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Virgin Atlantic

Old 10th Jul 2020, 11:15
  #541 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: England
Posts: 8
Chatting to a mate of mine it seems what lordflasheart says is what is happening. Apparently there are pilots with over 15 years of loyal service being made redundant. It is ironic as these are from the 747 and 330 fleets who have been the crews working hardest the last few years with the 787 engine issues. They are now being discriminated against by being on the wrong fleets although I admit Virgin has to put it’s survival first. Also I wondered why Virgin did not consider the airbus mod to remove economy seats from the 350 and 330 and install freight pallets on the floor for easy loading and effective restraint. I gather this almost doubles the freight capacity.
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Old 10th Jul 2020, 13:19
  #542 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: sussex
Posts: 607
Not a lot of high value freight goes through a passenger door .A fully loaded passenger aircraft with cabin freight might just break even.
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Old 10th Jul 2020, 20:43
  #543 (permalink)  
Join Date: Nov 2000
Location: Canada
Posts: 530
AirCanada is operating several now and evidently doing well enough to ask and receive CTA permissions to increase the number of countries they can provide "all cargo" service to.
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Old 13th Jul 2020, 19:32
  #544 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 1999
Location: Europe
Posts: 151
It would appear that a deal has been put together, with great number of moving parts (if this article is accurate).

Very best to all at VS.
We are all very much still in the woods with worse to come.
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Old 14th Jul 2020, 15:59
  #545 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2020
Location: West Midlands
Posts: 1
FT confirming the deal today:

"Shai Weiss, chief executive, told the Financial Times shortly after the deal was signed off on Tuesday that the rescue plan was a “major achievement” that most people “probably thought . . . impossible”. “We’re planning for forever,” said Mr Weiss in his first interview after agreeing the deal. “This is not a plan for another plan . . . our job has been to take a very severe look into 2021 specifically. We funded the plan for the worst case rather than best case as you would expect us to do.” The rescue package will inject about £1.2bn into the airline over the next 18 months, with £200m of cash from Richard Branson’s Virgin Group and £170m of debt funding from US hedge fund Davidson Kempner Capital Management. It will also include £400m of fee deferrals from shareholders, Virgin Group and Delta Air Lines, which owns 49 per cent, as well as agreements with credit card companies to unlock cash and a cost-saving programme that will involve 3,550 job cuts"
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Old 14th Jul 2020, 17:53
  #546 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 2018
Location: UK
Posts: 83
Aussieizborn....The 747 guys were flying less than the other fleets so your info is flawed, sorry.
Also edited to add, I think CABUS beneath me means flawed not floored?

Last edited by srjumbo747; 15th Jul 2020 at 11:00. Reason: Spelling
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Old 14th Jul 2020, 18:38
  #547 (permalink)  
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: 30W
Age: 37
Posts: 169
I would suggest that small part of the message MAY be floored, but the rest remains solid.
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Old 14th Jul 2020, 19:22
  #548 (permalink)  
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 799
GKOC - I gather Virgin Atlantic is trying to keep hold of all their B787 and A350 pilots and dump as many of the others (747 and A330) as they can get away with, using a legally questionable de-merit matrix. However a number of 787 and A350 pilots may have been put on some kind of furlough which is apparently why these 'temporary and unforeseen' shortages have occurred.

All according to a couple of tame but somewhat disaffected VS A330 pilots in our village, who had had a couple of beers or two when this was being discussed and thought they were rather poorly placed. One thinks he is going to lose his command, the other, his job.

I don't think there are many 787s still 'AOG for engines' anywhere, though apparently there are some additional Rolls Royce 'mitigations' still working their way through the system.

Stormin' - My understanding is that 'pax aircraft being used as freighters' originated with bringing vast quantities of PPE (in manually-loaded seat-bags and cardboard boxes) from Asia, which the folks thought was going straight to save the NHS. That may be the case now, but it was certainly not at the time of Robert Jenrick's 84 tonnes of whimpering Turkish Delight in mid-April.

