Royal Brunei
Join Date: Oct 1998
Location: Brunei
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Greetings from Toulouse where I am presently doing my A 320 type rating. This is the first time in a long time I have logged on to this thread and so much of what I have read here is either stuff I disagree with or know to be wrong.
Airbus personnel here have no knowledge at all about any Airbus 340 acquisition by RBA.
Since NONE of the F.O.s here are eligible for command for a time period that exceeds the length of my standard 3 year contract, why does this "promote the locals and then the expats will be out of a job" suddenly rear its head once again and take on such startling new relevance ?
True, RBA hasn't had a pay rise for more than 10 years that I know of, but sitting at a streetside bar discussing terms and conditions with pilots from numerous other airlines also doing Airbus courses, I come away feeling quitely contented with what I take home each month, my gratuity and the other terms and conditions I have. Fact. When talking take home pay and other conditions, we don't do too bad. Before people decide to argue this point, perhaps they might like to have an answer to the question "why are people who left RBA for greener pastures applying to return ?".
If I sound like a sychophant I can quite comfortably look you in the eye and say I'm not. I have been unemployed. I have worked for other airlines. I have seen remuneration packages offered by other airlines and contracting agencies. I have also had a decent pay packet go into my bank account every month without fail for the entire time I have been with RBA. I am not a sychophant, but I also do not bite the hand that feeds me and feeds me well.
Airbus personnel here have no knowledge at all about any Airbus 340 acquisition by RBA.
Since NONE of the F.O.s here are eligible for command for a time period that exceeds the length of my standard 3 year contract, why does this "promote the locals and then the expats will be out of a job" suddenly rear its head once again and take on such startling new relevance ?
True, RBA hasn't had a pay rise for more than 10 years that I know of, but sitting at a streetside bar discussing terms and conditions with pilots from numerous other airlines also doing Airbus courses, I come away feeling quitely contented with what I take home each month, my gratuity and the other terms and conditions I have. Fact. When talking take home pay and other conditions, we don't do too bad. Before people decide to argue this point, perhaps they might like to have an answer to the question "why are people who left RBA for greener pastures applying to return ?".
If I sound like a sychophant I can quite comfortably look you in the eye and say I'm not. I have been unemployed. I have worked for other airlines. I have seen remuneration packages offered by other airlines and contracting agencies. I have also had a decent pay packet go into my bank account every month without fail for the entire time I have been with RBA. I am not a sychophant, but I also do not bite the hand that feeds me and feeds me well.
ILFC Singapore, lease arrangement, the same as the A319. A340 introduction dates to be April 04.
Howzit going MA, has AB bounced anything yet, SN should be ok, but CD, well keep shining the bone
Howzit going MA, has AB bounced anything yet, SN should be ok, but CD, well keep shining the bone
Join Date: Oct 1998
Location: Brunei
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Canuk, in response to your question, I believe you can.
In the time I've been here I've managed to buy 4 houses, and many other pilots have done similar. I think the largest number of houses acquired by an RBA pilot since about 1993 / 1994 is nine.
When I arrived here I had a wife, two children and a B 757 rating to pay off. So I came here with nothing and am doing all right. And no, I don't hide myself in a corner and hoard my money. We go on at least 2 overseas holidays each year and basically get what we want when we want it.
I haven't looked, but I imagine that if you went to the Pprune thread 'Terms and Endearment' there is probably RBA's remuneration package open for you to see.
If it's not there, contact the Independent Pilots Association, I think they have it.
Then do the maths yourself and answer your question yourself.
P.S. assuming you are Canadian, you should be aware that RBA will only accept U.K. and New Zealand A.T.P.L.s. If you have a Canadian or U.S. Licence, I'm afraid they won't entertain your application.
Cheers
Wings
In the time I've been here I've managed to buy 4 houses, and many other pilots have done similar. I think the largest number of houses acquired by an RBA pilot since about 1993 / 1994 is nine.
When I arrived here I had a wife, two children and a B 757 rating to pay off. So I came here with nothing and am doing all right. And no, I don't hide myself in a corner and hoard my money. We go on at least 2 overseas holidays each year and basically get what we want when we want it.
