China Southern wannabes
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: china
Age: 61
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CS went from almost zero foreign pilots to a huge group in 4 years. They just started recruiting in about 2011-ish. There are only a very few posters here that say it is bad. That means the vast majority are happy, and not getting on PPRUNE and complaining.
Sounds like a good gig to me.
I lived in CAN for my first year in China. It is one of only a couple of cities in China that wasn't completely "scraped" and built completely anew. It is an interesting place, and culturally easy to fit in as an expat. There are 10's of thousands of expats, or maybe even an order of magnitude more. From CAN and HKG, you can fly almost anywhere in the world, non-stop.
The narrow body jobs in China pay better, and as an American, you won't have tax issues like you will flying overwater. Depending on where you are based, the narrow body jobs can be a dream, or a disaster. Some cities sit under the air corridors of PVG and CAN/HKG, and every departure can be a 2 -3 hour delay.
I will be going back as soon as I can, hopefully shortly. Probably Sanya or Xiamen. I would love to go to Shenzhen or CAN, but reference the delays above.
Sounds like a good gig to me.
I lived in CAN for my first year in China. It is one of only a couple of cities in China that wasn't completely "scraped" and built completely anew. It is an interesting place, and culturally easy to fit in as an expat. There are 10's of thousands of expats, or maybe even an order of magnitude more. From CAN and HKG, you can fly almost anywhere in the world, non-stop.
The narrow body jobs in China pay better, and as an American, you won't have tax issues like you will flying overwater. Depending on where you are based, the narrow body jobs can be a dream, or a disaster. Some cities sit under the air corridors of PVG and CAN/HKG, and every departure can be a 2 -3 hour delay.
I will be going back as soon as I can, hopefully shortly. Probably Sanya or Xiamen. I would love to go to Shenzhen or CAN, but reference the delays above.
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Over the Pacific mostly
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I didn't get any answers on the thread about the average T7 cargo vs, pax flying but I did get some answers by PM's......., monstly cargo on the T7 is what I got, could it be confirmed that on the T7 there is mostly cargo with a lot of DH's to other bases to start trips?
Join Date: Feb 2002
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To add to Dominican's post.
Another question that is not clear:
What are the current (Summer 2016) RSP bases for the 777? 787?
B777: AMS (confirmed) - LAX ? - JFK ?
B787 : YVR (closing down) ? - AKL (closed) - LHR ?
Another question that is not clear:
What are the current (Summer 2016) RSP bases for the 777? 787?
B777: AMS (confirmed) - LAX ? - JFK ?
B787 : YVR (closing down) ? - AKL (closed) - LHR ?
Last edited by Mr_ATPL; 20th Jan 2016 at 10:42. Reason: edit
Join Date: Dec 2015
Location: Gotham city
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777 doing euro rsp is almost exclusively cargo. Working out well though most of the guys are getting decent time at home. 777 CAN base is working out at about 70/30 cargo pax but that'll change, three new 300-er on the way if not there already (flew a brand new sky team one last shift) so those numbers may not be accurate. As regards the positioning between Shanghai and Guangzhou to operate cargo, yes this is a pain and everyone has to do it but I believe change is afoot there also as in there may be a voluntary Shanghai base coming soon for those who want it.. As I've mentioned before the Chinese are willing to negotiate everything. For any new comers on Boeing you will have a choice of 787 or 777 also think carefully before you commit.
Join Date: Mar 2008
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Hi Enemymine,
A330 flies daily to AMS/CDG and a few times a week to FRA via Changsha i think.
Currently no A330 RSP's anywhere other than Australia although from what i heard recently, the idea of a base somewhere in Europe has been touted so maybe something for the future. I think at the moment they are looking to try and open a stable 787 RSP as when Vancouver closes this year that will be 2 opened and 2 closed in a very short period of time. For this reason they seem to be looking into LHR for the 787. I guess they will focus their efforts there first and then on another A330 RSP after perhaps.
All the best,
85
A330 flies daily to AMS/CDG and a few times a week to FRA via Changsha i think.
Currently no A330 RSP's anywhere other than Australia although from what i heard recently, the idea of a base somewhere in Europe has been touted so maybe something for the future. I think at the moment they are looking to try and open a stable 787 RSP as when Vancouver closes this year that will be 2 opened and 2 closed in a very short period of time. For this reason they seem to be looking into LHR for the 787. I guess they will focus their efforts there first and then on another A330 RSP after perhaps.
