Airbus ECAM Exceptions

[guiones]

John, since 2008 the new OEB implementetion procedure was initited; since then all ECAM Procedures that have to be disregarded are issued as OEB.

Now, they are MSN specific, because it is in one Aircraft it does not mean it applies to another one. It depends on the modification status of your Aircraft.

If you have access to Airbus World there is a very good presentation on the Operational Liaison Meeting 2008.

G

[John Citizen]

John, since 2008 the new OEB implementetion procedure was initited; since then all ECAM Procedures that have to be disregarded are issued as OEB

Then, why, when I was recently flying a 2010 model A320, there was no mention in the OEB's to disregard to the ECAM "FUEL..TK HI TEMP".

This is an ECAM which MUST be disregarded (under certain conditons ie. use of HF) but there is no mention of it in the OEB's

[9.G]

Note mentioned by you isn't to be found in my QRH.

[RunSick]

The note is not on the QRH.
Itīs in the FCOM PRO-ABN-28 "FUEL L(R) OUTER(INNER) TK HI TEMP" as an L2 at the beginning of the procedure.

[Bus Driver Man]

Originally Posted by 9.G

BDM, your previous statement defies the whole purpose of a OEB as it supersedes relevant ECAM action for the MC or MW triggered. In case there's no OEB reminder you're, put it simply, screwed by applying ECAM first. Think hard bout it. That's why when you check list of applicable OEB for MSN you check their OPS status RED or White and most importantly if ECAM is affected. If it states Y means you won't have any clues indicating that this ECAM isn't applicable and misleading but OEB is. Now you tell me, are you still gonna do ECAM actions for the warning applicable to OEB?

Originally Posted by 9.G

OEB REMINDER FUNCTION
...
I surely hope your aircrafts are fitted with this function coz otherwise your philosophie will drive you into the ground.

I think you might have misunderstood my post.
If there are OEBs which affect ECAM, offcourse we will apply the OEB and not the ECAM.

We check OEBs before each flight, and ask confirmation before applying an ECAM.

e.g.
-ECAM warning triggered
-"Check OEB"
-"No OEB"
-"ECAM Actions"

OR

-ECAM warning triggered
-"Check OEB"
-"OEB present"
-"QRH Procedure"



What I said in my post was that if we apply the ECAM (So no OEB), we do the ECAM actions first. And the computer reset according QRH after the ECAM actions and before the reading of the STS.
No stopping of the ECAM actions for a computer reset like your company's procedure (Except for resets asked in the ECAM)

But I agree that actions may be stopped when using common sense for a reset according FCTM.


I just follow whatever the procedure at my company is.







BTW:
Forgot to mention:
Other ECAM affected OEB for one of our AC (V2500 engines):
ENG OIL FILTER CLOG

And offcourse the ENG DUAL FAILURE is also a QRH procedure.

[nnc0]

The OEB reminder function is a FWC feature that has been around for a long time but not many airlines selected the option. A few years ago Airbus decided to then offer the feature to Airlines free of charge in order to facillitate Airbus' own issues with OEB management.

For those who don't know, for any OEBs that require a revised ECAM procedure or status messages, the OEB Reminder function, once activated by inserting the oeb specific reminder code printed on the OEB into the FWC, will overwrite the specific ECAM procedure(s) or status msgs(s) and replace them with an ECAM message that refers the crew to the paper OEB in the QRH. Sounds sweet in theory.

The feature is still Free of charge to purchase but most airlines still do not incorporate OEB reminders into their fleets because of the administration burden the airline maintenance departments have to absord. It's quite a rigmarole to activate the feature and then keep track of which mods are done on which fins and when. It's not easy to manage and from our perspective doesn't really make the pilot's any easier. We activated the feature on our Wide body busses but based on that experience decided not to on our narrow body busses.

The OEB/FWC management process is so convoluted and is so exposed to maintenance errors/process, you can never be sure your ECAM OEB reminder status actually matches the mod status of the aircraft.