I haven't looked, but I imagine that if you went to the Pprune thread 'Terms and Endearment' there is probably RBA's remuneration package open for you to see.
If it's not there, contact the Independent Pilots Association, I think they have it.
Then do the maths yourself and answer your question yourself.
P.S. assuming you are Canadian, you should be aware that RBA will only accept U.K. and New Zealand A.T.P.L.s. If you have a Canadian or U.S. Licence, I'm afraid they won't entertain your application.
Cheers
Wings
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: UK
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Wings I have some questions for you.
You say that when you joined RBA you had to pay off a 757 Rating ,wife and two children. How much did the wife and two children cost you????
You then went on to say that you joined with nothing. Do your wife and two children know that is what you think of them???
You then go on to say you have 4 houses. What is their value and what outstanding loans do you have on them???
Also as RBA have not had a payrise for years then when you joined the salary was obviously OK but even you looking through your rose tinted spectacles must agree that property prices and all other prices have increased hugely since you joined.
I also presume that RBA have service increments which mean your salary is a lot higher than new joiners??
The exchange rate for £stg to Sin Dollars and Brunei is another huge change for the worst as well which needs to be taken into account by newcomers.
I prefer to listen to people like COWPAT for the real story of RBA
You say that when you joined RBA you had to pay off a 757 Rating ,wife and two children. How much did the wife and two children cost you????
You then went on to say that you joined with nothing. Do your wife and two children know that is what you think of them???
You then go on to say you have 4 houses. What is their value and what outstanding loans do you have on them???
Also as RBA have not had a payrise for years then when you joined the salary was obviously OK but even you looking through your rose tinted spectacles must agree that property prices and all other prices have increased hugely since you joined.
I also presume that RBA have service increments which mean your salary is a lot higher than new joiners??
The exchange rate for £stg to Sin Dollars and Brunei is another huge change for the worst as well which needs to be taken into account by newcomers.
I prefer to listen to people like COWPAT for the real story of RBA
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Perth
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A340-500's....GREAT NEWS!
Hi all
I just wanted to thank slingsby for all the information he has given everyone. I speak for myself when I say It is much appreciated (but i hope I speak for others too!
) I think RBA geting A340's will allow them to expand with London non stop and Frankfurt maybe...Also I just read about their new lounge being built:
"Royal Brunei Airlines Build New Premium Airport Lounge
Royal Brunei Airlines has begun renovations of the mezzanine floor at Brunei International Airport's departure hall to pave the way for the airline's new premium lounge.
The renovations which began on 17th July, are expected to end in December. In view of this, the Darussalam Business Class lounge has been closed, and Royal Brunei Catering's Coffee Garden has been relocated to the main departure hall near Royal Brunei's existing First Class lounge.
For the duration of the renovations, Royal Brunei's Business class passengers will be given invitations to its First Class lounge. However, in the event that the First Class lounge is full, Business class passengers travelling from Brunei will instead be provided meal vouchers upon check-in, for use at the Airport Restaurant.
The entire mezzanine floor will be converted into a world-class lounge for Royal Brunei's premium class passengers. Facilities such as a business centre, internet access, a prayer room with an ablution area and shower rooms are some of the features which will be available in the new lounge. This upgrading project is part of Royal Brunei's Strategic Plan.
Royal Brunei Airlines regrets any inconvenience that this may cause, and will try its best to minimise any unavoidable disruptions. "
--From the RBA website
http://www.bruneiair.com
Thanks again slingsby and everyone else, especially in my previous topic
I just wanted to thank slingsby for all the information he has given everyone. I speak for myself when I say It is much appreciated (but i hope I speak for others too!
) I think RBA geting A340's will allow them to expand with London non stop and Frankfurt maybe...Also I just read about their new lounge being built:"Royal Brunei Airlines Build New Premium Airport Lounge
Royal Brunei Airlines has begun renovations of the mezzanine floor at Brunei International Airport's departure hall to pave the way for the airline's new premium lounge.
The renovations which began on 17th July, are expected to end in December. In view of this, the Darussalam Business Class lounge has been closed, and Royal Brunei Catering's Coffee Garden has been relocated to the main departure hall near Royal Brunei's existing First Class lounge.