All the best,
85
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: France
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Bonjour
For those that are thinking of making a life changing decision, here some facts you may wish to consider :
1. Paris base (A330) just opened this month. For the 2 pilots on the base, rosters look fantastic with continuous fixed lines (4 on, 6 off) operating only between CDG-CAN. This is only done to make the CSA brochure look very attractive and glossy. Once they have the pilot numbers for the base, rosters WILL be changed to reflect the current practice of most other pilots 'away-from-home' rosters. Beware Air France pilots !!!
2. Punitive monetary fines for any days absent outside of Leave. If you are unfortunate enough to fall ill, need any compassionate time off or require some LWOP you will be fined US$600 a day, everyday. Take a month off, not only would you not get paid US$19k (fair enough) you will then also be fined US$18k ($600 x 30 days). Expensive month away from work if you are out of Leave or simply have no choice !
This has already been tested and numerous pilots have incurred the fine.
The option of losing your medical to receive $100/day is worth considering but could prove more problematic when trying to get it back under the extreme medical standards.
Something is obviously on the nose at CSA given 50% of screening candidates did not show up at the last screening, and of those that did, it is understood none got through.
Hope this is of help to anyone considering so there is no shock value to you and your families if you make the move.
Au revoir
For those that are thinking of making a life changing decision, here some facts you may wish to consider :
1. Paris base (A330) just opened this month. For the 2 pilots on the base, rosters look fantastic with continuous fixed lines (4 on, 6 off) operating only between CDG-CAN. This is only done to make the CSA brochure look very attractive and glossy. Once they have the pilot numbers for the base, rosters WILL be changed to reflect the current practice of most other pilots 'away-from-home' rosters. Beware Air France pilots !!!
2. Punitive monetary fines for any days absent outside of Leave. If you are unfortunate enough to fall ill, need any compassionate time off or require some LWOP you will be fined US$600 a day, everyday. Take a month off, not only would you not get paid US$19k (fair enough) you will then also be fined US$18k ($600 x 30 days). Expensive month away from work if you are out of Leave or simply have no choice !
This has already been tested and numerous pilots have incurred the fine.
The option of losing your medical to receive $100/day is worth considering but could prove more problematic when trying to get it back under the extreme medical standards.
Something is obviously on the nose at CSA given 50% of screening candidates did not show up at the last screening, and of those that did, it is understood none got through.
Hope this is of help to anyone considering so there is no shock value to you and your families if you make the move.
Au revoir
Join Date: Aug 2005
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Perth is currently served by 787 and is not a RSP (Reverse scheduling point). You can base yourself anywhere in the world however CSA will only position you from a CSA destination. Travel between your home and the CSA destination /port will be at your own expense as there is no ID90 travel. If based in CAN on 20/10 all travel is during the 10 day off period. However with annual leave etc some guys seem to be doing 18/12 etc, others back to back 20/10/10/20. Crews in RSP seem quite happy with there roster /days off. CSA appear to be at least trying to make it work as best as possible. ...It's different and fun will suit some but not others !
Join Date: May 2016
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"CSA appear to be at least trying to make it work as best as possible."
For anyone considering a life changing decision to leave their job and come to China Southern, an update to the observation above:
All Australian RSP's MEL/SYD/BNE have reverted from 'point-to-point' rostering offering maximum time at home back to multiple maximum time away 8-10 day patterns. Guys who were enjoying around 18 days at home are now back to 9 days. This is due in part to the locals complaining aided by one self-centred despised BNE individual.
Simply, the goal posts continually change regarding the rostering and nothing anyone is told can be trusted. Until any rostering practices are written in your contract, expect change to pacify the local pilot group and this despised individual who has convinced himself he represents the masses.
Any suggestions or 'petulant winging' as it is called by one, is simply responded with citing of the contract and their ability to do so. Gents on an RSP have been told as long as they get 8 non-consecutive days off at their RSP then the contract has been complied with. One could easy view that foreign pilots are just a necessary evil and not one whereby they are wanted unless of course you like the taste of management on the end of your tongue!
