Flying for Lion Air
Join Date: Mar 2006
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You can get a 737NG type at Aero Service in Miami right now for $8,000.... What's up with a $24,000 bond at CAE???? I just did a King Air 350 course there in June for a short term contract I had, and CAE had the WORST flight training I have ever experienced..
Aero Services of Miami are on the bottom rung of flight training. Anyone who thinks they can get a B737NG type rating for $8,000 must be a sucker. The $8,000 would barely cover the instuctors.
Join Date: Feb 2007
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Dear Type rating
Guys.....
Is there any Company out there that can employ a pilot with just a type rating?
Say I have 2000hrs on B732 and I go for a B767 type rating on FAA ticket, would that place me on top of a food chain?
Concerned
Is there any Company out there that can employ a pilot with just a type rating?
Say I have 2000hrs on B732 and I go for a B767 type rating on FAA ticket, would that place me on top of a food chain?
Concerned
Join Date: Mar 2006
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I know Aero Service trains for some of the bottom feeders, but the economy has hit the sim training industry hard. The rating has been reduced from their normal price of $14K... It's going back up in a couple of months. If you just want the type.. do you really care?? I did my 737 classic type there and was actually pretty happy with them. I went there expecting the worst, but hey, go pay $24K if it bothers you.. 
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Join Date: May 2009
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Back flying corporate
If anyone is interested, I decided to take a corporate position here in the States. Lion Air would have been an interesting challenge, but there were a lot of concerns and no one to answer any questions. The contract was weak, and the first chance I would have had to speak with anyone from Lion Air would have been AFTER I paid for my type rating and went to Jakarta.
No disrespect to anyone climbing the aviation ladder, but I did hear that you could be paired with a very low time, pay-for-training first officer. In my opinion, to be flying a new jet in an unfamiliar environment is challenge enough even with an experienced first officer, let alone a 300 hour/no jet time co-pilot. I am not saying that a pilot with that experience can not be sharp, only that one of us ought to be very experienced in the airplane/operation.
Lastly, I did talk to a highly experienced American pilot with extensive international experience who did the Lion Air program, and he was very unimpressed with it. Just one person's opinion so take it for what it is worth, but personally I did value it.
Best of luck to all, better days are coming.
No disrespect to anyone climbing the aviation ladder, but I did hear that you could be paired with a very low time, pay-for-training first officer. In my opinion, to be flying a new jet in an unfamiliar environment is challenge enough even with an experienced first officer, let alone a 300 hour/no jet time co-pilot. I am not saying that a pilot with that experience can not be sharp, only that one of us ought to be very experienced in the airplane/operation.
Lastly, I did talk to a highly experienced American pilot with extensive international experience who did the Lion Air program, and he was very unimpressed with it. Just one person's opinion so take it for what it is worth, but personally I did value it.
Best of luck to all, better days are coming.
Join Date: Dec 2006
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I'm currently in Jakarta, and know a captain who was in the same position you were. He decided to take his chances and now is very glad he did. The standards at lionair are rather high and any first officer that is taken on becomes very proficient very fast.
It looks like a huge gamble from the other side of the globe, but once you're in it is very rewarding.
It looks like a huge gamble from the other side of the globe, but once you're in it is very rewarding.
Join Date: Dec 2006
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yes & yes.
although the amount of expats is extremely limited. If you're not on the shortlist right now, chances of getting in are nil. Maybe they'll get permission for more expats later on, but for now they don't.
although the amount of expats is extremely limited. If you're not on the shortlist right now, chances of getting in are nil. Maybe they'll get permission for more expats later on, but for now they don't.
Join Date: Nov 2009
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Lion Air Indonesia
Hello,
I also want to do the Test at CAE, although I do not have the money for the typerating, which in AMS is 28.500 Euros! As one can get it on the free market for about 20.000 Euros, I think about 5.000 Euros is the Comission for Lion Air, same like Ryanair! After 60.000 Euros for the ATPL thats a lot of money, again!
As much as I know about Jakarta and Lion Air,I can tell you: The pay is much less, between 21.000.000 and 26.500.000 IDR, which is between USD 2250 and USD 2600 a month. Lion Air pays for the apartement, electricity, water and cleaning. They also provide transport to and from the Airport and they pay the tax for you, that means that money is the net salary. Illness insurance is provided, dental I am not sure about. If you come alone, you will get a shared apartement with another pilot, if you bring your family, you have an apartement for yourself, no sharing! Lion Air does not pay for an international shool, which is quite expensive, about 1100 USD per month per child!
Jakarta is lousy but fun, the indonesian people are very nice, and it is very helpful if you can speak some Indonesian, to get rid of annoying begglars!
