china pilot medical failures
 

I would hope they wouldnt fail you on the medical simply because they dont like you. I would much rather been told im unsuitable for the position rather than subjected to medical screening as Cameltoad was, and then failed.

....SOAB.. You need to reread some of the posts...TIC ...This is china...they do things their way. If you are going to fly here you have to understand that it is a different culture. We all play by their rules...
It is sometimes difficult for foreigners to work here if they think their way is the best way, or even the only way.

As to the medicals...they are CAAC medicals. Unless you are flying on a short term validation, everyone takes them

As mentioned in this thread, some airlines may have better relations with the CAAC than others.

Dont know if thats anything to do with greased palms, or wishfull thinking by some.

The CAAC's way is the only way. The best way doesn't matter when dealing with them.

Hey Soab,
It's not about the airline liking or disliking you. I flew in China for a 1 1/2 years and at least at the airline that I was at if they liked you they would go the extra mile to keep you and if they didn't, usually in the form of guys just not flying to their standards or fitting in with the program they just fired them.
But as far as using the Medical for dismissing pilots this is simply not the case. Most of the air carriers in China need experienced Captains and to have the government step in and get rid of a guy for "sludgy gall bladder" is a real hit to their operation. Do I believe that some airlines have a better relationship with their local CAAC medical staff than others, absolutely. I know that where I was they did not enjoy a very good relationship with the Guangzhou CAAC (they are the medical administrating body that oversaw medicals in the region) Do I believe that some regions of the CAAC are less stringent than others, yup, know it for a fact.
But as so many have said "this is China" you and I will never comprehend the myriad of subtle workings, back room deals, alliances, payoffs, bribes, and the ever present Asian reality of saving face, losing face, causing your boss to save face, causing your boss to lose face, etc., etc.
I was at Shenzhen Airlines, I liked it there, I pretty sure I was liked as well. And to this day if I was to go and get a potential harmful, totally unnecessary Angiogram they would have me back tomorrow. But I'm not, and the CAAC could care less if I did or not. Shenzhen still needs captains, but for them as well as other Airlines there isn't a whole lot they can do to sway the mind of the gov. Look at what is happening at Beijing Capitol. At some level they have pissed off the CAAC and now they are not allowed to get any more planes till the prerequisite amount of brown nosing and payoffs and penalty box time has been met.:ugh:

Cameltoad,

Thanks for the reply.

Glad to hear you dont believe they would purposely fail guys on medical grounds.
I thought you missed out on the medical while first applying for a job, not on a renewal. Hope something comes up for you.
Thanks for the info on the Airline you were with. I note other airlines in the Guangzhou CAAC region are advertising. I wonder if they have better relations than your airline.

I understand the punitive culture of China. An airline had its expansion plans stopped (even had to reduce by 10% ?) because of the emergency incident. But it was a private airline, not govt owned.

Cheers

Yea, but privately owned or not the gov has the final say in the PRC!

The aforementioned privately owned airline was dished out a severe punishment (IMHO), but I wondered if the punishment would have been so severe had it being a Govt owned airline.

After all it was one incident from a foreign Korean Capt.

Part of the difficulty in dealing with the CAAC is that it is quite opaque and does not explicitly indicate the rights of airmen (or airlines). There is no way to get reconsideration or review if an airman disagrees with a CAAC decision. Getting your own tests done and showing them the results changes nothing.

Likewise, when the foreigner got in trouble at Juneyao, the airline was not able to say its side or appeal the punitive edicts. China is a place where "fairness" in government is just a theory, and much of the top - down rulings are arbitrary.

Until there is reform, the best survivors stay under the radar. Use diet, exercise, and over the counter medications to keep the numbers in line! No joke, you can at least manipulate cholesterol and blood pressure results a few weeks before a medical.

Rollingscissors

PM sent.

Major bump.

Get ready for all pilots in China over age 45 to undergo mandatory MRI exams, an ad-hoc CAAC fire drill because of one pilot who became incapacitated on the job.

Next, there will be 100% psycho stress tests after a captain crash-axes his copilot for doing something stupid.

rollingscissors

:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:

Never thought I would laugh so hard at this statement of the month on Chinese medical, till I AM HERE!!

What the hell is wrong with their attitude? And the disparity of excellent co-pilots, compared to the majority worst lots, my freaking xxxxxx..

I knew before I got here, and now am focusing on how not to get agitated.

Long time lurker, first time poster here.

This forum has helped me so much in my pilot training and future career prospects, that I though I'd give back a little here.

I've noticed a lot of people asking for specific requirements for CAAC medical so after some tough digging I found the official page here:

?ú??????_?ú?

Unfortunately its in Chinese, I am far too lazy to translate the entire document, but google translate dose a fairly decent job here, and if any part doesn't quite sound right, feel free to give me a PM, and I can translate specific requirements for you.

Hope this helps

Does anyone know if minor vericose veins (due to injury) in the my right leg could be a major problem? Leaving Monday for China. Thanks!

Chinese Medical
 

Hello Fellow Pilots,

There are many very informative posts which have been made here, the information is very useful.

I have been in China almost 5 years and still managing to "Pass" the Chinese medical. It has always been an wild experience and I used to laugh at some of the things they would test us for, but "I dont Laugh Now..!! I think this medical is one of the toughest in the World to pass.

Its amazing what the Doctors find with their old basic testing. Believe me, if you have something wrong, you can pretty much count on them finding it. From the MRI brain Scan to the CT Cat Scan, they will find any Kindney stones (in the making) spots on the brain (showing possible memory loss, Dimencia) to Cancers and Tumors, artery blockages, its amazing.

