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Eva and China Airline

Old 3rd Apr 2010, 17:22
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Ive applied with no answer. 6500, 4000Jet 2200 Turboprop
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Old 4th Apr 2010, 02:09
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How difficult is the medical, specifically eyesight. I have 20/15 vision corrected but 20/200 or worse uncorrected.
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Old 4th Apr 2010, 02:45
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555orange, did you post under a wrong nick?? All my jabs have been at wayyyoutthere for his depressing, sad and narrowminded views. This is your first post under this topic so wtf exactly are you refering to?

Is that how it's done? Have a few nicks and spew verbal diarrhea every chance you get? I'm glad you went to a better airline, equally good as Cathay, even better. I'm speechless, nothing more I can say.

D
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Old 4th Apr 2010, 05:00
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dabssa
Hot off the press. 25% payrise for pilots, no layoffs, 2 days off extra every month. 9th floor official news will be released on Friday.
This is what you said on April 02,2009. How did it play out?
With EVA, the only way you can be flying a heavy out of Vancouver is if you get the 747. There are no outport bases anymore as far as I know. Then once a month you could bid for a YVR trip, most of the time you will get it.
How is the duty reg in eva? I didn't know we had a bidding system. mercy from the scheduler i reckon.
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Old 4th Apr 2010, 06:44
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LOL...

Hey Dabssa, work better for ya? ....

I am simply providing a neutral and as close to truth post as I could muster. Reality is that some companies just plain "suck". Im just the messenger... but your post is quite funny.

I did go to another company, equally as good as Cathay. In fact even better. So sorry to hear you are still stuck there. Maybe Cathay will give you a second chance. Leaving was the best thing I ever did.

I am simply trying to help our colleagues with what "my take" was on my experience with the Taiwanese companies were. Of course its my opinion only...and of course its an anonymous forum. Your ability for the obvious is striking! And quite funny...

Ryan, I did not realize you had Married a Taiwanese, and had so much experience with the country. Like Dabykins said, its different for everyone. However, I do stand true to my post. You might have a great time there then, since you will have your family with you, but don't think that it will make you a local at the company. The fact remains that the companies there really suck. I have seen many others there who were just like you, and were passed over again and again. None similar to you became captains. All that I knew similar to you (married a local etc) moved on because they kept getting screwed. And I won't even scratch the surface at how seemingly brainless the managment is! Typical top down authoritarian style management. Policy is spoken by whoever is in charge and even if it does not make sense, no one will question and it will continue forever that way. Its unbelievable sometimes. I suggest you go, and check it out, but then keep looking, and focus on a place where you will be on a seniority list for upgrade, and the pay is way better, and it NOT CONTRACT. Especially if you have a fam.

Keeping it simple: The money sucks...it doesnt compete with the rest of the world, you will be fighting an uphill battle based on your skin colour (sad but true), you will work twice as hard (this is not an exaggeration!), you will get no benefits, less vacation time, no upgrade, etc etc. If your American, you will have to pay tax to the US regardless of if your not living there anymore or not and it sounds like you are. From other countries, maybe you can get away with 13-15%. Fabykins says he paid 12%, which means he was an FO and made ***** but still loved it. LOL. Guess he forgot that the more you make the more you pay... .(hey Faby...its graduated numb*****), which makes the fact that he is defending it all the more rediculous for him since hes basically telling everyone he made a ***** salary there and loved it when he could have been enjoying life anywhere else at double the pay.

Although You might accept all the shortcomings since your will have a better family life. However I would suggest that you consider some of the other aspects that you should look at considering you have a family and kids. Pension, upgrade, permanent nature employment not contract, paid schooling, etc. CAL/EVA do not have schooling benefit packages. So you are regulated to the public system. You will not be able to afford the private system. The Taipei/American school is about 20k/year. Just a suggestion, but consider Hong Kong to Cathay or even to the Sandbox and get an upgrade sooner. I think you will be happier as you will get double the money, more time off, work less etc etc. Or stay in your home country and go for the legacy.

Btw, I greatly enjoyed my time in Taiwan, but I hated the company. And I hated how they lied to get you there and use you as an FO, and then get you out so they could only upgrade locals. It even happened to the guys I knew that have local family! But, there is a great nightlife, but I am only dealing with what were MY and most others frustrations with the companies. But then I have seen great nightlife everywhere I have worked. Non of the foreigners stayed... thats just the fact. Think about that. Why would that be? I think Hong Kong would be the best place for you. Dragon Air or Cathay. Your wife will be happy and Hong Kong is in my opinion way more of a better experience all around. And since you have a family, it will have much better of the kind of benefits you should be looking at as a family. Paid school, retirement fund, more holidays, less work days, permanent position etc. Or go and get your 320 command at Air Asia in KUL.

