sorry for the delay, but out flying...

All the aircraft are GPS equipped from 2009.
The airports in question are french of course and mainly dealing with CDG and ORY, however NCE billed us a ticket a few weeks back.

I can confirm that nothing has changed in the way that the aircrafts are operated.

Someone mentioned problems with turning departures and in fact this seems partly the case at ORY when departing rwy 08 with the track deviation being always after you initiate the turn at 6.5 DME.

Is anyone aware of such problems regarding other companies?

Are you getting a noise or track violation?

Off-track.

Interesting to compare with the UK, where you get fined for making too much noise, but just a slap on the wrist for departing from the NPR.

The company is mainly getting noise violations, however tracks have also been violated according to the french.

Dont fly over the red circles! Interesting to note noise and track adventures...if you have a FOQA monitoring program in place, the track and other data will be available there..if not, then the aircraft has little means to store the data.

I hope you don't mean that. :rolleyes:

it could happen! :ok:

I find this "noise" problem quite funny (ha, ha). Back in the days when we had real noise problems, it was caused be the older non by-pass engines on DC9, B727, DC8 BAC 111, etc. In todays world with Hi By-Pass engines there is no longer a "noise" thing. These modern engines are way much quieter than back in the 80s. Any country that is still fussing about noise should have their heads examined. It's just another tax grab. Totally unnecessary. If they keep bugging you, take them to court !!

Tell your your pilots not to fly faster then clean speed before/during the turn then..

There are a few tricky parts in Nice,one being a radial not to overshoot,to avoid flying above rich dudes houses:ok:
Pilot prep is most probably at fault.

LNAV is only as good as the FMc inputs.....ie.if the turn is too wide,restrict the speed and voila....

That image is of the HAL NTK system., not NATS'

I remember years ago , the company I was flying on that time for , started receiving fines in Manchester, I guess when departing from rwy24.The problem stood with track during a turn.

There were no speed limits on that departure,so pilots used to do it nearly 250kts.
Company released a circular restricting the speed to 220 or less and we had never had any violation again.

Stupid? Yes , because the SID should have a speed limit, but it was the way we managed to solve this problem.

A320

Though it shouldn't have been a problem - after all you were flying the SID accurately, at a legal airspeed, weren't you ? :O

Most, if not all, radar-driven track monitoring systems work by comparing your flightpath with an imaginary line on the ground (e.g. in the UK, the edges of the NPRs). Of course a SID is a procedure, not a path, so that clearly the radius of a constant-rate turn, and therefore your track over the ground, can be expected to vary with airspeed.

In theory the width of the NPR swathe is supposed to take into account such variations, but I recall querying with the CAA a couple of years ago some of the saw-tooth edge coordinates of the NPRs in Heathrow's NTK system - the response was that nobody could remember who had originally plotted them ...

RNP departure needed!

It would be interesting to see how they laid out the NPR area, and to which set of standards/criteria...

the different aircraft types, with DTA, will certainly provide a variable track with a turn component..
http://operationsbasednavigation.com...1850091238.jpg