Air Japan (AJX) B767
Join Date: Dec 2008
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Thank you, gtseraf. I could find address of Cae Parc office in Japan. It is Ginza Daiei Building 5F, 1-16-7 Ginza, Chuo-ku Tokyo, 104-0061,Tokyo Japan.
But I could not find any information of Crew's office in Japan. Anybody does have information about Crew office in Japan?
Samurai
But I could not find any information of Crew's office in Japan. Anybody does have information about Crew office in Japan?
Samurai
Join Date: Dec 2008
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Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: 日本
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I think 'sample' rosters are a bit pointless because there are far too many variables and I can tell you mine looks absolutely nothing like GTSeraf, so you're not going to get a feel for the flying that we do by examining a snapshot of a couple of months of work. The best thing to do is just assume that while you're in Japan then you're there to work and that you'll be visiting China a lot. There is plenty of day to night swapping, since the schedulers still do not seem to be able to grasp the fact that this is not a good thing. Occasionally you'll go to some nicer places, like BKK or SGN but some seem to get these trips more than others! Just plan on working 6 days in 7, getting disrupted sleep because of the day/night swaps and being an expert on PVG, CAN and XMN.....and then enjoying the very flexible days off system (it's why so many are still here). If you feel you can cope with this then apply. If it doesn't suit you then save yourself filling out the forms.
Join Date: Oct 2006
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Adding to what Frate wrote...., It is true that everyone is not getting the same roster variations but besides that, what you need to understand is not what the rosters look like today for a new joiner but rather what they will look a year from now when somebody that is just starting the application process will actually be on the line.
As the 78 starts to get populated and takes on the passenger routes that are being done now on the 76, then the 76 at AJX will most likely be an all freighter operation with mostly China trips, the few Bangkok, Singapore cargo trips will be mostly for the first born preferred children, the redhead stepchild (A.K.A. New hire) will be doing nothing but freighter China trips with a mix of day trips and short rest overnight trips.
I don't mean to bring a sour note and like the rest of us I'm really just taking a guess as to how things will develop, but I believe this will be the most likely scenario.
As the 78 starts to get populated and takes on the passenger routes that are being done now on the 76, then the 76 at AJX will most likely be an all freighter operation with mostly China trips, the few Bangkok, Singapore cargo trips will be mostly for the first born preferred children, the redhead stepchild (A.K.A. New hire) will be doing nothing but freighter China trips with a mix of day trips and short rest overnight trips.
I don't mean to bring a sour note and like the rest of us I'm really just taking a guess as to how things will develop, but I believe this will be the most likely scenario.
Join Date: Feb 2001
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Compared to what else is out there in the contract world this is still a good gig.
Yes the roster can be brutal at times, other times not so much.
So for all wannabes my advise is: Stop looking at and asking for details and instead take a good look in the mirror.
Am I ready to leave home for 17 days each month and work a hard schedule in a foreign land with a very different culture?
The reward being a brilliant days off system, fully booked commute in C-class, a pretty descent pay and working with a bunch of good guys, then this job is for You😉
Respectfully
HD
Yes the roster can be brutal at times, other times not so much.
So for all wannabes my advise is: Stop looking at and asking for details and instead take a good look in the mirror.
Am I ready to leave home for 17 days each month and work a hard schedule in a foreign land with a very different culture?
The reward being a brilliant days off system, fully booked commute in C-class, a pretty descent pay and working with a bunch of good guys, then this job is for You😉
Respectfully
HD
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Just a little to the left. Little more...
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HD, Frate, Dom, et al - Is it possible just to grab a quick PM/info about how the day off system works? The brutal rostering I'm already used to, and everything else sounds like a breath of fresh air compared to the Mid East!
I've already thrown in an application with Crew, looking forward to hopefully seeing some of you guys in the future!
I've already thrown in an application with Crew, looking forward to hopefully seeing some of you guys in the future!
Join Date: Nov 2008
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You get 10 days off per month (actually 120 days off per year). You also get 2 commuting days each month, plus 24 days of vacation per year.
Some people will take 10 + 2 + 2 each month. Others will take 10 + 2 and save the vacation to be used in bigger blocks. It's all really up to you and it is the best bit of working for AJX. If they mucked around with the days off system then many would be looking elsewhere.
