You know you're on the Subcontinent when....
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You know you're on the Subcontinent when....
Having had great joy and lot of laugh reading the tread: 'You know you're in Africa when...' and knowing that rules are broken or/and ignored on the subcontinent as well, I'll take the chance of redicule by starting the tread: 'You know you're on the Subcontinent when....' so ladies and gentlemen, pls post your experiences .
F
F
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when ATC want to:
1. read, verbatum, the Indian AIP to you ..... on the area frequency when you give your initial position report
2. has no hesitation giving multible instructions whilst you are co-ordinating their last set of instructions with Dacka - on VHF 2 - whist you are transiting the 25 NM of Dacka airspace. You realise its going to be one of those nights. Even worse; try climbing out from Dacka via Kolkata and you'll know what I mean
3. bust your b@lls for not answering their first, and only, call when you have been trying to raise them for the last 20 minutes on the only two frequencies listed, for that FIR, on the Jepp chart
4. insist on giving you their re-route, that so happens to coincide with your actual flight plan - then its given to you again through every subsequent FIR up until you past the two god damned way points they keep prattling on about.
5. ask for your aircraft registration mark, on initial contact - somehow they believe or read everything on the SITA FLT PLN strip but the rego
6. when you have to listen to a Jet Airways Captain lodge a verbal complaint, for 30 minutes, over the FIR, for being held down by 2000 feet and then being asked to reduce speed by 10 kts for seperation - now that was better than listening to Hancock's Half Hour.
7. always want to know your estimate for your exit point at your entry point (initial call).......like your transiting the whole country through at least five FIRs - guess you gotta keep an accurate record for that revenue.
8. writing your ID number and signing your name in a 2" thick leather bound ledger at the crew entry immigration desk
9. having your overflight permit number questioned
Hope this kicks it off for you fhegner
1. read, verbatum, the Indian AIP to you ..... on the area frequency when you give your initial position report
2. has no hesitation giving multible instructions whilst you are co-ordinating their last set of instructions with Dacka - on VHF 2 - whist you are transiting the 25 NM of Dacka airspace. You realise its going to be one of those nights. Even worse; try climbing out from Dacka via Kolkata and you'll know what I mean
3. bust your b@lls for not answering their first, and only, call when you have been trying to raise them for the last 20 minutes on the only two frequencies listed, for that FIR, on the Jepp chart
4. insist on giving you their re-route, that so happens to coincide with your actual flight plan - then its given to you again through every subsequent FIR up until you past the two god damned way points they keep prattling on about.
5. ask for your aircraft registration mark, on initial contact - somehow they believe or read everything on the SITA FLT PLN strip but the rego
6. when you have to listen to a Jet Airways Captain lodge a verbal complaint, for 30 minutes, over the FIR, for being held down by 2000 feet and then being asked to reduce speed by 10 kts for seperation - now that was better than listening to Hancock's Half Hour.
7. always want to know your estimate for your exit point at your entry point (initial call).......like your transiting the whole country through at least five FIRs - guess you gotta keep an accurate record for that revenue.
8. writing your ID number and signing your name in a 2" thick leather bound ledger at the crew entry immigration desk
9. having your overflight permit number questioned
Hope this kicks it off for you fhegner
Last edited by FO Cokebottle; 10th Oct 2009 at 16:57.
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.........when you have to produce your passport at your hotel to receive a letter to take to an office where you produce said letter and go from desk to desk to desk (yes, three) in order to obtain five bottles of Indian Fosters as your allowance for three days stay. (In Ahmedabad)
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..... when the place is full of signs like :
Parking inside is not allowed outside
Callers must enter and speak to receptionist before entering
Free water sold here
Travellers' cheques cashed, service optional
In emergency, contact SOD for assistance extn. 1507
Rajeev Helth products, marbel and concreet division
SCAM, School for Accountancy and Marketing
Hostel, all rooms having water running and full emenetics
Callers must enter and speak to receptionist before entering
Free water sold here
Travellers' cheques cashed, service optional
In emergency, contact SOD for assistance extn. 1507
Rajeev Helth products, marbel and concreet division
SCAM, School for Accountancy and Marketing
Hostel, all rooms having water running and full emenetics
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1. When you smell the **** descending through 13000...