For the duration of the renovations, Royal Brunei's Business class passengers will be given invitations to its First Class lounge. However, in the event that the First Class lounge is full, Business class passengers travelling from Brunei will instead be provided meal vouchers upon check-in, for use at the Airport Restaurant.
The entire mezzanine floor will be converted into a world-class lounge for Royal Brunei's premium class passengers. Facilities such as a business centre, internet access, a prayer room with an ablution area and shower rooms are some of the features which will be available in the new lounge. This upgrading project is part of Royal Brunei's Strategic Plan.
Royal Brunei Airlines regrets any inconvenience that this may cause, and will try its best to minimise any unavoidable disruptions. "
--From the RBA website
http://www.bruneiair.com
Thanks again slingsby and everyone else, especially in my previous topic
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Pompano Beach,FL- USA
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For WINGS or anybody, why does Brunei NOT want US ratings? Not to single out any one country, what difference does it make for somebody who has a type rating from XXX country when the new airline is going to send you through THEIR school and procedures anyway?
I am very happy where I am now,but in my job search some 6-12 months ago I found this same restriction. It seems stupid to limit access to qualified pilots just because they have a rating from XXX country.
Does any one know why this is somewhat commonplace with some countries? I realize their are right to work lawas in some countries,but that should have nothing to do with a particular rating or where one got it initially.
Another thing I find interesting is that many employers expect you to be current on every airplane you ever flew or you are not eligible for "their" good graces. I have 4 type ratings and I could only be current in one at a type. I suppose if I was independently wealthy or owned an airline life might be different <bg>!
I am very happy where I am now,but in my job search some 6-12 months ago I found this same restriction. It seems stupid to limit access to qualified pilots just because they have a rating from XXX country.
Does any one know why this is somewhat commonplace with some countries? I realize their are right to work lawas in some countries,but that should have nothing to do with a particular rating or where one got it initially.
Another thing I find interesting is that many employers expect you to be current on every airplane you ever flew or you are not eligible for "their" good graces. I have 4 type ratings and I could only be current in one at a type. I suppose if I was independently wealthy or owned an airline life might be different <bg>!
Join Date: May 2000
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Jim Morehead your question has already been pretty much answered in this forum. Read pages 1 or 2 and you will most likely have your answer.
But to put it simply, my understanding why they only accept UK/JAA or NZ ATPL's, is because the Brunei DCA is run under contract by the UK CAA. The Brunei DCA can only issue a PPL I believe.
Hence it is fairly obvious why they accept UK/JAA licence holders.
The reason why they accept NZ licence holder may stem from the fact that Air New Zealand and the NZ CAA and a lot to do with helping RBA step up in the early days.
This is how it was told to me, happy to be corrected if it is not true.
But to put it simply, my understanding why they only accept UK/JAA or NZ ATPL's, is because the Brunei DCA is run under contract by the UK CAA. The Brunei DCA can only issue a PPL I believe.
Hence it is fairly obvious why they accept UK/JAA licence holders.
The reason why they accept NZ licence holder may stem from the fact that Air New Zealand and the NZ CAA and a lot to do with helping RBA step up in the early days.
This is how it was told to me, happy to be corrected if it is not true.
Join Date: Dec 2002
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BK...Actually I wasn't referring directly to Brunei or anywhere specifically. In my job search a year ago I encountered lots of roadblocks.
Many were:
Must have JAA license
Must be current on aircraft
Must have completed PC within 3-6 months
Must be able to work in XXX
Must be able to juggle 6 balls at once!(that's a joke)
My question is why is this all necessary when every airline is going to train you to their standards and their checklists and procedures.
An airline can't complain about a shortage of qualified pilots if they make the hoops too small. Many pilots are quite qualified,but may not be current on a given type. I do not qualify for a lot of 767/757 jobs because I flew it 10 years ago and last flew it in 1997 so I am ineligible for many airlines. Does that make me an less of a person???
There are many people with far more ratings than me, but I was only current on one airplane-747-400 in 2003. Everything else was between 3 and 10 years ago. Unless you want to go spend your days off renting 757s or 777s, it would be impossible (and frankly USELESS) to be qualified on these airplanes.
