this fuel, in other words: what happens to the space where the fuel is taken from by the engine?
Assuming that the LP valve and the tubing between the LP valve and the HMU has no leaks, there would be a SIGNIFICANT vacuum in the lines...? Wouldn´t that trigger leaks afterwards as the tubes are designed for "outward" pressure, not an internal vacuum?
Regards, J. V.

With the spar valve closed, the main engine fuel pump is basically doing a 'suction feed' of what's in the pipe downstream of the spar valve. So what's filling in the extra space is fuel vapor - in a sense the fuel in the line starts to boil due to the suction of the fuel pump. Eventually the fuel pump cavitates and can't provide sufficient fuel pressure to keep the engine running and it quits. A minute for that to happen is pretty average - although it can go anywhere from about 30 seconds to two minutes depending on the volume of the pipe and the idle fuel flow of the engine.
Oh, and thanks for the kind words.
BTW, I'm a bit surprised that no one has mentioned the possibility of running a fuel pump in an empty tank as a reason to shutdown the fuel pumps. If the fuel tank is nearly empty, and the fuel pumps are merrily running with no fuel actually being pumped, it's possible for the fuel pump to overheat. Now, the fuel pumps are designed not to overheat in that scenario, but just like anything else fuel pumps wear and deteriorate - and have been known to fail in such a way that they do overheat to the point that they become a potential ignition source.
No idea of that's part of the Airbus thinking, but I do know that's why - at least on Boeing's - you're instructed to turn off the center tank fuel pumps as soon as the tank is nearly empty and you get the low pump pressure indications.

Center tanks pumps switch off too on AB without fuel. more explicitly they won't engage in an empty tank.

The issue of the thread is reading the AB FCOM which instructs pilots to turn the fuel pumps on, during cockpit prep, without telling them this is only to be done after the refuelling.

walkaround
 

Dear mates,
Just a quick chat, please, do you know if the Red Beacon Lights are required to be turned ON during walkaround procedures?
My question is that this light could halt ground personal around aircraft safe area.

Never noticed any operator employ this SOP. At my old airline, they wouldn’t approach the plane until the beacon was off. (current airline- they’ll have the cargo door open before you even get a chance to reach for the beacon :ugh:)

More worryingly, this could teach the ground personnel to ignore the beacon light.

The logical question how do we check the beacon has a simple answer: the engineers would on a daily basis. Should it break mid-day, the redcap is sure to tell you and MMEL relief is available.

That itself is a good marker if you really need to verify its operation as a pilot before each flight. Items dispatchable i.a.w. MMEL are those, where another independent failure on the same system won't directly jeopardise the safe outcome. I.e. systems you can afford to lose with 2 levels of protection then remaining.

Simply put, for MMELable items it is OK to wait until they fail, no need to verify beforehand. As a general concept.

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Thanks, FlightDetent. My question was not so clear.
What I was trying to bring to chat is just that: - If Red Beacon lights need to be "ON" during external lights check.
I agree to your answer.

No, it is a maintenance task to check both upper and lower beacon lights. During the external walkaround You check on the lower center fuselage that the beacon light is in place and not damaged.

Appreciate chat, Sonicbum.
My conclusion is that, even though some commercial airlines require external lights check during walk around, totally agree that red beacon and strobe lights should be checked by maintenance or, red cap shall tell us if it's not working.

Many Thanks

Probably applicable to very old MSNs. However, the reasons for doing this are no longer applicable

Big Airways pilots did a combination of both. It was clarified a few years ago. White lights out on preparation.