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Old 1st Aug 2020, 13:48
  #549 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Courchevel
Posts: 825
Looks like the UK CAA are calling time on Virgin Atlantic not coughing up refunds. Let's face it they're not the only ones who've been at this, I reckon nearly all airlines have been practicing holding the money.

Count von Altibar is offline  
Old 1st Aug 2020, 15:14
  #550 (permalink)  
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Often in Jersey, but mainly in the past.
Age: 76
Posts: 5,994
As a “compare and contrast“, we had a BA Holidays booking to Antigua for next month.
27 Jul ... ANU flight cancelled (major l/h rescheduling)
28 Jul ... BA Hols email saying they would be refunding total cost (flights + hotel) but might take a week or so due to demand.
29 Jul ... My Amex account credited with the full refund.

If the much-criticised BA and its creaky IT setup can achieve that, I have zero sympathy for VS.
BTW, that’s our 3rd painless and swift BA cancellation refund since C-19 kicked off.
MPN11 is offline  
Old 1st Aug 2020, 16:40
  #551 (permalink)  
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: A little South of North
Posts: 190
Originally Posted by stormin norman View Post
Not a lot of high value freight goes through a passenger door .A fully loaded passenger aircraft with cabin freight might just break even.
But I guess that currently most airlines would settle for "break even".
Pistonprop is online now  
Old 1st Aug 2020, 17:53
  #552 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 1999
Location: Runcorn,Cheshire,England
Posts: 76
Jet2 refund back In account within 48hours of the holiday being cancelled.
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Old 2nd Aug 2020, 02:53
  #553 (permalink)  
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: sussex
Posts: 607
If the refund fiasco is true, then it sounds like financially, there looking into the abyss.
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Old 2nd Aug 2020, 10:09
  #554 (permalink)  
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Middle East
Posts: 398
Lufthansa told me up to three months to refund when they cancelled my FRA-DMM flight in early March. Got fed up by mid-June and did a credit card chargeback so the money was back in my account within 48 hours.

My parents had to resort to chargebacks to get a refund from EZY who charged them again IN FULL for rescheduling their cancelled flights and were impossible to contact about refunding the original fares. Very poor show.
reverserunlocked is offline  
Old 2nd Aug 2020, 10:38
  #555 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 1999
Location: Europe
Posts: 151
Still no sign of 2019 Accounts.
Maxfli is offline  
Old 4th Aug 2020, 14:07
  #556 (permalink)  
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: UK
Posts: 285
Deal not complete yet and cash reserves running low.

fruitbat is offline  
Old 4th Aug 2020, 20:40
  #557 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Rockytop, Tennessee, USA
Posts: 5,835
Reports of a bankruptcy filing in New York.

Richard Branson's Virgin Atlantic is the second Virgin airline to declare bankruptcy as pandemic rips apart the industryDavid Slotnick
37 minutes ago
  • Richard Branson's Virgin Atlantic airline filed for Chapter 15 bankruptcy in New York on Tuesday.
  • The airline, which only flies long-haul international routes, suspended passenger flights in April due to the coronavirus pandemic. It resumed flying passengers in July, despite little demand for international travel.
  • The airline, which is 49% owned by Delta, has cut more than 3,000 jobs, retired some planes, and closed bases to cut costs during the pandemic.

More on Chapter 15 bankruptcy for the sea lawyers here:


Last edited by Airbubba; 4th Aug 2020 at 21:07.
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Old 4th Aug 2020, 21:11
  #558 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: North West
Posts: 44
Business as usual

Hopefully this is just precautionary but at TCX we were told it was business as usual and perfectly normal when they did this 2 weeks before they went into administration.
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Old 4th Aug 2020, 21:14
  #559 (permalink)  
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Rockytop, Tennessee, USA
Posts: 5,835
From my past experience at Pan Am and other places 'business as usual' = 'the end is near'.

Airbubba is online now  
Old 4th Aug 2020, 22:52
  #560 (permalink)  
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Courchevel
Posts: 825
I just cannot see a way out of this for Virgin Atlantic. Heavily weighted on the North American market coupled with long haul only operations and a worsening global pandemic crisis. Who's going to book seats now this news is out, very sad times indeed.


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