Australia now seems to have quite sufficient numbers of foreign pilots to fill the bases including those currently under training and thereby no ongoing necessity to make the rosters look attractive. 3D rosters on their way - Dubai, Delhi, Domestics. The Paris base however with only 2 guys, is great with only point-to-point rostering 4-on, 6-off. As quoted by China Southern, Paris rosters are only like this to make it attractive until we have the numbers on that base, then we'll change them back to CAN style rosters. Absolutely disgusting, dishonourable behaviour!!!
Funny the halted programme of making foreign pilots PIC 1 has kick started again in the same week it has been revealed domestic flying is the aim for future rosters. Nothing like spending a whole day to accrue 4 hours flying to Shanghai and back but then again, it will make the locals happy and inflate the ego of one
Looks like they just want to lure as many foreign pilots to join under the guise of a home base, only to then have them flying out of Guangzhou to all destinations the locals don't want. Seems to fall in line with the fact the locals love flying to Australia too and how they never want that to change.
Incoming ...........
For anyone considering a life changing decision to leave their job and come to China Southern, an update to the observation above:
All Australian RSP's MEL/SYD/BNE have reverted from 'point-to-point' rostering offering maximum time at home back to multiple maximum time away 8-10 day patterns. Guys who were enjoying around 18 days at home are now back to 9 days. This is due in part to the locals complaining aided by one self-centred despised BNE individual.
Simply, the goal posts continually change regarding the rostering and nothing anyone is told can be trusted. Until any rostering practices are written in your contract, expect change to pacify the local pilot group and this despised individual who has convinced himself he represents the masses.
Any suggestions or 'petulant winging' as it is called by one, is simply responded with citing of the contract and their ability to do so. Gents on an RSP have been told as long as they get 8 non-consecutive days off at their RSP then the contract has been complied with. One could easy view that foreign pilots are just a necessary evil and not one whereby they are wanted unless of course you like the taste of management on the end of your tongue!
Australia now seems to have quite sufficient numbers of foreign pilots to fill the bases including those currently under training and thereby no ongoing necessity to make the rosters look attractive. 3D rosters on their way - Dubai, Delhi, Domestics. The Paris base however with only 2 guys, is great with only point-to-point rostering 4-on, 6-off. As quoted by China Southern, Paris rosters are only like this to make it attractive until we have the numbers on that base, then we'll change them back to CAN style rosters. Absolutely disgusting, dishonourable behaviour!!!
Funny the halted programme of making foreign pilots PIC 1 has kick started again in the same week it has been revealed domestic flying is the aim for future rosters. Nothing like spending a whole day to accrue 4 hours flying to Shanghai and back but then again, it will make the locals happy and inflate the ego of one
Looks like they just want to lure as many foreign pilots to join under the guise of a home base, only to then have them flying out of Guangzhou to all destinations the locals don't want. Seems to fall in line with the fact the locals love flying to Australia too and how they never want that to change.Incoming ...........
Join Date: Oct 2006
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For those of you that are bipolar......, there is no need to get a username for each one of your personalities, specially whene the voices in your head are in agreement...., before any of the beings inhabiting the same body wants to post on PPrune..., just take your medication instead.
Join Date: Feb 2010
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Anybody with some info concerning the China Southern captain screening process please? I haven't check in the forum properly, I just wanted some info on SIM check, atpl questions and anything useful. Thanks a lot
cheers
cheers
Join Date: Aug 2011
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No ones hiding behind different personalities. The reason behind the new identities is to highlight the distain for TCH within CSA. What 10L TCH said is true. Who cares what identity you use. CSA has gone sour similar to CX & EK etc. No where to hide anymore. The latest roster changes & infighting has caused considerable displeasure. If you're considering a move to south China forget it. Stay put and make the best of your current situation. Working for noodle slurpers is not a long term option and it certainly is not enjoyable.
Join Date: Oct 2015
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Working in China is not everyone's cup of green tea, the difficult part is knowing if it is right for you. Everyone's circumstances are different. One thing I can tell you from experience; if you are on a reverse roster and have the carpet pulled from underneath you, end up flying domestic flights in China (with maybe a scattering of International flights thrown in), the job will feel untenable......... unless of course you like being away from you family 3 weeks at a time.