Even though your wife is Taiwanese, you will still be on a contract of the length chosen by CAL/EVA. Recently CAL contract renewal was 1 year. In otherwords, every time you come due, they will look at the req's and either keep you or say goodbye. Put too much time in a company like this, eventually you will be let go and have invested 5+years, with kids in school, no pension savings, and suddenly having to look for a job, no upgrade and having to start over with a real seniority company, and no way to support your family. Taking a big chance man. Over the last year CAL did not renew most foreigner contracts no matter who you were. All nationals stayed, almost all foreigners were terminated! Read between those lines there! You will not be able to be on a local type scheme, and wouldn't want too, because that pay is even more rediculous at about 2-3k month.

Just my opinion for ya.... again! Good luck man!
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Old 4th Apr 2010, 13:02
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Sure works fine oh the depressed one.

Wrong choice of words regarding bidding for trips. Sorry, you can request a trip every month. Aussie 330 guys if you wanna go to Brisbane, or Canadian 747 wanna go to YVR once a month chances are good you will get it. It's not a bid system, but just purely a request which the scheduler may or may not give you. Just live with the fact that for your time on duty they own you and that's that.

And that hot off the press stuff, just goes to prove that any cretin (including myself) can write bs and nobody will refute the claim. That is, bull**** becomes fact. It is a rumour network after all and pilots love rumours.
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Old 4th Apr 2010, 16:55
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I have for a long time considered applying to EVA, mainly for the reasons listed below.

a) I assumed that they were a good employer and that the terms and conditions would be fair.

b) I would love the opportunity to operate within south east asia and EVA seem to have an excellent safety record and interesting route structure.

c) I have always wanted to fly the MD-11 and Eva offer one of few opportunities globally for an ex-pat to operate one.

Having read this thread however, those thoughts of applying have gone straight to the back of my mind. I fully appreciate the grass isn't greener etc but is Eva really that bad? It would seem a good opportunity for an FO to gain 4 years of good international ops experience and numerous heavy hours in the log book.

Nobody is 100% happy at any airline IMHO and all carriers have their faults, but as a current 737 FO who is looking to move onto heavier metal in the future, I am struggling to find anybody speaking positively about their companies, enough for me to want to take the plunge and send an application off. My current airline are a good bunch and I am lucky to be where I am, so I don't want to throw that away and spend years regretting doing so.

Its easy to say go to CX, but you only have to have a read of fragrant harbour and have a chat with some of their guys to see how their recruitment needs are being fulfilled.

Its probably too much of a risk to leave a permanent contract, for a fixed term, non-renewable (it seems) deal anyway (for a guy in my position).

Cheers

JAS
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Old 4th Apr 2010, 17:04
  #48 (permalink)  
 
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So does CAL use the same concept request 1 trip per month? My current airline does the same but she can make magic happen in the blocks...
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Old 4th Apr 2010, 17:29
  #49 (permalink)  
 
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I would not move from a permanent contract B737 FO in Europe to an FO contract position in Taiwan.

You have the four stripes much closer where you are now than in any of these two companies in TWN.

At the moment I came to CAL I had the chance to go for a permanent A320 FO position in my country and I was blinded by the Mighty B747-400ERF in CAL.
All my fellows who had accepted the A320 FO position have been upgraded to Captain at the end of last year...and I am still an FO

Anyway, you can apply and see with your own eyes.
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Old 4th Apr 2010, 23:15
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A real suffer.

Been there 3 years.Fed up with the double-standard ,racist treatment.They are lying on the interview,even when they ask You a question.Upgrade?ha-ha!

CRM:ha-ha!
Written and verbal reports behind You?Yes,any time!
Corruption with rostering? Take a packed envelope every month!

Also,one more thing Taiwanese CAA is not recognised anywhere in the world.So is your Taiwanese ATPL with your annual SIM checks.If You ever want to fly outside of Taiwan and maintain your ATPL,You pay your own LPC/OPC every year.

When CAL didnt give a ***t to my contract terms and changed it,I did the same with the bond.Its a two way street.

Regarding with the bond,never heard anybody taken to the court.Not even the OZ guy from EVA,who left his uniform in his room and never returned from Home Leave.I personally know 4 guys not going back to CAL or EVA from Home Leave and nothing happened.Taiwan is not recognised as a country according the one-China statement.They cant sue You in your home country unless You enter again to Taiwan later.

