Flaps forty. .. .Well said. .I applaude you <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" />

Female pilots in the cockpit ?????. .. .What year are we ??? I must have overslept !!!!. .I thought we had that one wraped up by now.. .. .I have flown with female pilots both as F/O and now Captain. Some were good, some not so good ( Did I read that somewhere ? ) Some were nice, some others........well, not so nice ! I've seen the same with guys exept some had dandruffs and didn't change to go into the bunk which made it even more unpleasant. Yuk !! . .Thanks to you girls for having given me the opportunity not to talk about money, cars and start talking about feelings only when drowning and sobbing in a glass of beer.. .Don't listen to proffessor Higgins and do not behave like men.. .I've learned great tips about make up and I now walks in high heel shoes without twisting my ankle !! <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" /> . .Sure, some of you are so cute that one might be tempted to be very very very weak and frolick. . .In my view, the sensible thing to do then is not to be rostered with the lady and take your own chances in civies !. .. .Love you girls <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" />. . . . <small>[ 15 March 2002, 17:39: Message edited by: wallabie ]</small>

Wallabie,. .. .No you did not sleep, and yes, the year is 2002. And I`m equally amazed that female/no female/good/or not so good is still a subject among professional pilots.. .. .If I have had "problems" with female flying staff, it would have been with cabin staff rather than with a female cockpit colleague. I had the pleasure of flying with a female first officer for the first time in the mid 80`s. At that time having red fingernails in a cockpit was not, shall we say something you saw every day. Did she do a good job? Off course she did. Did I have male first officers doing not such a good job? Off course I had. Have I worked with female first officers since then? Yes, many. And guess what. They have all been great colleagues. By the way, the first female pilot I flew with is no Director Of Operations for a major carrier. Not bad, for a female. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" />

I am not having a go at cabin crew, and my apologies, they probably have a worse deal.. .I am just stating my side how I have seen it.. .UK is the worst offender for being politically incorrect in the western world and I have worked else where. A bit of power and a handlebar moustache we won the war etc, there is less equallity in the UK than America , NZ ,& AUS. europe I do not know prehaps fill me in. .Its about time women in the Uk in aviation can work as equals not have to be better.

One thing I have noticed, is that many well intentioned male colleagues make the comment that "she's a good operator" as a compliment to female colleagues. . .. .That's fine, but I have rarely (never?) heard them pass comment on male counterparts. It seems to be that a male's competance is taken as given. We will always be held under closer scrutiny and maybe if we have had an off day we are not cut the human slack given to the boys. I don't like it if I don't get teased about an occasional, ahem, "less than perfect landing" as I seems that was just what they expected.

Dear Flaps Forty,. .. .We men, don't discriminate you because we think your gender is inferior to ours, .... .We discriminate you because we know that you are easy victims to a (bad) joke. And there is NOTHING, no NOHTING as funny as having a woman misunderstand it and freak out on you ! ;-) &lt;- For you sensitive people out there,this symbol implies I was making a J-O-K-E There, told the truth, happy now? . .No seriously now. I love flying with the gals and I realy hope they stop thinking they are any less part of the team! Most of the time, the female pilots are taking my humor better than many of the male ones. We have many female pilots in our company and i sincerely hope the percentage will increase in the future! Don't let a few dumbass macho's mess it up. And don't take what guys say too seriously either. It's often a test to see how you react. That or it is a genuine compliment. People who say real insulting stuff have no place in the cockpit, me thinks!. .. .BTW: Eeeer, Belgian beauty, where are you from?. .. .Big Hugg, Icy <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="biggrin.gif" />

At the end of the day you find that the peolpe who are guilty of being "naughty" to or with pilots or crew (male or female) are normally like that with most people in everyday life not just at work. Information on these individuals actions and attitudes DOES NOT GO UNNOTICED and DOES NOT STAY SECRET for long (Especially when the crew get hold of it). We don't let it affect our jobs when we're at work, but when we're downroute these people had better have a good book, or anyone out there ever heard "not sure, I think we're all going to bed", and then bumped into the crew in the bar round the corner? A job in the airlines can be great fun,and you'll earn some decent dosh if your on the right side of the flight deck door. We're a community who work together and look after our own. Step out of line in that community and it can be a very lonely job - think about it - you know who you are. NEVER BITE THE HAND THAT FEEDS YOU - AND NEVER TRY TO GO WHERE YOUR NOT INVITED!

Oleo,. .. .I think you'll find that the term 'a good operator' will be used by pilots who genuinely believe that the PILOT they are refering to is just that - a good operator. If you hear that someone has refered to you as a good operator, take it as a professional complement, Your gender has nothing to do with it.. . <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" />

Striking a Chord,. .. .I don't work for the airlines, but I'm not even remotely surprised by anything you've said. Prejudice against women is alive and well and common, and not just in aviation, but in any profession which until recently was male orientated. My cousin, a very senior tax consultant, has described things similarly. So has a solicitor friend. Until I started learning to fly I'd usually worked in fields where women were common and in the majority, so the attitudes you speak of came as a complete shock to me. Not any more unfortunately.. .. .Guys, there is a difference between jokes made deliberately to wind us up, and genuine prejudice. The first are fine. When I was working for my CPL ground exams, I was warned that one of the chaps teaching the course was known for his sexist comments. As the only woman on the course I found it out soon enough, retaliated in kind, and we had a lot of fun. I told him he had a reputation for being sexist, but that I knew he wasn't; he just pretended to be. "Damn", he said. "You've found me out". He was actually totally respectful. This is very very VERY different from the men who protest that they see women as equals who quite obviously don't, and yes, I can tell the difference; I get a lot of practice.. .. .SAC, as you say, we're "supposed" to put up with it, or pretend it isn't happening. It "isn't done" to complain about it. If you do, most guys are either genuinely surprised, or protest they're not like that at all. Well, some aren't of course - but methinks some doth protest too much. I used to just accept it all, but I'm not sure now that it's the right thing to do. If you do that, things won't change. But if you complain, yes, you're unpopular. I got accused way back on PPRuNe of being "over sensitive about gender" and it upset me at the time. I don't think I care any more what anyone says though; I'm tougher than I used to be.. .. .So SAC, thanks for bringing this up. You're getting misunderstood, but that's only to be expected. Sorry you've had 13 years of hell. I guess we were both born around 100 years too early. Because things will change, but probably rather slowly.