You can back-to-back months so, for instance, take the last 14 days of one month and the first 14 of the next. You'll then find yourself in Japan for a long time until the next lot of days off come around but at least you're able to do such a thing.
If you wanted to use, say, 4 days at the end of one month and 10 into the next, then that's fine. As you can see, it's very flexible and works 99% of the time.
Basically, you put in your days off request before the end of month, 2 months ahead (if you see what I mean). So February's days off request needs to be submitted by the end of December. On the 4th of each month AJX draw a line under the work moved around with ANA and they then start writing the rosters.....manually!! Occasionally they may run out of pilots and they might call you before 4th and ask you to move your days off. If you're able then it's a good thing to help out and do so. If you can't then they usually understand and move to the next pilot.
Vacation can be 'forward used'. By that I mean you don't have to accrue the 2 days each month before you can spend it. The leave year starts 1 Apr and if you 'spent' 12 days of vacation in Apr (plus your normal days off etc) then you just don't have the ability to add 2 vacation days to each month for the rest of the year.
The commuting days were put in place to attempt to protect your actual days off at home as days off i.e. not flying to or from Japan. The schedulers try, to a greater or lesser extent, to finish people early (ish) on their last day of work and, occasionally, start them late on their first day of work. Clearly this cannot work for everybody, especially if you take you days off along with others at popular times (month's end/start). If you do finish early then you can get going home on the last day of work and may only eat a bit into your commuting day. Same as the late start but you do have to be in Japan a minimum of 9 hours before report, so you can rest before a trip and this normally means being in a lot earlier than that.
We've been lucky enough to have this system for quite some time but it is starting to creak a bit at the seams, now we have many more pilots than previously. You might think that would give them more flexibility but their response is that they get more requests and, therefore, it is more difficult to keep everyone happy. The BIG problem is those who, as happens everywhere, spoil it for everyone by being selfish idiots and doing stupid things. Some have come back on ZED tickets (who are not 'tracked' by AJX) and arrived way too late before a trip. Others have gone home on ZED tickets when they're still on standby, 'because they can't use me'. Those sort of things that will eventually lead to the Company treating everybody as only the idiots should be treated and that will ruin the, currently excellent, system. If you use C class then the Company can see when you're coming and going and if it's not right then they'll tell you to change your ticket request.
I should also say that you can break your days off into shorter stints as well. Obviously, those that live in Japan might break them up into 4 blocks of 3.....just as an example.....whereas someone who lives in Hong Kong (made-up person) might want to have 2 blocks of 6. HKG being close and relatively easy to commute. The contract does talk of concurrent days but, as I said, they have been much more flexible than that and long may that continue.
Christmas, like every other company in the world, is a bit different and we have a system that is designed to allow a fair share of time off, based on what you've done the previous 3 years. I'm not going to complicate things by attempting to describe the whole thing but it's fair and you can see where you lie in the big scheme of things, so you can plan ahead. Just don't expect every Christmas off because it's not going to happen!
I think that's enough writing :-)
Some people will take 10 + 2 + 2 each month. Others will take 10 + 2 and save the vacation to be used in bigger blocks. It's all really up to you and it is the best bit of working for AJX. If they mucked around with the days off system then many would be looking elsewhere.
You can back-to-back months so, for instance, take the last 14 days of one month and the first 14 of the next. You'll then find yourself in Japan for a long time until the next lot of days off come around but at least you're able to do such a thing.
If you wanted to use, say, 4 days at the end of one month and 10 into the next, then that's fine. As you can see, it's very flexible and works 99% of the time.
Basically, you put in your days off request before the end of month, 2 months ahead (if you see what I mean). So February's days off request needs to be submitted by the end of December. On the 4th of each month AJX draw a line under the work moved around with ANA and they then start writing the rosters.....manually!! Occasionally they may run out of pilots and they might call you before 4th and ask you to move your days off. If you're able then it's a good thing to help out and do so. If you can't then they usually understand and move to the next pilot.
Vacation can be 'forward used'. By that I mean you don't have to accrue the 2 days each month before you can spend it. The leave year starts 1 Apr and if you 'spent' 12 days of vacation in Apr (plus your normal days off etc) then you just don't have the ability to add 2 vacation days to each month for the rest of the year.
