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This is my technique for the Descent in the Airbus.
First off I take the platform ALT (lets say 3000ft) and insert the FAF in the PROG page. So I know at this point I need to be at 3000ft With flap 1 or 2. Now I take my current alt, Let's say i'm at FL360. then I subtract 3000ft (platform alt) which leaves me with 33000ft 33*3=99+5(for slow down)=104NM. Now you have to take account for Wind, I use a rough estimate of 30kts of tail will be around 10nm so 33*3+5+10=114nm, So around 114nm from the distance which is on the PROG page I will begin my Descent. Me personally will do this Cal every 3000ft just so I have some situational awareness. Be advised that sometimes you have to think outside the box. Example was yesterday I was flying to Riga, The star there is pretty messed up and you hardly ever fly it ( short cuts or radar vectors) On the ND my arrow was estimating when I should begin my Descent, But something didn't add up. It took into account the whole STAR and was calculating the whole distance, I just looked at the ND saw the Airport was 120nm away, times by 3 should be around fl360 and calculated from there. I am also quite new on the Airbus have 1000hrs on type now, If I can help you anymore please feel free to drop me a PM. |
J.L.Seagull;
No criticism taken. Dagnabit, it's been too long now - I knew I should have looked them all up instead of going by memory! Thank you for your corrections. More important though, you not only know your stuff but your post reinforced all this for WST, the original poster, so well done on both counts. I'm glad you like the advice - I know it works and it keeps one alive. BTW, what you're now calling the 'yo-yo' we called the 'donut', but that term also refers to the TLA Angle indication on the N1 or EPR displays on the ECAM E/WD..., so I dunno what to call it. ;-) best, PJ2 |
Knowing that stars can be cut short should make you allow for that and profile for the shortest possible distance to the runway, not the star. Knowing your airports with experience lets you know if a short turn on is possible. Portland, for instance, for noise abatement always takes you to a long final where the confluence of the rivers converge. Mexico City you don't know what they are going to clear you for.
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managed DES on the 330 ends up looking like ALT x 4, until 10'000.
i normally do 2 calculations. i do alt x 4 for managed des. comfort, no diving. then i do alt x 3 + (1nm/10kts speed over green dot)+(+1nm/1kts tailwind or - 1nm/1kts heawind). the second calculation is for OP DES. no speed brakes. below 10'000 i cross check dist to go x 3 is GS. if at green dot speed you should aim to be below GS by at least a thousand or more to start decelerating to configure. if you are ON profile, and then you get vectors for short cut, your action should be as prompt as possible, speed brakes out ASAP(doesnt necessarily mean full brakes, could be quarter or half or anywhere in between). increasing speed depends on the situation (ATC restrictions, Dist to go). the best is getting to know your destinations ARR proc. some places have a tendency to surprise you by cutting you short on the STAR. everyday! so once you know which ones cut you short, and normally where they cut you to (quick 10 mile final or direct to the FAP). so if flying in to these fields, always aim to be low, or ask for track miles to go when getting vectored. |
A320 Desc
WST
Hey mate, Having read your post - all the 3 times table tips are good and you might want to halve your groundspeed to get your possible ¬desired¬ rate of descent, but this method is only for 3 degree descents. There are other more technical ways of calculating desired rate of descent which usually equate to . . . .half groundspeed. you can use these if you need to consider 3.5 degrees or 5 degrees etc., etc. What I wanted to add to this knowledge-rich thread is that, as you are very likely aware, if you want to go down very fast, you will also end up going forward very fast too . . . this is not usually the case in a light aircraft like a ~Cesspit or a Cherrytree, where, you can bring your speed back to something safe and low and get a nice progressive rate of descent - prob works for other light aircraft too - subject to the aircraft type etc. Much as I like to spread my wings and glide down from above with little forward speed and a high rate of descent, this, in an A320 and prob other med to hvy airliners, is, unfortunately, not possible, in the same way. |
An approach should be quite simple. Plan the descent with idle power from cruise to 1000 ft then power up. We did it every day so it isn't that hard.
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Here's another way to stay updated on your profile progress, one of my colleagues occasionally just looks at the Metric altimeter which is basically indicating a 3:1 profile when your destination is at sea level.
Seagull, that's captain in training, Cheeers! Captain Bubbers, it's only getting worse, my last gig excepted crew members into the RHS (737NG) with 0 time in the real airplane, basic situational techniques not even taught. |
Scarey, isn't it.. I came into the airline as a 4 engine corporate pilot on a Jetstar. I felt lucky to get the job. My 737 was wonderful and with 5500 hours could fly it the first day. I never thought I could get an airline job with just the 5500hrs. I was lucky. I guess the new guys are even luckier.
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Sorry to change the direction of this post. I didn't mean to. I was remembering when I was a new captain on a 737 being handed a brand new FO that obviously had never flown in the Flight Levels before because he told ATC we were climbing to 23,000 ft instead of FL230. He couldn't copy the clearance so I had to. To make matters worse the autopilot was inop when we were dispatched. Returning to LAS at FL350 we had a PD to 240 clearance and at 100 miles seemed to have no interest in starting a descent so asked him when he was going to start down. He said his buddy, the check airman neighbor that got him hired told him how to do it. I said OK, just don't embarass ourselves by having to do a 360. It was 10:00 PM so figured we would have light traffic. On a 10 mile final at 10,000 ft and 340 knots I asked him which way he would like to do his 360? |
Sorry to change the direction of this post. I didn't mean to. I was remembering when I was a new captain on a 737 being handed a brand new FO that obviously had never flown in the Flight Levels before because he told ATC we were climbing to 23,000 ft instead of FL230. He couldn't copy the clearance so I had to. To make matters worse the autopilot was inop when we were dispatched. Returning to LAS at FL350 we had a PD to 240 clearance and at 100 miles seemed to have no interest in starting a descent so asked him when he was going to start down. He said his buddy, the check airman neighbor that got him hired told him how to do it. I said OK, just don't embarass ourselves by having to do a 360. It was 10:00 PM so figured we would have light traffic. On a 10 mile final at 10,000 ft and 340 knots I asked him which way he would like to do his 360? I think airliners have two pilot seats because it takes two competent seasoned pilots to do the job right. Also we don't hire 1500 hr C152 pilots to fly our airliners. The above example slid through the cracks with the help of his buddy. BTW, I got to fly the RJ-85 with some 300 hours light aircraft experience, but the transition from there to the MD-11 was bigger in my opinion, and I had 2000 hours at that time, of wich some 1700 on a jet in busy airline operations. |
Neither will a captain who lets you be at 10.000 feet on a 10 miles final, and who makes you feel embarassed. What does help is knowing what it is like to be new on a jet, and helping and teaching patiently while at the same time making him feel comfortable and showing how teamwork works. 1: Line Captains shouldn't have to be babysitting someone the likes of whom cannot even copy a clearance. 2: Some people even though they have very little experience don't take advice when it's offered. 3: Sometimes the only way to get through to the types mentioned in 2 above is to let them fcuk up (in the right conditions) to get them to see the error of their ways. Also I don't think Bubbers44 was suggesting for one minute that 1500 hours in a light single prepared anyone for a jet, in fact I think he was suggesting the exact opposite. |
[quoteI would suggest if you're planning a descent from FL420 ][/quote]
I'd suggest if you're cruising at FL420 there's a bigger issue! |
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