Without the reminder function on our narrowbodies, we just do the OEB review at the start of each pairing and we're good. (we never remove the OEB until the OEB fix is accomplished on all fins - other carriers might do it differently) We just open the QRH to the table of contents for the OEBS, Identify the ones there that have the AFFECTS ECAM column checked off and then either confirm we already know it or review any new ones. OEBs don't change very often so it's a painless 20 second exercise and we have no intention of installing the OEB reminder to mess things up..

[9.G]

G, FCTM has been amended for the PNF to response ECAM /OEB complete. It's not an option any more but a mandatory item. Ever heard of spurious ECAM cautions or warnings? Well if you execute ECAM actions on one of those you'll induce unnecessary chain of events seriously complicating your day whereas after a reset you can dedicate your attention to coffee. Nuff said and heard from those SFIs in Toulouse, nice fellas who actually never st foot on real aircraft.

[guiones]

9.G, again, doing a Computer Reset before ECAM/OEB is your invented procedure without backup from the Manufacturer; you must know better and have done more Flight Testing than Airbus. Check the notes on Computer Reset on the latest revision of FCOM, I already noted them here on a previous post.

The disrespect shown by you to our Polish colleague and now to the Factory's SFI (amazing that you know all their qualifications) speaks volumes about your attitude towards colleagues; you better hope you never have to defend your actions against the Manufacturer's Procedures.

G

[9.G]

g, hold your horses buddy, will ya. Let's get the facts straight here. Firstly wannabes are saying ECAM first no matter what then it turns out OEBs first. Then your riding that Note which is applicable btw only on narrow body airbuses not wide bodies. Computer resets philosophy on 320 is different from 330 or 340 all together. That's why finally airbus has incorporated the reset into OEB on 320. Since you're stuck with that 320 note I take it you haven't flown wide bodies. Here's what 330 computer reset says

The following table, lists the various computers for which manual reset capability is provided :

On the overhead RESET panels
On the system controls panel.
For each computer, effects and/or precaution in case of reset (if any) are also listed.
A computer reset has to be attempted when :
recommended by an ECAM procedure or
recommended by a paper procedure.

In all other circumstances, where a failure is suspected or detected, there is no specific recommendations as to whether a reset should be performed or not, except those where a reset is specifically forbidden.
In other words if it's not forbidden and you think it's gonna solve the problem do it.

Before doing any reset that is not asked by the ECAM, or paper check list, consult the QRH to ensure that it is not forbidden.
Manual reset on ground will trigger complete power up test.
The number of reset attempt is not limited.

How many times did you see ENG Bleed fault on the groung or ENG ANTI ICE fault after turning it off. Guess what, NO ECAM Actions here as a simple ON & OFF does the job and yes it reset the microswitch sending a signal to the associated controlling computer. Reseting a computer isn't exclusively done with a CB I'm sure you're aware of that fact. Operations from hot humid regions to colder ones cause all sorts of computer glitches and all the maintenance folks do is power off and on and off you go. Gimme me a break with your disrespect arie it's a well known fact that being a SFI isn't the same as being line commander. No disrespect meant but we're living in different worlds, theoretical one and practical one. Last but not least I won't have any problems justifying my actions to anyone if they're in the best interest of safety. All I tell you is that Airbus isn't all black and white there's lots of grey.

P.S. just to give you a idea of what the differences between the line ops and theory are is the example with LOW FUEL ECAM Warning on 346. Somewhere below the threshold of computer 5 tons or so you'll have a Xmas tree on ECAM asking you to do transfers from the trim tank forward, from the outer tanks to inner and so forth. It's awfully long ECAM actions but guess what completely useless since there's NO fuel left in those tanks anyways. Now you tell me what you do on final? Do the ECAM actions? This example goes to show you that computers are designed by humans and humans do mistakes. Apply common sense and you'll be fine.

[RunSick]

Could somebody please explain the exception and/or alternate procedure for this two listed as ECAM exceptions?

BRAKES HOT (On Ground Only)

FUEL (L or R) WING TANK LO LVL

Thanks.

[USnet]

Mixed info

Hi guys,
if you have a look on this link:
AIRBUS TECHNICAL SITE
He talks a bit about OEBs, Exceptions and things that can make your life (and your SIMs) easier.
Ho it helps.
Seeya