Adria Airways Rombac 1-11
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Newcastle 'came alive' at a certain point in the mid-60s when, from nowhere seemingly, appeared regular DC-6 operations by Adria and a couple of Spanish operators. Up until that moment, registrations other than G- had been an extreme rarity and so had been visitors of that size.
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Newcastle was taking DC6s while the runway was still shorter (5700’), there was a weekly Cunard Eagle service MAN-NCL-Bergen (worth getting out of bed early on a Sunday to see). Plus there had already been a fledgling IT operation to (?) Palma with Connies of Skyways and Euravia (even more worth seeing). I’m struggling to remember whether BKS upgraded the London service from Ambassadors to Brits before or after the runway extension, I’m pretty sure the Brits were OK with the shorter distance. I can’t pinpoint when the foreign DC6s began to arrive. As a spotter, the long airfield closure for the runway work blunted my enthusiasm, by the time it opened again I had other interests. I did go back for a while, but much less frequently.
It was a great place to spot. There was a small waving-off area on the apron, virtually under the wings of the aircraft. If anything interesting came by you could go to the Apron Manager’s office and ask if you could go out for a closer look and if there was nothing scheduled to move he’d probably let you. First stop on arrival was to visit the fire hut where they had a board with the day’s expected movements chalked up. If anything recognisably civilian overflew you could go up to the tower to ask if they had a registration. And the spotters were more than welcome in the terminal, where we got half-price tea and coffee – on the understanding that we would vacate when passengers started arriving in numbers for their departures.
The downside was of course that there was very little traffic. Breaks of an hour or more between movements were not unusual, nor were days when you didn’t ‘cop’ anything at all, or went home with one solitary aircraft to underline in your CAM. I spent a lot of this time reflecting on what made air transport tick – no bad thing, career-wise.
There used to be a terrific website, connected with the local branch of Air-Britain, where someone (called Glenn I think) who had graduated from being a spotter to a job in the Tower, posted a visitors’ log, month-by-month throughout the early and mid 60s. I could recollect the majority of things he recorded. I must have known him – the spotters’ community was very small – but I can’t picture who it was.
It was a great place to spot. There was a small waving-off area on the apron, virtually under the wings of the aircraft. If anything interesting came by you could go to the Apron Manager’s office and ask if you could go out for a closer look and if there was nothing scheduled to move he’d probably let you. First stop on arrival was to visit the fire hut where they had a board with the day’s expected movements chalked up. If anything recognisably civilian overflew you could go up to the tower to ask if they had a registration. And the spotters were more than welcome in the terminal, where we got half-price tea and coffee – on the understanding that we would vacate when passengers started arriving in numbers for their departures.
The downside was of course that there was very little traffic. Breaks of an hour or more between movements were not unusual, nor were days when you didn’t ‘cop’ anything at all, or went home with one solitary aircraft to underline in your CAM. I spent a lot of this time reflecting on what made air transport tick – no bad thing, career-wise.
There used to be a terrific website, connected with the local branch of Air-Britain, where someone (called Glenn I think) who had graduated from being a spotter to a job in the Tower, posted a visitors’ log, month-by-month throughout the early and mid 60s. I could recollect the majority of things he recorded. I must have known him – the spotters’ community was very small – but I can’t picture who it was.
Thread Starter
I hope there comes a time when Slovenia and Croatia make a large-scale return to the UK holiday market. It seems now that destinations like Ljubljana, Pula, Rijeka, Dubrovnik and Split are largely names from from the past for many UK regional airports. Croatian and Adria fly into Manchester and Dubrovnik and Split are summer routes for Jet2 but the mass Saturday to Monday operations are a memory.
Ljubljana may be a good bet once again before too long. Skiing at Kranjska Gora in the winter, walking and mountaineering in the summer. Happy days. Would be nice to see Aviogenex back again but as they're Serbian based with a single, elderly 737-200 I'm not that hopeful !
Ljubljana may be a good bet once again before too long. Skiing at Kranjska Gora in the winter, walking and mountaineering in the summer. Happy days. Would be nice to see Aviogenex back again but as they're Serbian based with a single, elderly 737-200 I'm not that hopeful !
Thread Starter
Six years later and Leeds Bradford still doesn't have any flights to Ljubljana. The classic Croatian trio of Pula, Split and Dubrovnik are still operated in the summer by Jet2 though. I wonder if Ljubljana's location in the Julian Alps limits its appeal to the point it wouldn't make enough brass ?
Do easyJet and Adria still operate to the UK from Ljubljana ?
