Housing allowance SIA Cargo
Join Date: Feb 2004
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You would think, but no way would the girl ride in a Taxi all by herself...(eeeewwwww Da-ad!) At least on the bus she can ride with her friends and there's a "bus aunty" to keep the yukky boys in line! Well worth the $$$...
Nemo Me Impune Lacessit
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I get your point but was thinking along the lines of four kids sharing and splitting the cost with others, assuming you have some cooperative neighbours in the same boat as you.
Join Date: Apr 2001
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housing costs.
Hi gents.
I have been in SIN for over 10 years, and I am not singaporean.
I think there is one huge factor to consider.
When I came to SIN, I resigned myself to never being able to afford to own a house or car in Singapore. When I first came, apartment rental prices were very high, as were car COE's. I rented in a condo that I could afford. Friends of mine in other countries had 2000sq ft apartments or landed properties, but I had a 1000sq ft apartment......I lived in my means.
As time passed, and after 9-11 and SARS the housing market tanked.
When prices dropped, I gained from lower rental costs, to my pleasure. here is the point...... Although when prices dropped, I could have afforded to "upgrade" my accommodation and live on Orchard Road, I chose not to, I maintained my standard of living and aprtment location.
Many of the people hurting now, have fallen victim of living somewhere that was slightly unrealistic, but they did not realise this. I will expand. Pilots arriving in Singapore 3 years ago, were able to rent a good landed property well located, or a nice large condo in a central area (as I could have done too) because of the abnormally low rents after SARS and 9-11. the problem is, that having no experience of the Singapore market, they didnt realise HOW CHEAP the rents were 2-3 years ago. They considered this normal. Actually they were fortunate to be living in places that I could never dream of living in when I first came to SIN over ten years ago. Therefore they "set their goalposts" at that level. An unrealistic level.
Now the rents have gone up to more realistic levels, if you look at the history of Singapore, and the economic development, these unexpectedly unrealistic "goalposts" have now been smashed. This is indeed regrettable, and no real fault of the Pilots, nor the company.
When I first came to SIN, very few expat pilots would plan to live in district 9 or 10, and not many would have 2500sq ft apartments even on the east coast. The case now is the same for new joiners....the only problem is that up until a year or so ago, some of our colleagues thought that the above styles of living were normal (as they were affordable at that time), but now realise they were under a false impression.
My advise.....naturally, pressurise the company for more HA...as anyone would, but also consider moving out to somewhere less central. There is still plenty of affordable condos in pasir ris or other areas and of a decent standard...and bide your time for the rental allowance to improve, or for the market to drop again in a few years (not expected real soon). For those of you who have children at schools, then this is part of the regrettable adjustments too. Do what you have to do in tougher times, thats the best we can do!
Final note....It is still possible to buy in outer areas.....and use your allowance to pay the mortgage.......I dont say its an easy choice, but it should not be ignored.
Good luck to all!
for those of you buying cars......when i first came here, a COE of $80,000 was not unusual for a two litre car! See, its not all bad news for newish joiners!
I have been in SIN for over 10 years, and I am not singaporean.
I think there is one huge factor to consider.
When I came to SIN, I resigned myself to never being able to afford to own a house or car in Singapore. When I first came, apartment rental prices were very high, as were car COE's. I rented in a condo that I could afford. Friends of mine in other countries had 2000sq ft apartments or landed properties, but I had a 1000sq ft apartment......I lived in my means.
As time passed, and after 9-11 and SARS the housing market tanked.
When prices dropped, I gained from lower rental costs, to my pleasure. here is the point...... Although when prices dropped, I could have afforded to "upgrade" my accommodation and live on Orchard Road, I chose not to, I maintained my standard of living and aprtment location.
Many of the people hurting now, have fallen victim of living somewhere that was slightly unrealistic, but they did not realise this. I will expand. Pilots arriving in Singapore 3 years ago, were able to rent a good landed property well located, or a nice large condo in a central area (as I could have done too) because of the abnormally low rents after SARS and 9-11. the problem is, that having no experience of the Singapore market, they didnt realise HOW CHEAP the rents were 2-3 years ago. They considered this normal. Actually they were fortunate to be living in places that I could never dream of living in when I first came to SIN over ten years ago. Therefore they "set their goalposts" at that level. An unrealistic level.
Now the rents have gone up to more realistic levels, if you look at the history of Singapore, and the economic development, these unexpectedly unrealistic "goalposts" have now been smashed. This is indeed regrettable, and no real fault of the Pilots, nor the company.