So life is a series or chances and luck, I suppose one would say.
JIM
Many were:
Must have JAA license
Must be current on aircraft
Must have completed PC within 3-6 months
Must be able to work in XXX
Must be able to juggle 6 balls at once!(that's a joke)
My question is why is this all necessary when every airline is going to train you to their standards and their checklists and procedures.
An airline can't complain about a shortage of qualified pilots if they make the hoops too small. Many pilots are quite qualified,but may not be current on a given type. I do not qualify for a lot of 767/757 jobs because I flew it 10 years ago and last flew it in 1997 so I am ineligible for many airlines. Does that make me an less of a person???
There are many people with far more ratings than me, but I was only current on one airplane-747-400 in 2003. Everything else was between 3 and 10 years ago. Unless you want to go spend your days off renting 757s or 777s, it would be impossible (and frankly USELESS) to be qualified on these airplanes.
So life is a series or chances and luck, I suppose one would say.
JIM
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Jim
It may be the airlines complaining about the lack of qualified candidates for a particular vacancy, however this is often due to the restrictions imposed on them by the regulatory authorities.
Often this matter is out of their (the airlines) hands.
It may be the airlines complaining about the lack of qualified candidates for a particular vacancy, however this is often due to the restrictions imposed on them by the regulatory authorities.
Often this matter is out of their (the airlines) hands.
Join Date: Dec 2002
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UP to HERE
thanks for the reply...Perhaps someone should tell some of the regulatory agencies what they lose by imposing unreasonable restirctions on pilots. I can say from experience that most guys who fly the Airbus products can fly a 320/319/330 and many who flew the 320 and upgrading/transitioning quite well to the 340. I wonder about the 380.
On the 757/767-200/767-300/777/400 airplanes, the Boeing guys know there are some differences,but the transitions have been relatively minor once you figure out the glass cockpits...
But thus far I have not encountered any country to produce pilots that have the monopoly on talent<bfg>!!!
thanks for the reply...Perhaps someone should tell some of the regulatory agencies what they lose by imposing unreasonable restirctions on pilots. I can say from experience that most guys who fly the Airbus products can fly a 320/319/330 and many who flew the 320 and upgrading/transitioning quite well to the 340. I wonder about the 380.
On the 757/767-200/767-300/777/400 airplanes, the Boeing guys know there are some differences,but the transitions have been relatively minor once you figure out the glass cockpits...
But thus far I have not encountered any country to produce pilots that have the monopoly on talent<bfg>!!!
Join Date: Oct 2002
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On a different note, just wondering if any of you have any comments regarding my situation. I was born in Brunei, still hold my Brunei residency but now residing in Canada and have my Canadian ATPL/IR. With RBA wanting UK/JAA/NZ licenses, it's obvious to go and get licenses under those issuing states.
Just wondering if my situation would be different since I'm would or should not be considered an expat and being born in Brunei? or would it still be necessary to go through the same process like regular expats?
Thank you!
Just wondering if my situation would be different since I'm would or should not be considered an expat and being born in Brunei? or would it still be necessary to go through the same process like regular expats?
Thank you!
Join Date: Jan 1999
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Snot box:
It is more than likely that you would be considered more favourably for employment by RBA than an expat would. However, you would still ultimately need to comply with the Brunei DCA licensing requirements.
Why don’t you get in touch with the Company and explore the possibilities?
It is more than likely that you would be considered more favourably for employment by RBA than an expat would. However, you would still ultimately need to comply with the Brunei DCA licensing requirements.
Why don’t you get in touch with the Company and explore the possibilities?
Join Date: Apr 2000
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Wings
Sorry but I have to reply to your comment on the "house buying" spree. Sounds like it our only objective here, and me and my mates cannot for one moment belive you have bought 4. Helped put down a deposit maybe? As for some pilot buying 9, well that would have taken a few foxey moves. Your comment about those who left and want to come back. Well as you will know several did come back, but they have all gone again (except 2 if I am correct, and one of them is about to retire so it does'nt make sense for him to go)
Join Date: Jul 2002
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14U I agree with what you say re Wings and his 4 Houses after 9 years in RBA.
Anyone can buy 4 houses to let on 90% Mortgages.