I can not say anything about safety standards, I just say that i would not apply for the MD 80, as I know that the maintenance is far below standard, but the Boeing 737-900s are brandnew and Boeing is responsible for the maintenance in the first years of operation,as far as I know, so they should be in pretty good condition!
The contract is for two years and if it is finished before due to bad behaviour of the pilot, a penalty of USD 10.000 has to be paid!
Holiday is 12 days and work on a bi-weekly basis, whatever that means! The information you get from CAE or Lion Air directly is very rare, you have to ask 10 times to get one answer, I dont like that!
Anyway, I wish you all the best, maybe you have some information about the test at CAE for Lion Air? How does it look like? Especially the Aptitude Test? Any kind of preparation you can recommend?
Tha salary sounds low, but living costs in Jakarta are much below that in Europe or the US, the average indionesian salary is about USD 50 a month! Lion Air about USD 30.000 per year.
If you know indonesian people to help you, you can also get an indonesian house for USD 400 for two years, but I think the apartement sponsored by Lion Air is the better choice! Good luck, Mister!
I also want to do the Test at CAE, although I do not have the money for the typerating, which in AMS is 28.500 Euros! As one can get it on the free market for about 20.000 Euros, I think about 5.000 Euros is the Comission for Lion Air, same like Ryanair! After 60.000 Euros for the ATPL thats a lot of money, again!
As much as I know about Jakarta and Lion Air,I can tell you: The pay is much less, between 21.000.000 and 26.500.000 IDR, which is between USD 2250 and USD 2600 a month. Lion Air pays for the apartement, electricity, water and cleaning. They also provide transport to and from the Airport and they pay the tax for you, that means that money is the net salary. Illness insurance is provided, dental I am not sure about. If you come alone, you will get a shared apartement with another pilot, if you bring your family, you have an apartement for yourself, no sharing! Lion Air does not pay for an international shool, which is quite expensive, about 1100 USD per month per child!
Jakarta is lousy but fun, the indonesian people are very nice, and it is very helpful if you can speak some Indonesian, to get rid of annoying begglars!
I can not say anything about safety standards, I just say that i would not apply for the MD 80, as I know that the maintenance is far below standard, but the Boeing 737-900s are brandnew and Boeing is responsible for the maintenance in the first years of operation,as far as I know, so they should be in pretty good condition!
The contract is for two years and if it is finished before due to bad behaviour of the pilot, a penalty of USD 10.000 has to be paid!
Holiday is 12 days and work on a bi-weekly basis, whatever that means! The information you get from CAE or Lion Air directly is very rare, you have to ask 10 times to get one answer, I dont like that!
Anyway, I wish you all the best, maybe you have some information about the test at CAE for Lion Air? How does it look like? Especially the Aptitude Test? Any kind of preparation you can recommend?
Tha salary sounds low, but living costs in Jakarta are much below that in Europe or the US, the average indionesian salary is about USD 50 a month! Lion Air about USD 30.000 per year.
If you know indonesian people to help you, you can also get an indonesian house for USD 400 for two years, but I think the apartement sponsored by Lion Air is the better choice! Good luck, Mister!
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CAE-Lion Air Assessment
For those who want to pursue the CAE-Lion Air position, here is what I know. Please understand that I completed the process 6 months ago, so things may have changed.
It is strictly a skill and knowledge assessment, no typical interview questions. The simulator profile is roughly 1 hour flying and 1 hour not flying. You will get a very thorough sim briefing via email beforehand. Nothing too unexpected or unfair, but of course you have to hand fly. If you haven't flown full EFIS before, you might want to practice that.
The written test was harder for me. It was 70 questions or so, multiple choice. They seemed to be mainly JAA or EASA ATP test questions. Coming from the States, I had to guess at quite a few. If I had to do it over, I would certainly get a British or European ATP study book and review that. Studying the FAA ATP questions was useless for me as far as preparation for taking the test.
If someone ends up flying the line for Lion Air, let us know how it is going. I can't help but wonder how it would have went if I took the position, but I'm enjoying flying an Astra SPX in the States.
Best Regards,
PMH
It is strictly a skill and knowledge assessment, no typical interview questions. The simulator profile is roughly 1 hour flying and 1 hour not flying. You will get a very thorough sim briefing via email beforehand. Nothing too unexpected or unfair, but of course you have to hand fly. If you haven't flown full EFIS before, you might want to practice that.
The written test was harder for me. It was 70 questions or so, multiple choice. They seemed to be mainly JAA or EASA ATP test questions. Coming from the States, I had to guess at quite a few. If I had to do it over, I would certainly get a British or European ATP study book and review that. Studying the FAA ATP questions was useless for me as far as preparation for taking the test.
If someone ends up flying the line for Lion Air, let us know how it is going. I can't help but wonder how it would have went if I took the position, but I'm enjoying flying an Astra SPX in the States.