2. When you are told you are #58 for landing and you can talk your way up to #10.
3. When you have to wait for the rw to open for 30 min after the class I NOTAM posted time.
4. When you use 2 tons to wait for parking space.
5. When you fly at MSA for 50 nm (fifty not 25) supposedly under radar control after a rw change.
6. When main rw is closed for maintenance, even if the wx is below minima for the secondary.
7. When they take the number plate of the taxi you get on at arrivals.
8. When ATC doesn't have a clue how many track miles you have to landing.
10.When security sprays your shaving foam in your flight bag. By mistake, of course.
11. When you are stuck in traffic because somebody abandoned an old A310 frame on a major crossroads.
12. When you need to use a spray (the onboard issue type) to kill the mossies in the crew bus at 1 am.
13. When you can smell the stale clothes of same bus driver who has slept on board same bus since he got hired to drive it.
14. When you eat charcoal tablets every time you have a meal - just in case.
15. When you see customs officers holding hands like schoolgirls.
I'll come back to this post tomorrow with another 15 clues, if the mods don't delete it
P.S. When your CP flies there only couple a times a year and on back-to-back flights but sends you there month after month on 4 day layovers.
2. When you are told you are #58 for landing and you can talk your way up to #10.
3. When you have to wait for the rw to open for 30 min after the class I NOTAM posted time.
4. When you use 2 tons to wait for parking space.
5. When you fly at MSA for 50 nm (fifty not 25) supposedly under radar control after a rw change.
6. When main rw is closed for maintenance, even if the wx is below minima for the secondary.
7. When they take the number plate of the taxi you get on at arrivals.
8. When ATC doesn't have a clue how many track miles you have to landing.
10.When security sprays your shaving foam in your flight bag. By mistake, of course.
11. When you are stuck in traffic because somebody abandoned an old A310 frame on a major crossroads.
12. When you need to use a spray (the onboard issue type) to kill the mossies in the crew bus at 1 am.
13. When you can smell the stale clothes of same bus driver who has slept on board same bus since he got hired to drive it.
14. When you eat charcoal tablets every time you have a meal - just in case.
15. When you see customs officers holding hands like schoolgirls.
I'll come back to this post tomorrow with another 15 clues, if the mods don't delete it
P.S. When your CP flies there only couple a times a year and on back-to-back flights but sends you there month after month on 4 day layovers.
Last edited by dessas; 11th Oct 2009 at 04:39. Reason: last clue
1.You request a weather deviation on HF, and by the time ATC get back to you the weather is now behind.
2.Reduce to minimum clean speed at the boundary.
3.Tractors are used on the apron
2.Reduce to minimum clean speed at the boundary.
3.Tractors are used on the apron
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do the needful
I am almost conversant with the phrase "to do the needful"
but when our ops manager sent an email starting like this I was really puzzled (and still am):
"Captains, please not for needful"
the email was in relation to our airport passes which have not been issued yet (we only requested them 3.5 months ago), so the subject line of the email read "Pilot for passes"
but when our ops manager sent an email starting like this I was really puzzled (and still am):
"Captains, please not for needful"
the email was in relation to our airport passes which have not been issued yet (we only requested them 3.5 months ago), so the subject line of the email read "Pilot for passes"
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Two that come to mind as I sit here nodding my head at the above-
1. Roj. Why is every RT call acknowledged with roj. Everytime we step outside supposed ICAO radio calls or criteria, they bust our balls, but they, ATC, are taught a new word on day 1 of training, i.e., roj.
2. I'm sick of my fillings falling out everytime we roll down the runway on take-off!!
More to come!!!
1. Roj. Why is every RT call acknowledged with roj. Everytime we step outside supposed ICAO radio calls or criteria, they bust our balls, but they, ATC, are taught a new word on day 1 of training, i.e., roj.
2. I'm sick of my fillings falling out everytime we roll down the runway on take-off!!
More to come!!!
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Only in India can you see people camping beside the main runway at a major airport between the hold short line and the runway edge (CCU where the other day one of the campers was taking a **** on the edge of the taxiway, totally ignorant of the 100 people staring at him!)
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"Total on board through security" so he can fill it in his 6" leather bound ledger!!! And then pull out some carbon paper, (I didn't think this stuff still existed, but maybe just in India), and copy it down in triplicate. Then go and get it stamped six times by six different people. On the way out the door and back into the building while trying to find the six different people to give the six same stamps, getting held up by an army/ policeman interrogating his ID card, promising he'll have the bribe ready for him later, just a bit busy right now.
