have seldom read such a load of rubbish. If this reflects current teaching about the design, function and use of automatic braking then everyone needs to go back to school and study how it works in reality |
Blacksheep.
What is the point of saying "this is a load of rubbish?".What is your statement based upon.PLEASE EXPLAIN for the benefit of the rest of us. |
Originally Posted by vilas
(Post 10048397)
But you do use idle reverse at least. In A320 even for that many airlines want you to move to full reverse position and back to idle.
Any chance you know where this habit comes from? Was it once recommended by Airbus? Ta! |
Was it once recommended by Airbus? See page 18. https://www.cockpitseeker.com/wp-con...psWithALAR.pdf "Adhering to the following operational guidelines ensures an optimum braking during the landing roll: • Arming ground spoilers; • Arming autobrake with the most appropriate mode for prevailing conditions (e.g., short runway, low visibility, contaminated runway); • Selecting thrust reversers as soon as possible with maximum reverse thrust (this increases safety on dry and wet runway, and is mandatory on runway contaminated with standing water, slush, snow or ice);" |
: Was it once recommended by Airbus? Affirm Monitoring airspeed indication and returning reverse levers to the reverse idle position at the published indicated airspeed or when airspeed fluctuations occur, whichever come first; Nothing about going to max reverse and then immediately going to idle reverse. |
Originally Posted by Blacksheep
(Post 10075788)
I have seldom read such a load of rubbish. If this reflects current teaching about the design, function and use of automatic braking then everyone needs to go back to school and study how it works in reality.
Let's get onto the over-use of wings and elevators as well. Blatant, in my opinion. |
BS is correct. Let's get onto the over-use of wings and elevators as well. Blatant, in my opinion. |
Personally I think a lot of this thread is a beat up about nothing.
As a professional I would expect that you would assess what is required on the day at a particular airfield, whether you use autobrakes or not, idle reverse or full reverse. On the assessment side of things your decision may come from having operated into an airfield you are very familiar with, or jump into the performance information and work out what you need for airfields you are not that familiar with. If the airline sops are to use autobrakes then arm them, just after touch down and you feel no need for them, then cancel them! To me that is airmanship or is it personship ....... but that is another topic!:) |
that is airmanship or is it personship |
Originally Posted by Slippery_Pete
(Post 10071018)
Said airline that put a 747 into the golf course now has an idle reverse policy!!! It beggars belief.
The current take up rate on my fleet is about half, with the bias heavily toward runways that have it in their own noise policy. I don't have the slightest problem with it on long, dry runways. The issue is thoughtless application of any policy, no matter what it relates to. |
Originally Posted by Offchocks
(Post 10077552)
Personally I think a lot of this thread is a beat up about nothing.
As a professional I would expect that you would assess what is required on the day at a particular airfield, whether you use autobrakes or not, idle reverse or full reverse. On the assessment side of things your decision may come from having operated into an airfield you are very familiar with, or jump into the performance information and work out what you need for airfields you are not that familiar with. If the airline sops are to use autobrakes then arm them, just after touch down and you feel no need for them, then cancel them! To me that is airmanship or is it personship ....... but that is another topic!:) In my home base, I almost never use autobrake as I need to vacate the runway at the far end, and with 3400M runway and with headwind, reverse idle only and no brakes application will bring down the aircraft to taxi speed just before the exit. Works like a charm. :p |
Discretion and common sense has long left the building in a lot of companies...
|
Originally Posted by piratepete
(Post 10075367)
Cent.
I really dont understand this quite common "idle reverse" policy... In many airlines engines are leased or on some form of guaranteed maintenance program. Brakes are simply purchased. So the engine people want idle reverse [and aggressive derates, but that is another subject], and the brake people are very happy to sell brakes. Send a few "technical experts" to advise the airline customers, combined with a thinning out of engineering expertise in flight operations departments in the name of cost savings, and presto -- stupid and rigid SOPs. And more overruns on wet/slippery runways. |
I really dont understand this quite common "idle reverse" policy...
There are many airports in EU where the noise lobby have influence, and the SOP is idle reverse unless you have a safety issue. Someone told them the auto brakes can do the same thing and TR's do not cause less stopping only more noise. That, plus some airline SOP's/philosophy that brake maintenance is cheaper than engine maintenance, and don't forget fuel burn, is what causes some guys to stop thinking when it is required. |
Blacksheep,..go easy on your flock!
But worth remembering,..autobrake is slave to reverse thrust,whilst manual braking has its own mind!......;) |
All times are GMT. The time now is 17:37. |
Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.