VS24 Squawking 7700 Emergency into LHR Today
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VS24 Squawking 7700 Emergency into LHR Today
VS24/15 Oct 2011 LAX/LHR squawked 7700 over Scotland today and landed at LHR.
Just wondering what the problem was? Med Emergency or what?
Just curious!
Just wondering what the problem was? Med Emergency or what?
Just curious!
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Not affecting flight safety then cannot squawk 7700?
7700 can be a 'Mayday' or a less serious 'Pan' and, if I recall the interpretation correctly, Mayday is for when life is at imminent risk and Pan for when life is not at imminent risk ... nothing to do, neccessarily, with the condition of the aircraft.
One middle of the night, many, many a year ago, 'we' were controlling a yellow painted helicopter from Chivenor to Northolt, the aircraft was fully serviceable however the on-board baby's incubator was running short on oxygen supply thus the aircraft needed a direct track to Northolt which would involve crossing thru LHR's zone at an altitude of 1500'.
Traffic simply wasn't allowed to do this so we instructed the aircraft to declare a Mayday, to squawk 7700, and to call D&D on 121.5/243.0 .... but there was not, at any time, a problem with 'flight safety'!
7700 can be a 'Mayday' or a less serious 'Pan' and, if I recall the interpretation correctly, Mayday is for when life is at imminent risk and Pan for when life is not at imminent risk ... nothing to do, neccessarily, with the condition of the aircraft.
One middle of the night, many, many a year ago, 'we' were controlling a yellow painted helicopter from Chivenor to Northolt, the aircraft was fully serviceable however the on-board baby's incubator was running short on oxygen supply thus the aircraft needed a direct track to Northolt which would involve crossing thru LHR's zone at an altitude of 1500'.
Traffic simply wasn't allowed to do this so we instructed the aircraft to declare a Mayday, to squawk 7700, and to call D&D on 121.5/243.0 .... but there was not, at any time, a problem with 'flight safety'!
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Chris, If life is at risk you have every authority to declare a mayday. Just because the aircraft is flyable and everyone else is fine does not mean the poor person requiring urgent admittance to a hospital shouldn't have others going out of their way to help. Do you pull over if an ambulance comes screaming behind to let them past? Same scenario here, really. An aircraft with someone close to death on it deserves a higher priority of handling than one which does not. If life is at risk it should be a MAYDAY not a PAN PAN.
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A few funnies on here. It's not at all unlikely that a medical emergency will squawk 7700. As 10W says, it warns everyone of what's happening.
As far as crossing the London Control Zone at 1500ft from Chivenor-Northolt, I see no problems.....? Instead of all the excitement, a quick call to Heathrow Approach would have been all that was necessary..
As far as crossing the London Control Zone at 1500ft from Chivenor-Northolt, I see no problems.....? Instead of all the excitement, a quick call to Heathrow Approach would have been all that was necessary..
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HD,
It was at something like 3 o'clock of a morning.
'We' were in Lyneham tower, Cotswold Radar was closed at the time so there was nobody else along the route except 'us'.
As a Master Diversion Airfield we had a red 'bat phone' straight thru to D&D at West Drayton and we were on the bat phone quite a bit that night, I recall that all other possibilities had drawn blanks thus it was D&D that instructed us to instruct the 'Mayday'.
It was at something like 3 o'clock of a morning.
'We' were in Lyneham tower, Cotswold Radar was closed at the time so there was nobody else along the route except 'us'.
As a Master Diversion Airfield we had a red 'bat phone' straight thru to D&D at West Drayton and we were on the bat phone quite a bit that night, I recall that all other possibilities had drawn blanks thus it was D&D that instructed us to instruct the 'Mayday'.
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Thanks 10W for the info..
Source was Flight Radar24 App on iPad. It now can alert subscribers to emergency squawks and direct them to emergency traffic within it's coverage.
Source was Flight Radar24 App on iPad. It now can alert subscribers to emergency squawks and direct them to emergency traffic within it's coverage.
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And it's 'SICK' that there are websites out there generating revenue from person(s) being in distress.
Imagine if your parents, wife, children, were on VS24, would you prefer it was splattered all over the internet that your loved ones are being recorded as being in distress whilst your underpants may be turning brown?
Imagine if your parents, wife, children, were on VS24, would you prefer it was splattered all over the internet that your loved ones are being recorded as being in distress whilst your underpants may be turning brown?
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Gussett,
Such websites message people that there is an emergency taking place, that a distress squawk is being squawked, for all the sicko's to log on to said websites whilst said websites run commercial advertising under the noses of said sicko's from which said websites generate revenue from said commercial advertising.
Rocket science or .....
Such websites message people that there is an emergency taking place, that a distress squawk is being squawked, for all the sicko's to log on to said websites whilst said websites run commercial advertising under the noses of said sicko's from which said websites generate revenue from said commercial advertising.
Rocket science or .....
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What a load of tosh - it is hardly a website completely committed to making money from folk declaring an emergency. If spotters want to watch the track of a 7700 squawk then who gives a toss? I'd be more concerned about watching 7500s.
