Flying for Garuda
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Flying for Garuda
Hi all,
I'm seriously considering to join Garuda Indonesia on a one year contract as an F/O on the Boeing 737-800. It seems like an interesting and enjoyable experience if I can get the time off from my employer.
However, I can hardly get an idea what the working atmosphere in the cockpit will be like, and I read on this site horrible stories about authoritarian captains who feel like they are God, terrified to loose face being the norm, to dudes who have the time of their lives!
I seriously want to get an idea what it will be like to share a workspace as a western f/o with a local captain with a local airline... before I sign a one year contract.
Who can give me any insights from Asia, Indonesia, Garuda?
Negative as well as positive experiences would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks guys!
I'm seriously considering to join Garuda Indonesia on a one year contract as an F/O on the Boeing 737-800. It seems like an interesting and enjoyable experience if I can get the time off from my employer.
However, I can hardly get an idea what the working atmosphere in the cockpit will be like, and I read on this site horrible stories about authoritarian captains who feel like they are God, terrified to loose face being the norm, to dudes who have the time of their lives!
I seriously want to get an idea what it will be like to share a workspace as a western f/o with a local captain with a local airline... before I sign a one year contract.
Who can give me any insights from Asia, Indonesia, Garuda?
Negative as well as positive experiences would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks guys!
Last edited by trlof; 7th Aug 2010 at 09:21.
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trlof,
Do a minimal amount of research on Garuda, and not just pprune. There is a reason the likes of them were banned from entering Europe and the US. Do you think some paperwork to ICAO can hide the real truth?
If you do opt to go then be under no illusion that you asked for the treatment and circumstances you will find yourself in.
Why am I so "bitter"? Because I made that mistake at Air India. I thought safety, professionalism and integrity were universal in (international) aviation. I was so unbelievably wrong. Garuda, as I understand it, are not too different. Rewind the clock to arrogant and omniscient cultures and training departments with a hatred of "standards" whereby it may undermine their scams and delusions of grandeur.
There is a reason why such airlines are regarded by the wider "professional" world as not worth touching. And, on top of that, you will have that scar on your CV for the rest of your life. Trust me, I know. Stick with what you know. If you want an adventure, go fly a float plane in the Maldives. It's GA, but those standards are almost expected and part of the package.
Do a minimal amount of research on Garuda, and not just pprune. There is a reason the likes of them were banned from entering Europe and the US. Do you think some paperwork to ICAO can hide the real truth?
If you do opt to go then be under no illusion that you asked for the treatment and circumstances you will find yourself in.
Why am I so "bitter"? Because I made that mistake at Air India. I thought safety, professionalism and integrity were universal in (international) aviation. I was so unbelievably wrong. Garuda, as I understand it, are not too different. Rewind the clock to arrogant and omniscient cultures and training departments with a hatred of "standards" whereby it may undermine their scams and delusions of grandeur.
There is a reason why such airlines are regarded by the wider "professional" world as not worth touching. And, on top of that, you will have that scar on your CV for the rest of your life. Trust me, I know. Stick with what you know. If you want an adventure, go fly a float plane in the Maldives. It's GA, but those standards are almost expected and part of the package.
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Parc is recruiting for garuda as well... At the moment, garuda is the best airline in indonesia to work for.. They are pretty serious about what they do and have stringent hiring standards..
On top of that, brand new airplanes and competent crew...
On top of that, brand new airplanes and competent crew...
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Dont worry if they dont like you....
Guys dont worry if they dont like...or you cause them problems. This is one way of getting rid of you.... 
"A pilot for national airline Garuda Indonesia went on trial Tuesday May 2004 over the alleged murder of a prominent human rights activist who was poisoned last year on a flight to Amsterdam. An Indonesian court has sentenced an off-duty airline pilot to 14 years' jail for murdering a rights activist.
The court said Pollycarpus Priyanto poisoned a glass of orange juice served to Munir Thalib during a flight to Amsterdam two years ago".
"A pilot for national airline Garuda Indonesia went on trial Tuesday May 2004 over the alleged murder of a prominent human rights activist who was poisoned last year on a flight to Amsterdam. An Indonesian court has sentenced an off-duty airline pilot to 14 years' jail for murdering a rights activist.
The court said Pollycarpus Priyanto poisoned a glass of orange juice served to Munir Thalib during a flight to Amsterdam two years ago".
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No One is perfect...not even for gods of Garuda
Ok not gods... but aleast Indonesian astronauts aleast.
Sidney Morning Herald (22nd Oct 2007)
The chief pilot of a plane that crashed in Indonesia, killing five Australians and 16 others, ignored 15 alarm bells as the plane came in to land too quickly, a report has found.
The Boeing 737 exploded into flames in a rice field after skidding off the end of the runway in Yogyakarta, Central Java, on March 7.
Investigators have scoured the plane's black box cockpit voice recorder and data log for clues to the disaster.
The final report stemming from the crash investigation found the pilot had landed, despite a flood of warnings.