When you call "ready/established" and they ask if you are "fully Ready/Fully established" (no i'm only half ready, wadda you think!!!)
After being given long and complicated re routing instructions, which you take 12 calls to read back, you ask for direct to the next waypoint, and all you get is "Approved"
Idiots
After being given long and complicated re routing instructions, which you take 12 calls to read back, you ask for direct to the next waypoint, and all you get is "Approved"
Idiots
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Well we Brits have ourselves to blame for some of this. The multiple copies, with carbon paper, was intended to make sure there were many cross checks and thus avoid corruption, that system worked very well until about 1947.
On ATC, remember the person you talk to, especially on HF, is a radio operator, not a controller and he works under the same 15Watt bulb that is universal throughout India, in a dingy office with flies and a very slow ceiling fan with equipment that dates back many decades and has been kept running only because of the TLC and devotion of a few dedicated engineers who get paid less than a cup of Starbucks coffee for a days work and have to put up with torrential downpours of rain that cause them severe problems but, as always, there is no money left in the budget to fix it! Guess why!
The radio Operator will take down your request, or his sidekick will and it will be passed to the Assistant Controller who will, when he gets a chance, pass it to the Controller, the Controller will then make his decision and it will be passed back down the chain. No point at all in trying to discuss anything with the Radio Operator, they have no authority. No place on earth better to see demarcation at work than India, and yes, we taught them that too as a way to make more people self sufficient through employment, wicked colonials that we were!
India charges the same dollar rates for ATC as anywhere else but each dollar has to stretch a whole lot further. Look at Indian railways for an example of thousands of people gainfully employed and supporting families when just a few degrees of automation would throw large numbers out on the streets, unemployed and starving, India doesn't have a very good welfare record.
Non of the above goes to excuse the rampant corruption in India but until that can be stamped out then we have to live with what they offer. I got very irritated when overflying India with 15 minutes separation due 'no radar' but just try cutting a corner or two and you would soon be told that you were "4.3 miles left of the centreline" the military radar works very well but they didn't, (then), use it to control civil traffic.
I suppose my point is that, as the end user, there is no point at all in getting cross with the HF radio Operator or the 'controllers' on non radar sectors, sorry, I have gone on a bit!
On ATC, remember the person you talk to, especially on HF, is a radio operator, not a controller and he works under the same 15Watt bulb that is universal throughout India, in a dingy office with flies and a very slow ceiling fan with equipment that dates back many decades and has been kept running only because of the TLC and devotion of a few dedicated engineers who get paid less than a cup of Starbucks coffee for a days work and have to put up with torrential downpours of rain that cause them severe problems but, as always, there is no money left in the budget to fix it! Guess why!
The radio Operator will take down your request, or his sidekick will and it will be passed to the Assistant Controller who will, when he gets a chance, pass it to the Controller, the Controller will then make his decision and it will be passed back down the chain. No point at all in trying to discuss anything with the Radio Operator, they have no authority. No place on earth better to see demarcation at work than India, and yes, we taught them that too as a way to make more people self sufficient through employment, wicked colonials that we were!
India charges the same dollar rates for ATC as anywhere else but each dollar has to stretch a whole lot further. Look at Indian railways for an example of thousands of people gainfully employed and supporting families when just a few degrees of automation would throw large numbers out on the streets, unemployed and starving, India doesn't have a very good welfare record.
Non of the above goes to excuse the rampant corruption in India but until that can be stamped out then we have to live with what they offer. I got very irritated when overflying India with 15 minutes separation due 'no radar' but just try cutting a corner or two and you would soon be told that you were "4.3 miles left of the centreline" the military radar works very well but they didn't, (then), use it to control civil traffic.
I suppose my point is that, as the end user, there is no point at all in getting cross with the HF radio Operator or the 'controllers' on non radar sectors, sorry, I have gone on a bit!
Last edited by parabellum; 25th Oct 2009 at 13:12. Reason: spelling
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It is called a sub-class 410 temporary residents visa for retirees, (over 55), valid ten years, (recently upped from four) and allows unlimited work. Best one could do over 45, max age for immigration unless filthy rich, (or on a boat!).