Important: DON'T GIVE THEM ANY MONEY!
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Old 4th Apr 2010, 23:18
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Once again, thank you all for your excellent responses. I am fully aware of the shortcomings that CAL has. In fact, I am weary of going there myself but as I mentioned earlier, I do have many other reasons to be there.

I was wondering if any of you know or have seen of others making the transition from contract to permanent employment with either company? Of course I relalize you would have to be a Taiwan citizen to do this. I ask because I do have the ability to gain citizenship through my wife. Is it possible to make that trainsition? Before anyone goes off about how I wouldn't want to do this because they make less money, or..., or... That is not my question!!! I am simply wondering if it is possible and/or has been done before.
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Old 5th Apr 2010, 00:43
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There has been lots of talk on the lack of upgrades...
So what's happening here if they have expat FOs with the requirments for command and they need expat captains can you not make the switch? Is there a lack of experience or skill or is it corprate culture?

Thanks.
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Old 5th Apr 2010, 08:48
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No.
You are on the time limited contract. Max 3 yrs (CAL). You need few years and few thousand hrs in the company and the RP position + advanced oral test + mentoring + upgrade course. Simply there is no time.
They cannot easily let go a local so it is cheaper and easier for them to train their owns and you will babysit.
And they know that after the upgrade you will disappear....

Just a reminder.
Last year they did not renew any of the expat contract.
Instructors, Captains, RPs, FOs, all very experienced and some of them with more than 10 years with CAL had to go...
At that time locals got the raise and they built a brand new operations center.

Last edited by littlejet; 5th Apr 2010 at 09:08.
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Old 5th Apr 2010, 13:43
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So if you were able to stick around the company for at least 1 renewal would you have a shot at upgrading?
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Old 5th Apr 2010, 16:34
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If you were able?
That is the good question.
Being upgraded there is not a matter of experience and ability, as you asked previously. For them it is a privilege and a reward.
It is their culture.
If you like to gamble, say 5 years of your career, give it a try
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Old 6th Apr 2010, 16:07
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FyingRyan76, you can join as an expat and gain Permanent Resident status if you stay at least 7 years in Taiwan, but since your wife is Taiwanese your case would be different, in EVA expats and locals have the same salary except that expats get either a room at their building or a house allowance, but if you become PR you loose the house allowance (I think, not sure about this if your wife is Taiwanese if your wife is foreigner you don't loose it), but the rest of the salary is the same. In EVA you get a 4 year contract, and is almost like a permanent contract, LAST YEAR EVA RENEWED EVERYBODY AND DIDN'T LAY OFF ANYBODY, I'm not defending EVA I'm just stating the FACTS, is it the best job?? I don't think so, as an FO it would a be very very long wait for upgrade, but as I'm writing this they are interviewing FO's who have been there I think for about 9 years for upgrade, if they pass it or not is a different story. If you are willing to really go to Taiwan go to EVA, not CAL, and hurry they are in desperate need at the moment. I tell you all this because I KNOW FIRST HAND.....Cheers...The CAPT.....
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Old 6th Apr 2010, 21:47
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Ryan.

I agree with the Skipper. If you must go, try EVA. They didn't lay anyone off last year. CAL laid off lots, and ALL for foreigners who thought they had some protection of experience, or years of service, or extra work in the office. Capts were mere months away from collecting their 200k+ pension allotment after investing 10 years, but CAL let them go so that they wouldn't reach it. This is common practice for CAL.

Also, you cannot become a national (ie: Passport) even if your wife is Taiwanese. Permanent resident and "National" are 2 different things. Only Nationals are protected under the labor laws of Taiwan.

If you were on a national contract, you would not get housing pay, and you would be flying a Heavy 90 hours a month for 3k gross. You really want to put your family through that? You may like it here, but you wont for that kind of take home pay.

Good luck.
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Old 7th Apr 2010, 00:32
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CAL is renewing contracts to expats at this moment but in local terms and for a maximum of three years.

Depends in your face, from where you are, performance, some guys get 1, other two but none more than three.

Anyway, we are less the 60 expats in all fleets and counting down...
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Old 7th Apr 2010, 02:06
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Niiiiice

Appears as though Eva is the best out of the two. Of course one must consider the no chance of upgrade and crap salary before one would make such a critical career and life decision.

My 2 NT's worth
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Old 7th Apr 2010, 04:40
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I would definetly prefer EVA over CAL but unfortunately EVA is only hiring locals at the moment. No expat hiring.
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