10 Years of a full RBA Salary wouldn,t buy my house in the South East of UK.
By all accounts RBA have not had a payrise for 10 years and just like so many other Airlines they are taking full advantage of the Pilot situation and IMHO is not a company to give up a job to join but if unemployed then it is better than starving.
Anyone can buy 4 houses to let on 90% Mortgages.
10 Years of a full RBA Salary wouldn,t buy my house in the South East of UK.
By all accounts RBA have not had a payrise for 10 years and just like so many other Airlines they are taking full advantage of the Pilot situation and IMHO is not a company to give up a job to join but if unemployed then it is better than starving.
Join Date: Jun 2003
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This discussion has drawn out a few extremes, but clearly the outsiders do not really understand the majority of writers here who are somewhat disillusioned. The rousing company address by the self procalimed non-sycophant is transparent to us here as an amusing tactic and there is no truth to the rumour that it is an attempt to revive a teaching career so do not take it seriously.
The personnel who have been here for more than about six years have seen a good package slide downhill not only by the constant nibbling away by our faceless bureaucrats, but also factors outside RBA's control such as exchange rates. For example the SGD/BND buys around 25% less of the Australian or NZ dollar now than it did six months ago. That is a significant cut for the staff from those parts who have their financial ventures in those countries. While the package viewed as it is from outside may seem good to those looking in, long term staff here are working harder for about two thirds of what they were getting a year ago and probably effectively half of that five years ago.
In general, the future of RBA is Airbus it would seem. A319s in a month, a couple more A320s later this year and A340-500s mid next year. There is still a need for a few crews on the 767, but some of them are going to become surplus sometime next year as the Airbuses come on line. Direct entry crews will probably be used and preferred by the company as they will not have lived through the past [better] times so next year will see some upheaval and probable arbitrary termination of contracts of Boeing crew. RBA has done this before without hesitation where they thought necessary and make no bones of the fact that expats are contract staff and here only as required.
I hope I'm wrong about some of these theories but there is no input from our management other than rumours so thats all there is to go on.
The personnel who have been here for more than about six years have seen a good package slide downhill not only by the constant nibbling away by our faceless bureaucrats, but also factors outside RBA's control such as exchange rates. For example the SGD/BND buys around 25% less of the Australian or NZ dollar now than it did six months ago. That is a significant cut for the staff from those parts who have their financial ventures in those countries. While the package viewed as it is from outside may seem good to those looking in, long term staff here are working harder for about two thirds of what they were getting a year ago and probably effectively half of that five years ago.
In general, the future of RBA is Airbus it would seem. A319s in a month, a couple more A320s later this year and A340-500s mid next year. There is still a need for a few crews on the 767, but some of them are going to become surplus sometime next year as the Airbuses come on line. Direct entry crews will probably be used and preferred by the company as they will not have lived through the past [better] times so next year will see some upheaval and probable arbitrary termination of contracts of Boeing crew. RBA has done this before without hesitation where they thought necessary and make no bones of the fact that expats are contract staff and here only as required.
I hope I'm wrong about some of these theories but there is no input from our management other than rumours so thats all there is to go on.
Current fleet news:
B757, to stay available for leasing
B767, all aircraft will be two class, first fitting during 'c' checks beginning in Jan. First class completely elimintated by super business seats with fully reclinable beds, personal IFE throughout the aircraft with on demand video.
Economy seats, upgraded to adjustable headrests and including PIFE and legrests.
A340, definately coming but no set date (again april04 is being quoted)
I do know which stations are to close but i think it would be grossly unfair of me to publish them on this website. Those of you who know me may inquire direct. You know this info I get is pretty reliable.
keep it up
B757, to stay available for leasing
B767, all aircraft will be two class, first fitting during 'c' checks beginning in Jan. First class completely elimintated by super business seats with fully reclinable beds, personal IFE throughout the aircraft with on demand video.
Economy seats, upgraded to adjustable headrests and including PIFE and legrests.
A340, definately coming but no set date (again april04 is being quoted)
I do know which stations are to close but i think it would be grossly unfair of me to publish them on this website. Those of you who know me may inquire direct. You know this info I get is pretty reliable.
keep it up