Do easyJet and Adria still operate to the UK from Ljubljana ?
interesting post
yugotours was the UK's primary charter tour company for yugoslavia in the 70's until the war
as mentioned inex adria and aviogenex plus a/c chartered from JAT were seen in vast numbers at almost every UK airport each summer
flights were mainly to Pula Split LJU and Dubrovnik
Tivat was just open and I think some of the UK charter airlines flew in there - I do not recall yugotours going there
some other UK tour companies using BUA/BCAL (Horizon and 4S) Laker (Lord Bros, arrowsmith) Enterprise/Flair (BEA airtours) and BY (thomson) flew to DBV LJU and PUY certainly in the 70's onwards
I flew LGW-DBV in summer 72 and went out on a Horizon flight should have been a BCAL 1-11 500 but we got a Northeast trident out and the wardair 727 home 2 weeks later
LJU sadly saw a BY Britannia G-ANBB crash on App there in summer 1966 on a Thomson Skytours flight from LTN and in 1971 an aviogenex TU-134A crashed and overturned on landing in a bad storm at Krk (Rijeka) - a yugotours holiday flight from Gatwick
LJU was a busy destination for UK work from the 1960's as many pax then coached over to Venice or went on coach tours
Dan Air and BIA both chartered the Tarom 1-11 500's for various seasonal IT work often sending them down to the Greek islands
i flew ATH-LGW on G-TARO summer 1985 and it took over 4h 45m with the other later departing DA flights 727's overtaking us
the holiday market in most former yugoslavian countries i think is booming - many loco's have moved in
yugotours was the UK's primary charter tour company for yugoslavia in the 70's until the war
as mentioned inex adria and aviogenex plus a/c chartered from JAT were seen in vast numbers at almost every UK airport each summer
flights were mainly to Pula Split LJU and Dubrovnik
Tivat was just open and I think some of the UK charter airlines flew in there - I do not recall yugotours going there
some other UK tour companies using BUA/BCAL (Horizon and 4S) Laker (Lord Bros, arrowsmith) Enterprise/Flair (BEA airtours) and BY (thomson) flew to DBV LJU and PUY certainly in the 70's onwards
I flew LGW-DBV in summer 72 and went out on a Horizon flight should have been a BCAL 1-11 500 but we got a Northeast trident out and the wardair 727 home 2 weeks later
LJU sadly saw a BY Britannia G-ANBB crash on App there in summer 1966 on a Thomson Skytours flight from LTN and in 1971 an aviogenex TU-134A crashed and overturned on landing in a bad storm at Krk (Rijeka) - a yugotours holiday flight from Gatwick
LJU was a busy destination for UK work from the 1960's as many pax then coached over to Venice or went on coach tours
Dan Air and BIA both chartered the Tarom 1-11 500's for various seasonal IT work often sending them down to the Greek islands
i flew ATH-LGW on G-TARO summer 1985 and it took over 4h 45m with the other later departing DA flights 727's overtaking us
the holiday market in most former yugoslavian countries i think is booming - many loco's have moved in
Last edited by rog747; 10th Jul 2018 at 18:17.
In the mid 80s, the Thomson Holidays series to Yugoslavia (from Luton anyway) were operated by Inex-Adria (as it was then) using a mix of DC9-30s, Dc9-50 and MD80s. I flew to Pula in 1986, out on DC9-30 and back on a DC9-50.
Yugotours holidays at the time were operated by Aviogenex, using mainly B737s. Prior to the 737s one got to go on a TU134!
Yugotours holidays at the time were operated by Aviogenex, using mainly B737s. Prior to the 737s one got to go on a TU134!
ah interesting - maybe yugotours shifted much work from inex adria due to their accident record? their last big one (accident) was the loss of their brand new MD81 in corsica 1981/82?
not all their fault - mainly bad luck on several -
although yugotours flights suffered 2 accidents
one with inex adria (mid-air with BEA Trident 3 going from SPU to Germany) and the aviogenex Krk crash from LGW I mentioned above.
not all their fault - mainly bad luck on several -
although yugotours flights suffered 2 accidents
one with inex adria (mid-air with BEA Trident 3 going from SPU to Germany) and the aviogenex Krk crash from LGW I mentioned above.