When I first came to SIN, very few expat pilots would plan to live in district 9 or 10, and not many would have 2500sq ft apartments even on the east coast. The case now is the same for new joiners....the only problem is that up until a year or so ago, some of our colleagues thought that the above styles of living were normal (as they were affordable at that time), but now realise they were under a false impression.
My advise.....naturally, pressurise the company for more HA...as anyone would, but also consider moving out to somewhere less central. There is still plenty of affordable condos in pasir ris or other areas and of a decent standard...and bide your time for the rental allowance to improve, or for the market to drop again in a few years (not expected real soon). For those of you who have children at schools, then this is part of the regrettable adjustments too. Do what you have to do in tougher times, thats the best we can do!
Final note....It is still possible to buy in outer areas.....and use your allowance to pay the mortgage.......I dont say its an easy choice, but it should not be ignored.
Good luck to all!
for those of you buying cars......when i first came here, a COE of $80,000 was not unusual for a two litre car! See, its not all bad news for newish joiners!
Join Date: Jun 2001
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A balanced post on the face of it In the slot.
However, please let me expand.
If the basic salary of an SIA Cargo pilot was industry standard before Housing Allowance I would be inclined to agree with you 100%, but it is not. Not by any means.
Industry standard (Best Practice - call it what you like) is that when employing expats the host company either provides suitable housing (rents directly from landlord) or provides an allowance for such housing. If they do not do this then market forces take over and pilots leave. That is now starting to happen.
Sure, the economics of Singapore have altered but so has the global demand for pilots. If SIA C don't up the ante pdq they could well struggle to crew flights. Worse, they could be stuck with a few disgruntled pilots who want to leave but can't afford to because of the bond.
However, please let me expand.
If the basic salary of an SIA Cargo pilot was industry standard before Housing Allowance I would be inclined to agree with you 100%, but it is not. Not by any means.
Industry standard (Best Practice - call it what you like) is that when employing expats the host company either provides suitable housing (rents directly from landlord) or provides an allowance for such housing. If they do not do this then market forces take over and pilots leave. That is now starting to happen.
Sure, the economics of Singapore have altered but so has the global demand for pilots. If SIA C don't up the ante pdq they could well struggle to crew flights. Worse, they could be stuck with a few disgruntled pilots who want to leave but can't afford to because of the bond.
Join Date: Apr 2001
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Bananas, yes I agree.
My post was made taking into account getting a fixed amount of housing benefit through the ups and downs of a property market (and the SQC/SIA allowance, I guess, has remained pretty much fixed!).
As mentioned in my post, I fully understand why crew should push for a higher HA. I just wanted to highlight the fact that not only should the HA maybe be re addressed, but also maybe SOME crew have a somewhat higher expectation of what and where their accommodation should be in Singapore. Naturally, quality of life a city offers is not merely down to the size of an apartment or house. As usual, a reasonable solution normally lies somewhere between the extremes of both opinions!
Market forces are now fully in effect, and being felt.
Naturally, if SQC does not pay what MOST of the crew deem reasonable, then maybe people will start moving. No doubt this will have to start to happen for allowances to increase.
My sympathies with those facing this tough decision.
Do your homework.......the Dirham has dropped about 25% over the last 2 years against most hard currencies, except the USD with which it is linked!
Good luck to all!
My post was made taking into account getting a fixed amount of housing benefit through the ups and downs of a property market (and the SQC/SIA allowance, I guess, has remained pretty much fixed!).
As mentioned in my post, I fully understand why crew should push for a higher HA. I just wanted to highlight the fact that not only should the HA maybe be re addressed, but also maybe SOME crew have a somewhat higher expectation of what and where their accommodation should be in Singapore. Naturally, quality of life a city offers is not merely down to the size of an apartment or house. As usual, a reasonable solution normally lies somewhere between the extremes of both opinions!
Market forces are now fully in effect, and being felt.
Naturally, if SQC does not pay what MOST of the crew deem reasonable, then maybe people will start moving. No doubt this will have to start to happen for allowances to increase.
My sympathies with those facing this tough decision.
Do your homework.......the Dirham has dropped about 25% over the last 2 years against most hard currencies, except the USD with which it is linked!
Good luck to all!
Join Date: Jun 2001
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Do your homework.......the Dirham has dropped about 25% over the last 2 years against most hard currencies, except the USD with which it is linked!