This sub-class visa no longer available. Replaced by a 405 visa which requires oodles of dosh both to get initially and subsequently to renew.
Still hope for PR/citizinship one day. No plans to ever leave, it is just too nice for that!.
This sub-class visa no longer available. Replaced by a 405 visa which requires oodles of dosh both to get initially and subsequently to renew.
Still hope for PR/citizinship one day. No plans to ever leave, it is just too nice for that!.
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A few month ago my frankness able me to enter the depature terminal II at the Indira Gandhi airport, 7 hours prior to check-in (max 2 hours allowed and hardly enough when you concider the normal chaos at the X-ray machines at check-in counter) the alternative was outdoor in the 44 C temperature or the 32 C visitor socalled 'lounge' with entrace fee: $ 1 ( what the choolies make in a day) and the place was stuffed NFW!
3-4 hours went by, had found a less noisy cozy corner. Recharging my thinkpad and even manage to use the wi-fi (just need your indian airtel mobile number - the first thing to acquire when arrive!). Nice new cool marble to sit on and the floorcleaning-walla - now with machine (!) - nicly avoided me with a big smile!
Suddenly two very serious looking gentelmen in jeans t-**** and a huge Motorola stood in front of me. When was my flight wanna see e-ticket. Passport visa aso: The the black book came out....who was the guard who let me in...? (i'd choosen the oldest they never really check anything, bad eyesight even when wearing classes model Gandhi the Elder, lucky he was now of duty') .... every frincking data was handwritten pace 4th grade.
"Mr.....This is very serious offence!"
****, see myself 50 or more bucks poorer. Eventually they ask my to stay put, wich of course i did. Soon ie 50 mins later, two very uniformed top-brass turned up. Same story, this time I noticed that HIS black book was twice the size...at least 100x2 bucks I thought....scheisse.
I was about to ask if they accepted Visa/master card, when suddenly a lotta staccato talk sounded from their mobiles... some kalebalic somewhere ells. Saved by the bell...was escorted to the exit and pointet toward the 'lounge' where I due to a little social enginering got in for free.
Never a dull moment on the Subcontinent....nice... Keeps one awake!
3-4 hours went by, had found a less noisy cozy corner. Recharging my thinkpad and even manage to use the wi-fi (just need your indian airtel mobile number - the first thing to acquire when arrive!). Nice new cool marble to sit on and the floorcleaning-walla - now with machine (!) - nicly avoided me with a big smile!
Suddenly two very serious looking gentelmen in jeans t-**** and a huge Motorola stood in front of me. When was my flight wanna see e-ticket. Passport visa aso: The the black book came out....who was the guard who let me in...? (i'd choosen the oldest they never really check anything, bad eyesight even when wearing classes model Gandhi the Elder, lucky he was now of duty') .... every frincking data was handwritten pace 4th grade.
"Mr.....This is very serious offence!"
****, see myself 50 or more bucks poorer. Eventually they ask my to stay put, wich of course i did. Soon ie 50 mins later, two very uniformed top-brass turned up. Same story, this time I noticed that HIS black book was twice the size...at least 100x2 bucks I thought....scheisse.
I was about to ask if they accepted Visa/master card, when suddenly a lotta staccato talk sounded from their mobiles... some kalebalic somewhere ells. Saved by the bell...was escorted to the exit and pointet toward the 'lounge' where I due to a little social enginering got in for free.
Never a dull moment on the Subcontinent....nice... Keeps one awake!
Last edited by fhegner; 27th Oct 2009 at 03:03.
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in the car en route to the hotel ...
driver needs to brake rather sharply...I instinctively look back to see if the traffic behind us will be able to stop...motorcycle guy is minding his own bussiness and proceeds to slam into the rear of our car and lands his body on our trunk...luckily he is wearing a helmet and so he is only shaken, not hurt...driver gets out and they agree to pull over...instead, the motorbike takes off...driver asks us if he may chase him down (and bypass our hotel)...affirmative...and so we end up in a high speed pursuit dodging traffic and flying over the overpass until we catch up with the fugitive who is licking his sores at the side of the road...driver gets out, snatches the ignition keys from the bike and takes us to our hotel...
felt kinda bad for the biker...
felt kinda bad for the biker...