Thread Starter
When I flew to Ljubljana in 1987 I was unaware that Adria had a questionable safety record by and large, although I did know about the Trident collision eleven years previously. A moot point anyway, as the flights were effectively operated by Tarom (their aircraft and flight crew) with just the aircraft re-registered in Yugoslavia for the summer season. I do wonder if the intermediate approach to Ljubljana is not for the faint hearted ? I remember our Rombac 1-11, YU-ANS, turning violently to the left about five minutes from touchdown. God knows what we were avoiding but we lived to tell the tale and a fortnight later, 'NS was sitting on the apron at Ljubljana waiting to bring us home.
Perhaps even Jet2's smallest aircraft, the 737-300, is too big for a weekly Ljubljana service. A FlyBe or Stobart Embraer might be better suited.
Perhaps even Jet2's smallest aircraft, the 737-300, is too big for a weekly Ljubljana service. A FlyBe or Stobart Embraer might be better suited.
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Just stumbled across this thread due to recent activity.
As WHBM mentioned in a ten year old post, the Tarom crews English wasn't always up to the standard that the U.K. CAA required.
In the summer of 1987, BIA had a Tarom 1-11 on lease which got grounded due to the language problems.
The replacement was a Middle East Airlines Boeing 707.
Turned out to be the only 707 I ever flew on when I managed to scrounge a return trip Gatwick to Naples from the tour rep for a nominal fee.
As WHBM mentioned in a ten year old post, the Tarom crews English wasn't always up to the standard that the U.K. CAA required.
In the summer of 1987, BIA had a Tarom 1-11 on lease which got grounded due to the language problems.
The replacement was a Middle East Airlines Boeing 707.
Turned out to be the only 707 I ever flew on when I managed to scrounge a return trip Gatwick to Naples from the tour rep for a nominal fee.
Thread Starter
I often used to monitor the LBA Airbands when the Adria/Tarom 1-11 was approaching and I don't remember any language difficulties at all. The pilots spoke English with a distinctive Eastern European accent but were every bit as clear as the Wardair 747 pilots who used to arrive at LBA at much the same time on Monday morning. On the other hand, Tarom had only to satisfy the Yugoslav authorities of their aviation English competence, not the CAA.
the problem surfaced again in the late 90's iirc about UK tour operators and seat brokers chartering eastern european airlines at that time for seasonal work due to the decline of small or niche UK charter airlines -
we had lost AE CKT BIA FCA IEA Airways Intl Cymru Amber Air Ambassadair Leisure Intl BWA and DA all in the 90's and we were left with just the biggies BY AIH and JMC and family owned MON...
no small ones at all - and now we have none really as MON is gone.
the EU stepped in as iirc they tried to use JAT and possibly aviogenex after the Yugo war as they had spare a/c sitting around
and I think viking and/or goldcrest brought them into the UK one summer and the CAA and the EU banned them - I seem to think that is when transwede got a toe hold into ops out of LGW
now all the niche airlines operating in the UK are pretty much now EU or eastern european or turkish such as Germania ASL Volotea Albastar Small Planet Freebird smartlynx etc - we have no niche carriers left except maybe Titan and Flybe who have the odd own IT charters for corsica menorca skiathos or skiing
ironically BA now for past few years operate a large IT charter program at weekends from LHR and BACF with the EMB fleet from the provincials in england IOM and Scotland
we had lost AE CKT BIA FCA IEA Airways Intl Cymru Amber Air Ambassadair Leisure Intl BWA and DA all in the 90's and we were left with just the biggies BY AIH and JMC and family owned MON...
no small ones at all - and now we have none really as MON is gone.
the EU stepped in as iirc they tried to use JAT and possibly aviogenex after the Yugo war as they had spare a/c sitting around
and I think viking and/or goldcrest brought them into the UK one summer and the CAA and the EU banned them - I seem to think that is when transwede got a toe hold into ops out of LGW
now all the niche airlines operating in the UK are pretty much now EU or eastern european or turkish such as Germania ASL Volotea Albastar Small Planet Freebird smartlynx etc - we have no niche carriers left except maybe Titan and Flybe who have the odd own IT charters for corsica menorca skiathos or skiing
ironically BA now for past few years operate a large IT charter program at weekends from LHR and BACF with the EMB fleet from the provincials in england IOM and Scotland
jetstream7
no menton that on records that BY leased this a/c but I guess they did do subs from you guys comments
It was fully leased to KT in 1984
no menton that on records that BY leased this a/c but I guess they did do subs from you guys comments
It was fully leased to KT in 1984
NCL's IT 1960's expansion was very much due to BKS getting Brits then 2 new Tridents in 1969 and Airways holidays having large holiday programmes from there plus also MME and LBA (viscounts only for Leeds though)
LJU today has quite a few Easy jet flights a week from LTN LGW STN and MAN plus from germany too
LJU today has quite a few Easy jet flights a week from LTN LGW STN and MAN plus from germany too
Thread Starter
It's encouraging to read that easyJet fly into Ljubljana from a few UK airports. What is less encouraging is that Ryanair, Jet2 et al aren't doing likewise, unless I'm mistaken. Wizz to Doncaster may be a future possibility, assuming an Airbus narrowbody isn't too big. Ljubljana could well be something of a niche destination without the clout of its Croatian cousins.