Also dont even thing about trying to hide a lasic surgery, they have machines designed just to find it. You can fly with lasic in China but have a 6 month waiting period from the procedure. You also have a 3 month waiting period from any surgery (including passing a Kidney stone) before you can get your medical.

I have had the MRI, recent the CT Scan (with die), Radio Cardiogram, booth hearing tests, Serious Eye tests including many machines, Blood tests (liver enzimes check), urine tests, Sonograms, Brain scans with flashing lights and you name it.

To make a long story short, if make it through your initial Check in Beijing CAAC, I think there is also Shanghai CAAC you should be OK if you stay healthy.

The company Doctor and your agent will have some ability to fix some small medical issues as you do your routine checks, thay can be delt with at the local levels. However, the local CAAC is strict once they get their hands on your issue there is not much room for error from what I have seen.

Its China, just roll with it and dont try to figure it out. Just do what your told to do with the medicals will keep your life simple.

I hope my post made some since,

Good Luck,

On Final

Screening Process China Southern
 

1.Does anyone know about medical during screening?
2. After passing your medical during screening, will you still have to go through more medicals after being accepted?

I have applied for China Southern.

Thanks in Advance.

At SZA the screening medical is the same as the CAAC physical. They don't want to waste time on you if you can't pass. It's good until the expiry date then you will take another based on your age. SZA also did a company medical every six months regardless of age that included the chest X-ray, blood and urine draw, resting EKG and ultrasound.

Maui, Once you pass the interview medical, you'll be good for six months. At least that was what happened to me on my first China job. I had one major medical per year and then the company one, which was less. Good luck on the interview! I might see you in April.....

Thanks
 

Thanks A lot Jaz and Ocean. Much appreciated.

Mj

i just passed mine....doc said hey your liver has more fat in it than last year....found out rice elevates your glycemic index..damn.. a year ago i failed the far vision test....they said, hey we'll get you glasses during lunch...retook it.. i gained about ten pounds last year...started liftining weights again...didn't say much....as one guy said, just dont drink like a college frat boy...alcohol will show up as a fatty liver.....red wine is always a good idea.....and don't supersixe the fries everday at mcdonalds....i really did change some eating habits, but watch out for chinese food bought out...it's cooked in oil....and all the chinese girls say the oil is illegal..meaning recycled oil....loaded with carcinogens..alot of press has been given to selling illegal recycled oil...be careful at where you eat...

Google "gutter oil" in China. Also fish farming with raw sewage as feed.

Taking un-necessary CAT scans is putting your life at risk. You should only get a CAT scan when it is necessary to confirm a serious illness, or when it is the only option available. Do the research yourself, a CAT scan is up to 500 times the radiation dose of a normal X Ray. MRI's are ok.

No job is worth having to put up with compulsory CAT scans.

The new tests that started a year ago are an MRI of the brain, and a ultrasound of the carotid artery. Not bad except they are administered, like everything in China, by an untrained kid who is related to somebody important. Probably zero training.

They can end your job. And have done it.

Why? Nobody cares. That is the answer to "why" in China.

A new twist in the Chinese medical saga. They now apparently are doing cross region medical evals. China is broken down into about 5 regions. Now the Beijing docs check the Shanghai region and the Guanzhou docs check Beijing and so on and so forth. Foreign Captains are now failing at a much higher rate than the past. On every medical it is usually 5% will fail here but now over 10% have not passed and many are doing ridiculous additional tests. For example one young Foreign Captain who had a slight abnormality on his EKG caused by their poor quality machine was forced to take a CT scan, echocardiogram and wear a 24 holter monitor EKG. Sometimes in China they will not actually even tell you that you have failed. You sit by awaiting further tests and then eventually somebody tells you after 1-2 months with no pay that it is not possible that you wil pass. Come here with a 3 year outlook and then leave and you might make it to the end of your contract if you are very lucky and you aren't terminated for altitude bust, QAR, copilot hard landings, ridiculous sim evaluations every 6 months or your medical. There are obstacles at every turn and Zero long term survivability here.

Don't factor in safety bonus or contract completion bonus into your total pay package, that way you will know what you can budget month to month.

Am looking into a position with a new start up biz jet operator in China who is in partnership with a well known bizjet operator from the USA (well known fractional operator).

Am still waiting facts on whether the planes are Chinese registered or not, not sure if even possible for them not to be.

If Chinese registered, what will be required for an EASA ATPL licence to do to get a Chinese one?

Sounds like the medicals are crazy, are they really doing MRI and CAT scans and blood tests every 6 or 12 months?

This doesn't sound very attractive!!!!

Info greatly appreciated.

My advice is don't bring it up or report it. If you report it then very low chances of passing with a very long drawn our process. If you avoid telling them it is doubtful they will discover it.

answer from a local agency in China
 

If your age is above 45,then every 6 month,on the contrary,every 12 month,answer from a local agency in China

Abdominal surgery
 

I am no way near the required minimums for a position in China but out of interest. How would a abdominal surgery affect the chances of passing the medical with an obvious visible scar.

Probably fail. They do an abdomin ultrasound and if they're not happy (be it for the dumbest reason) then it's a fail.

Wrong info. Yes they do an abdomen ultrasound. However, if they find anything they want to investigate further, they put u through an Abdomen CT Scan to confirm. The CT scan will help differentiate between a scar or something else. If it's a scar, it's not a problem. If they find something else on the CT scan other than a scar, then it could be a fail or lead to further tests etc.