"During the approach, the Ground Proximity Warning System (GPWS) alerts and warnings sounded 15 times, and the co-pilot called for the pilot in command to go around," the report found.
"The aircraft was flown at an excessive air speed and steep flight path angle during the approach and landing, resulting in an unstabilised approach.
"The pilot in command did not follow company procedures that required him to fly a stabilised approach, and he did not abort the landing and go around when the approach was not stabilised.
"His attention was fixated or channelised on landing the aircraft on the runway and he either did not hear, or disregarded the GPWS alerts, and warnings, and calls from the co-pilot to go around."
The investigation also found the co-pilot did not follow company procedures and take control of the plane when he saw the pilot repeatedly ignore the alerts and warnings.
Garuda records also showed no evidence that the pilots had been trained to respond appropriately to the warnings.
The investigation also found Yogyakarta Airport's fire fighting service was unable to reach the accident site and some vehicles lacked necessary equipment.
"The delay in extinguishing the fire, and the lack of appropriate fire suppressant agents, may have significantly reduced survivability," the report said.
"The airport emergency plan and its implementation were less than effective."
National Transport Safety Committee chairman Tatang Kurniadi said the report was aimed a preventing further accidents, and was not to be used as the basis for any legal action over the March crash.
Kurniadi said the committee would not hand over any evidence gained from the plane's flight recorders, to help the police investigation.
Police are continuing to investigate the crash and have interviewed the pilots, who survived by scrambling out of the cockpit.
"I would like to go back to the objective of this, the report was made by NTSC for safety purposes only, not for blaming," he said.
"If any institution wants to ... follow up that accident, that's their own decision."
He said the committee's report could not be used for legal purposes.
"The report contained the results from the cockpit voice recorder and flight data recorder, but according to international regulations on aviation these black boxes are not allowed to be used for ... liability purposes," Kurniadi said.
"We will not give police or any institution [information] other than for safety purposes only - it's in international regulations and we want to follow those regulations."
Sidney Morning Herald (22nd Oct 2007)
The chief pilot of a plane that crashed in Indonesia, killing five Australians and 16 others, ignored 15 alarm bells as the plane came in to land too quickly, a report has found.
The Boeing 737 exploded into flames in a rice field after skidding off the end of the runway in Yogyakarta, Central Java, on March 7.
Investigators have scoured the plane's black box cockpit voice recorder and data log for clues to the disaster.
The final report stemming from the crash investigation found the pilot had landed, despite a flood of warnings.
"During the approach, the Ground Proximity Warning System (GPWS) alerts and warnings sounded 15 times, and the co-pilot called for the pilot in command to go around," the report found.
"The aircraft was flown at an excessive air speed and steep flight path angle during the approach and landing, resulting in an unstabilised approach.
"The pilot in command did not follow company procedures that required him to fly a stabilised approach, and he did not abort the landing and go around when the approach was not stabilised.
"His attention was fixated or channelised on landing the aircraft on the runway and he either did not hear, or disregarded the GPWS alerts, and warnings, and calls from the co-pilot to go around."
The investigation also found the co-pilot did not follow company procedures and take control of the plane when he saw the pilot repeatedly ignore the alerts and warnings.
Garuda records also showed no evidence that the pilots had been trained to respond appropriately to the warnings.
The investigation also found Yogyakarta Airport's fire fighting service was unable to reach the accident site and some vehicles lacked necessary equipment.
"The delay in extinguishing the fire, and the lack of appropriate fire suppressant agents, may have significantly reduced survivability," the report said.
"The airport emergency plan and its implementation were less than effective."
National Transport Safety Committee chairman Tatang Kurniadi said the report was aimed a preventing further accidents, and was not to be used as the basis for any legal action over the March crash.
Kurniadi said the committee would not hand over any evidence gained from the plane's flight recorders, to help the police investigation.
Police are continuing to investigate the crash and have interviewed the pilots, who survived by scrambling out of the cockpit.
"I would like to go back to the objective of this, the report was made by NTSC for safety purposes only, not for blaming," he said.
"If any institution wants to ... follow up that accident, that's their own decision."
He said the committee's report could not be used for legal purposes.
"The report contained the results from the cockpit voice recorder and flight data recorder, but according to international regulations on aviation these black boxes are not allowed to be used for ... liability purposes," Kurniadi said.
"We will not give police or any institution [information] other than for safety purposes only - it's in international regulations and we want to follow those regulations."
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Unfortunatelly this kind of accidents is just waiting to happen again in Indonesia.
A lot of behaviour problems from the indonesian pilots...
SOP, MEL, TCAS or EGPWS warnings they just disreguard them
If they have an high incident/accident rate and are/were on blacklists it is not without reason.
A lot of behaviour problems from the indonesian pilots...
SOP, MEL, TCAS or EGPWS warnings they just disreguard them
If they have an high incident/accident rate and are/were on blacklists it is not without reason.
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Be objectives..