Best Regards,
PMH
Join Date: Nov 2009
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Lion Air Conditions
Holiday: 12 days
Shared apartement paid by Lion Air
Free tranport to/from Airport, while on duty
Pay is 20 Mio. IDR basic plus 60.000 per flight-hour, so about 1800 Euros per month, if you fly 90 hours
Contract for two years
If contract has to be finished due to bad behaviour of pilot, a penalty of 10.000 USD has to be paid
Lion also pays for tax, medical and dental insurance, cleaning the apartement and electricity and water, so the money you get is the money you can spend!
Good luck, Guys!
Shared apartement paid by Lion Air
Free tranport to/from Airport, while on duty
Pay is 20 Mio. IDR basic plus 60.000 per flight-hour, so about 1800 Euros per month, if you fly 90 hours
Contract for two years
If contract has to be finished due to bad behaviour of pilot, a penalty of 10.000 USD has to be paid
Lion also pays for tax, medical and dental insurance, cleaning the apartement and electricity and water, so the money you get is the money you can spend!
Good luck, Guys!
Join Date: Sep 2009
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lion air
Hi..
....i am an FAA/ICAO CPL/IR/Multi with 2179 hrs total and 1515hrs on multi turbo prop......this is what they told me yesterday when i send them an e-mail?
Thank you for your email, regret that We unable to follow up your intention, actually we are not hiring expatriate Pilots, but we have a mutual agreement with Eagle Jet from Miami.
here is the contact lion air:
Recruiting manager..Capt: Nuryanto
e-mail: [email protected]
Tel- +62 21 6326038 ext: 2605
cheers..
....i am an FAA/ICAO CPL/IR/Multi with 2179 hrs total and 1515hrs on multi turbo prop......this is what they told me yesterday when i send them an e-mail?
Thank you for your email, regret that We unable to follow up your intention, actually we are not hiring expatriate Pilots, but we have a mutual agreement with Eagle Jet from Miami.
here is the contact lion air:
Recruiting manager..Capt: Nuryanto
e-mail: [email protected]
Tel- +62 21 6326038 ext: 2605
cheers..
Join Date: Nov 2009
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apartement
Hi, do you know where the apartements are? I know Jakarta
Pretty good, just nice to know! So the copilot salary is lower
Than they promise? They said to me about 26 Mio. IDR, which is
1800 USD! Any idea about the SIM-Checkrides, where they are
Held? And about roster? But especially the housing is in my
Interest, are there any fotos in the Internet? Thank you very much!
Pretty good, just nice to know! So the copilot salary is lower
Than they promise? They said to me about 26 Mio. IDR, which is
1800 USD! Any idea about the SIM-Checkrides, where they are
Held? And about roster? But especially the housing is in my
Interest, are there any fotos in the Internet? Thank you very much!
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Just a small adjustment to info of "INDONESIA" ....if the FO salary is around 26 mil. Rupiah then this will be around 2900 US as the rate nowadays is just 1 dollar to 8850 rupiah ...just checked it here yesterday . For those looking for some "good" flying and getting jet-experience go for it . Even next to the flying you will have a great time .....Indonesian people are nice and it is a nice place to be ....even if it is just for some life-experience ...........
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but the Boeing 737-900s are brandnew and Boeing is responsible for the maintenance in the first years of operation,as far as I know, so they should be in pretty good condition!
But then, that's nothing new.And just a few weeks ago... several pilots got called for a "meeting" at one of the hangout places here... where the company "asked for help" to fly in December because the annuals of those pilots have run out...
Again, nothing new.But yes... don't even touch their MD80s unless you fancy flying by QRH Abnormals a lot of the times!
(one colleague who quit cited his reason as "when you know the QRH off the top of your head, you know it's time to move on to something else!")And their audit results to go to Australia? Wonder why it's rejected at least 2x on safety grounds... BUT, things may have changed in as little as a year
the average indionesian salary is about USD 50 a month!
20 Mio IDR basic + 60,000 per hour? Is that for F/O or Cpt? If for F/O, it's OK, if it's for Cpt... it's a total rip off! Even for the locals ! (Oh hang on, that's their F/O pay right?)
F/O for 26mio does make sense though, plus 60k an hr...
If contract has to be finished due to bad behaviour of pilot, a penalty of 10.000 USD has to be paid
Anyone fancy US$3000 basic plus US$70 an hour in Indonesia?
There's some pressure for the company to let expats fly in that company... Let's hope it happens.My view on Lion seems rather dismal/depressing on the safety aspect... but, there are those in the company working very hard to improve it... Let's hope they win !
But, whatever it is, welcome to Indonesia to those joining whichever airline for whichever pay... Enjoy it... and let's have a beer sometime.
Oceanfly, Now, why am I not surprised to read that? Sometimes I think no one knows anything around here