LJU has a 10000 ft runway
Thread Starter
Yes, the runway is very adequate. I was trying to suggest that Ljubljana city and the lakes and mountains may not have the touristy pull of the Adriatic coast destinations and would thus be more suited to small regional jets. Adria Airways themselves used to fly CRJ aircraft; I don't know if they still do.
As far as I remember, PH-TVP didn't receive any Britannia titles, logos etc. It was simply white with Transavia titles and its registration. Perhaps it was a hurriedly-arranged sub-charter, giving little time to 'Britanniafy' the aircraft. As it stayed on the Dutch register, it may not have been documented by the UK CAA. That's my theory anyway. The fact that it was the only 737 to do the PUY-LBA-PUY rotation in 1983 suggests it was brought in for specific routes only, to keep life simple !
As far as I remember, PH-TVP didn't receive any Britannia titles, logos etc. It was simply white with Transavia titles and its registration. Perhaps it was a hurriedly-arranged sub-charter, giving little time to 'Britanniafy' the aircraft. As it stayed on the Dutch register, it may not have been documented by the UK CAA. That's my theory anyway. The fact that it was the only 737 to do the PUY-LBA-PUY rotation in 1983 suggests it was brought in for specific routes only, to keep life simple !
Last edited by Mooncrest; 11th Jul 2018 at 21:10.
the transavia 737 was an ADV model so maybe BY used it subbing it for LBA flights due to the short runway if it had -15 or -17 engines
BY did have their own ADV models by the early 80's afaik but they may have all been being used elsewhere - JMK JTR and JSI spring to mind really needing ADV models at the time
I was with MON at the time (1986) and our 4 737's then were all ADV
BY did have their own ADV models by the early 80's afaik but they may have all been being used elsewhere - JMK JTR and JSI spring to mind really needing ADV models at the time
I was with MON at the time (1986) and our 4 737's then were all ADV
Thread Starter
Britannia's own 737s were regulars at LBA from 1976 but it was usually the Advanced model that did the honours. I doubt the originals such as G-AVRN could even have reached Palma in one hop off the then 5400 ft runway.
PH-TVP was certainly a busy aeroplane. As well as working for her Dutch masters, she found herself flying for British Airways and Air Malta before they had their own 737s, as well as Britannia.
PH-TVP was certainly a busy aeroplane. As well as working for her Dutch masters, she found herself flying for British Airways and Air Malta before they had their own 737s, as well as Britannia.
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With the resurgence of this thread thought I’d add that yes they did use the 733’s on charter work. 722’s were used on NCL - DBV through the 80’s until 87 when the 733’s took over and were used until 89 or 90. As a youngster flew This route on the 733 in 89.
Have some great pictures of DBV on a Saturday morning with equal measures of Jat, aviogenex and Adria on the ramp.
My my dad had always wanted to go to Yugoslavia but I was terrefied of ending up on an AGX tu134 (both ugly, scarily noisy and I was aware of dubious Russian safety records!). Luckily he never pursued Bulgaria as a Balkan tu154 was also on my avoid list...
also in 89 AGX had virtually retired their tu134’s and were using 737’s and 727’s. A friend was travelling back from SPU to NCL when the usual
737 Yu-anx went tech (couldn’t shut the door). with minimal delay two Tu134’s which were just sitting at Spu were mobilised to operate the flight..would have been my worst nightmare!
Have some great pictures of DBV on a Saturday morning with equal measures of Jat, aviogenex and Adria on the ramp.
My my dad had always wanted to go to Yugoslavia but I was terrefied of ending up on an AGX tu134 (both ugly, scarily noisy and I was aware of dubious Russian safety records!). Luckily he never pursued Bulgaria as a Balkan tu154 was also on my avoid list...
also in 89 AGX had virtually retired their tu134’s and were using 737’s and 727’s. A friend was travelling back from SPU to NCL when the usual
737 Yu-anx went tech (couldn’t shut the door). with minimal delay two Tu134’s which were just sitting at Spu were mobilised to operate the flight..would have been my worst nightmare!