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What about us all been blessed to aviate in countries that ensure open and transparent access to such information. Ensures that we can all learn every possible lesson, right?
Perhaps your rage could be better directed, for example the sensationalised media coverage that often results from minor incidents.
Perhaps your rage could be better directed, for example the sensationalised media coverage that often results from minor incidents.
Whoops, I should have had more sense than to rush into a sweeping statement, and I accept most of your responses. There are, of course, two reasons for an aircraft deliberately squawking A7700: decision by the crew, and crew response to advice from ATC. I overlooked the latter when considering the medical emergency scenario.
I'm years out of date, but my feeling is that a crew would generally only squawk A7700 of their own volition if declaring a MAYDAY. My old books state this is when the flight is subject to "a condition of being threatened by serious and/or imminent danger and of requiring immediate assistance." This is defined as a Distress Message, and I don't think it would be appropriate for a medical emergency (unless it affected the conduct of the flight, as it might in the case of a flight-crew incapacitation).
The lower state of emergency, defined as an Urgency Message, is issued in the form of a "PAN" message when the flight is subject, my books state, to "a condition of the safety of an aircraft or of some person on board or within sight, but which does not require immediate assistance." Most medical emergencies fall into the PAN category, in my opinion. In this case, unless procedures have changed, I don't think the crew would select A7700 unless asked to do so by ATC. If they do, so much the better, and the flight can be assured of red-carpet treatment.
We have no details of VS24's problem. Speaking generally, however: if the FQIC (fuel-quantity-indication computer) had suddenly showed, for example, that the estimated fuel remaining constituted less than 30 mins endurance, any crew would squawk A7700 and declare a MAYDAY immediately. If the FMC (flight management computer), using suddenly-changed information from the FQIC, calculated less than 30 mins endurance over the planned destination, this would also constitute an emergency. Whether the crew would declare a MAYDAY or a PAN would depend on the precise circumstances and the judgement of the crew. Having said that, it is much better to declare a MAYDAY and subsequently downgrade the emergency to a PAN than vice-versa.
I'm years out of date, but my feeling is that a crew would generally only squawk A7700 of their own volition if declaring a MAYDAY. My old books state this is when the flight is subject to "a condition of being threatened by serious and/or imminent danger and of requiring immediate assistance." This is defined as a Distress Message, and I don't think it would be appropriate for a medical emergency (unless it affected the conduct of the flight, as it might in the case of a flight-crew incapacitation).
The lower state of emergency, defined as an Urgency Message, is issued in the form of a "PAN" message when the flight is subject, my books state, to "a condition of the safety of an aircraft or of some person on board or within sight, but which does not require immediate assistance." Most medical emergencies fall into the PAN category, in my opinion. In this case, unless procedures have changed, I don't think the crew would select A7700 unless asked to do so by ATC. If they do, so much the better, and the flight can be assured of red-carpet treatment.
We have no details of VS24's problem. Speaking generally, however: if the FQIC (fuel-quantity-indication computer) had suddenly showed, for example, that the estimated fuel remaining constituted less than 30 mins endurance, any crew would squawk A7700 and declare a MAYDAY immediately. If the FMC (flight management computer), using suddenly-changed information from the FQIC, calculated less than 30 mins endurance over the planned destination, this would also constitute an emergency. Whether the crew would declare a MAYDAY or a PAN would depend on the precise circumstances and the judgement of the crew. Having said that, it is much better to declare a MAYDAY and subsequently downgrade the emergency to a PAN than vice-versa.
So am I correct in my understanding - 'Spotters' use obscure (to the general public) aircraft tracking web sites, they spot a squawk that might have some emergency implication, they then post on obscure (to the general public) pilot & flying enthusiast web sites & then the families of passengers on that flight are scared by these sick purveyors of filth - because they happen to be reading these web sites - whilst their loved ones are in the air on flight numbers they know about?
Obvious innit.
Obvious innit.
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<<for example the sensationalised media coverage that often results from minor incidents. >>
Yep - because people come on forums like this and report the most trivial matters which sometimes get blown out of proportion. I have an SBS box which provides a sort of "radar" display but the last thing I would do if I saw something unusual would be to publish it on here.
Yep - because people come on forums like this and report the most trivial matters which sometimes get blown out of proportion. I have an SBS box which provides a sort of "radar" display but the last thing I would do if I saw something unusual would be to publish it on here.
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My initial post was after the aircraft had landed. On purpose! Therefore, no fear to relatives of those on-board was caused!
Jeez..!
Jeez..!
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Foggy
I remember being on duty when that "yellow chopper" went by. I gave it permision to land at Heathrow but because of the night rules I couldnt let it take off again until 06:01 as there was no medical emergency on board.
I think it ended going to hyde park or somewhere similar.
I remember being on duty when that "yellow chopper" went by. I gave it permision to land at Heathrow but because of the night rules I couldnt let it take off again until 06:01 as there was no medical emergency on board.
I think it ended going to hyde park or somewhere similar.