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Hi Feeloh,
If you dont have anything constructive to say just remain silent. It is just that kind of attitude that makes it unpleasant for expatriates to express themselves. Consider why so many companies and countries need expatriates before you make such bitter comments
If you dont have anything constructive to say just remain silent. It is just that kind of attitude that makes it unpleasant for expatriates to express themselves. Consider why so many companies and countries need expatriates before you make such bitter comments
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Hi TI,
What a biggot you are and a trouble maker. If you are so insecure and secular just keep you opinions to yourself, or if you are so envious go and become an expat yourself! what is your answer to expats who work here for foreign multi-national like myself, go and set up office in K,L think about it you complete moron !
What a biggot you are and a trouble maker. If you are so insecure and secular just keep you opinions to yourself, or if you are so envious go and become an expat yourself! what is your answer to expats who work here for foreign multi-national like myself, go and set up office in K,L think about it you complete moron !
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Dear Thermal Image and Feeloh
It take that you concurr with my comments on these issues and that you are just in it to be biggots and cause trouble and walk away!
I will take both your silence as a yes on both counts.
Wake up people and see the bigger picture!
I will take both your silence as a yes on both counts.
Wake up people and see the bigger picture!
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Housing Allowance Increased
hi lads,
i just heard that the management has decided to increase this allowance to S$ 4200 wef from 1st july 2007.
this is some relief.
flying my pants off man from the 25 hours a month it has reached 80 hours per month looks like things are up, the new year may bring joy!!!!!!!
i just heard that the management has decided to increase this allowance to S$ 4200 wef from 1st july 2007.
this is some relief.
flying my pants off man from the 25 hours a month it has reached 80 hours per month looks like things are up, the new year may bring joy!!!!!!!
Join Date: Sep 2006
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CARGOJOCK
Pleased that your hours are up. So that readers on the outside of SIAC don't get the impression that things are coming up roses here for all, my hours:
SEP 51 (one day of training)
OCT 54
NOV 58
DEC 30 scheduled (one day or training scheduled)
Not to mention the horrendous way the now constant trip disruptions are handled by rostering. But, I suppose things could be worse. I have moved my fishing pole from storage to my living room though. That option is becoming more attractive as every month passes.
Happy Holidays
PQ
Pleased that your hours are up. So that readers on the outside of SIAC don't get the impression that things are coming up roses here for all, my hours:
SEP 51 (one day of training)
OCT 54
NOV 58
DEC 30 scheduled (one day or training scheduled)
Not to mention the horrendous way the now constant trip disruptions are handled by rostering. But, I suppose things could be worse. I have moved my fishing pole from storage to my living room though. That option is becoming more attractive as every month passes.
Happy Holidays
PQ
Join Date: Jun 2001
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Housing Allowance has been referred to Ministry of Manpower for mediation.
Join Date: Jun 2001
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In many ways it is already too late.
When I started flying the line for SIA Cargo the talk amongst crew was of destinations, nights out, social events etc. Now, the first topic of conversation is invariably when and where we are attending job interviews.
If there had been an ounce of goodwill from the company, time consuming mediation by the Ministry of Manpower would not have been necessary.
Unfortunately there has been no goodwill demonstrated whatsoever and SIA Cargo is now starting to reap what it has sewn.
When I started flying the line for SIA Cargo the talk amongst crew was of destinations, nights out, social events etc. Now, the first topic of conversation is invariably when and where we are attending job interviews.
If there had been an ounce of goodwill from the company, time consuming mediation by the Ministry of Manpower would not have been necessary.
Unfortunately there has been no goodwill demonstrated whatsoever and SIA Cargo is now starting to reap what it has sewn.
Join Date: Jul 2002
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Bananas
So can I take it that you are now no longer the recruiting sergeant for SIA Cargo? I cannot keep up with you as you have been on and off my list almost monthly!!
There has not been any goodwill from Management in SQ since the '97 SE Asian financial crisis as at every opportunity to lower T & C's they have grasped it citing some crisis or other around the world regardless as to whether it affects the bottom line.
So can I take it that you are now no longer the recruiting sergeant for SIA Cargo? I cannot keep up with you as you have been on and off my list almost monthly!!
There has not been any goodwill from Management in SQ since the '97 SE Asian financial crisis as at every opportunity to lower T & C's they have grasped it citing some crisis or other around the world regardless as to whether it affects the bottom line.