Guys,
It's good to collect all data concerning your application,but some of the "Top Gun" guys pass incorrect information mixed up with the politics.
Not trying to hide nor deffends any company/nations but see for yourself is there any flag carrier doesn't have any failure and they're trying so hard to keep up their standard too,like yours!
be a positive dude!
It's good to collect all data concerning your application,but some of the "Top Gun" guys pass incorrect information mixed up with the politics.
Not trying to hide nor deffends any company/nations but see for yourself is there any flag carrier doesn't have any failure and they're trying so hard to keep up their standard too,like yours!
be a positive dude!
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Garuda
Toni contacted me about Garuda and ask if I was interested. I love Indoland and would love to return.
She said 80 hrs / $7500 Capt EFIS -300 with 4 star and trans 2 months/2weeks sched.
Not the best expat gig, but given CGK it's a lot of money. I've been paid more, but came home with less. When I worked Indo things were fairly cheap.
Garuda has cleaned up their act more than any other Indo carrier. It's just the culture there. Learn it and you can work with it. You just have to keep an eye out for the people that are suppose to be supporting you and are not.
No different than a lot of other expat gigs.
No yelling and screaming...won't help. Learn to play with their rules and smile a lot.
Works really well.
She said 80 hrs / $7500 Capt EFIS -300 with 4 star and trans 2 months/2weeks sched.
Not the best expat gig, but given CGK it's a lot of money. I've been paid more, but came home with less. When I worked Indo things were fairly cheap.
Garuda has cleaned up their act more than any other Indo carrier. It's just the culture there. Learn it and you can work with it. You just have to keep an eye out for the people that are suppose to be supporting you and are not.
No different than a lot of other expat gigs.No yelling and screaming...won't help.
Learn to play with their rules and smile a lot. Works really well.
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It is irrelevant whether other Indonesian or Garuda pilots appreciate or accept foreign contract pilots; they are necessary and required. Garuda is not alone in the region of being an airline with an appalling safety record. The population is such that it could man its airline internally but it has been deemed fit to employ foreign pilots. The advertised contracts of 12 months will probably be extended; the alternative is another catastrophe.
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I got invitations now from Rishworth and Parc, and an e-mail from Aeroprofessional which I suspect concerns the same position.
@ Moretimeoff: Pay is US$ 5.200 for B737NG F/O and US$ 5.000 for B737PG F/O.
@ menikos: I don't have any personal experience with Garuda. I'm in the process of getting in and will post my experience here.
@ Moretimeoff: Pay is US$ 5.200 for B737NG F/O and US$ 5.000 for B737PG F/O.
@ menikos: I don't have any personal experience with Garuda. I'm in the process of getting in and will post my experience here.
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Garuda
From todays newspaper....
Garuda Indonesia seeking foreign pilots
The Jakarta Post, Jakarta | Tue, 08/24/2010 9:00 PM | Business A | A | A |
State-owned airline Garuda Indonesia is seeking 70 international pilots to develop its training program. The search will last until end of this year.
“The foreign pilots will be brought to Indonesia to help us train new pilot candidates. Hopefully the new pilots will be able operate our aircraft by next year,” operational director Ari Sapari said Tuesday, as quoted by kompas.com.
Indonesia’s aviation industry is faced with a shortage of pilots because of an increase in available aircraft.
The government has issued policies to help the industry grow, including allowing recruitment of foreign pilots and extending the pilot retirement age to 60.
Garuda had 670 pilots and co-pilots in 2009. This year the company is expecting 851 pilots and co-pilots to operate its 67 airplanes.
Garuda Indonesia seeking foreign pilots
The Jakarta Post, Jakarta | Tue, 08/24/2010 9:00 PM | Business A | A | A |
State-owned airline Garuda Indonesia is seeking 70 international pilots to develop its training program. The search will last until end of this year.
“The foreign pilots will be brought to Indonesia to help us train new pilot candidates. Hopefully the new pilots will be able operate our aircraft by next year,” operational director Ari Sapari said Tuesday, as quoted by kompas.com.
Indonesia’s aviation industry is faced with a shortage of pilots because of an increase in available aircraft.
The government has issued policies to help the industry grow, including allowing recruitment of foreign pilots and extending the pilot retirement age to 60.
Garuda had 670 pilots and co-pilots in 2009. This year the company is expecting 851 pilots and co-pilots to operate its 67 airplanes.
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Learn to play with their rules and smile a lot. Works really well.
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"That is probably the advice given to the Garuda F/O when his 737 landed fast and long and killed lost of people at Yogyakarta." A37575
I really do quite enjoy the arrogance of you Aussie pilots. It's a shame you guys aren't able to stick together over there.
By the way, thanks for addressing all the issues of this accident. I am sure your comment will go far in educating and improving air safety in Indonesia.
CF.
I really do quite enjoy the arrogance of you Aussie pilots. It's a shame you guys aren't able to stick together over there.
By the way, thanks for addressing all the issues of this accident. I am sure your comment will go far in educating and improving air safety in Indonesia.
CF.