The commuting days were put in place to attempt to protect your actual days off at home as days off i.e. not flying to or from Japan. The schedulers try, to a greater or lesser extent, to finish people early (ish) on their last day of work and, occasionally, start them late on their first day of work. Clearly this cannot work for everybody, especially if you take you days off along with others at popular times (month's end/start). If you do finish early then you can get going home on the last day of work and may only eat a bit into your commuting day. Same as the late start but you do have to be in Japan a minimum of 9 hours before report, so you can rest before a trip and this normally means being in a lot earlier than that.
We've been lucky enough to have this system for quite some time but it is starting to creak a bit at the seams, now we have many more pilots than previously. You might think that would give them more flexibility but their response is that they get more requests and, therefore, it is more difficult to keep everyone happy. The BIG problem is those who, as happens everywhere, spoil it for everyone by being selfish idiots and doing stupid things. Some have come back on ZED tickets (who are not 'tracked' by AJX) and arrived way too late before a trip. Others have gone home on ZED tickets when they're still on standby, 'because they can't use me'. Those sort of things that will eventually lead to the Company treating everybody as only the idiots should be treated and that will ruin the, currently excellent, system. If you use C class then the Company can see when you're coming and going and if it's not right then they'll tell you to change your ticket request.
I should also say that you can break your days off into shorter stints as well. Obviously, those that live in Japan might break them up into 4 blocks of 3.....just as an example.....whereas someone who lives in Hong Kong (made-up person) might want to have 2 blocks of 6. HKG being close and relatively easy to commute. The contract does talk of concurrent days but, as I said, they have been much more flexible than that and long may that continue.
Christmas, like every other company in the world, is a bit different and we have a system that is designed to allow a fair share of time off, based on what you've done the previous 3 years. I'm not going to complicate things by attempting to describe the whole thing but it's fair and you can see where you lie in the big scheme of things, so you can plan ahead. Just don't expect every Christmas off because it's not going to happen!
I think that's enough writing :-)
Frate has summed it up pretty well.
Just to add a personal observation about back to back days off. It is possible to combine days off but that normally leads to doing a double stint in Japan. Beware! With the way we are worked, in general, this could lead to doing 30 days or more at 6 on 1 off, with a pretty brutal schedule. Very good way to feel like a total zombie at the end of it.
Just to add a personal observation about back to back days off. It is possible to combine days off but that normally leads to doing a double stint in Japan. Beware! With the way we are worked, in general, this could lead to doing 30 days or more at 6 on 1 off, with a pretty brutal schedule. Very good way to feel like a total zombie at the end of it.
Join Date: Dec 2009
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Frate - Mate, thanks heaps for the huge explanation of how it works, way way more detail than I expected! I'll grab you a drink of your choice when I make it over!
gt - I sometimes feel like I'm doing something similar over here, but good to know!
gt - I sometimes feel like I'm doing something similar over here, but good to know!
Join Date: Apr 2006
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Fratemate and Dominican (and HD!), a good example of how the prune should be: some great info from you gents, thank-you for your time.
Just wish AJX would consider non-JCAB DECs!
Just wish AJX would consider non-JCAB DECs!
Join Date: Dec 2010
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I wish it didn't take them 6+ months to push someone through the hiring cycle.
Where I am now, if it takes 6 weeks to hire someone, they have likely already found another job before your offer goes out.
Where I am now, if it takes 6 weeks to hire someone, they have likely already found another job before your offer goes out.
Join Date: Jun 2011
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I have the feeling that will change (slowly) in the near future.
And I also think the 787 will happen sooner than one might think for a new joiner. Japan needs a lot of people, no way around that
And I also think the 787 will happen sooner than one might think for a new joiner. Japan needs a lot of people, no way around that
Join Date: Nov 2017
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I am still considering this position very seriously, but with a young family the idea of leaving them for 6 months while I learn how to tune and identify an NDB on a ground trainer (joking but I'm told the initial training is aimed at 0 hour cadets) is hard to deal with. I really hope they decide to streamline the process for guys with a few thousand hours on a wide body to make the job more appealing.
I'll monitor this thread in hope for any changes to the induction and word on the 787!
Cheers for all the great info guys, certainly makes it easier to make an informed decision.
I'll monitor this thread in hope for any changes to the induction and word on the 787!
Cheers for all the great info guys, certainly makes it easier to make an informed decision.
APBabySitter.
I understand your concerns, they have been an issue since the start of operations in 2001 and they are very valid concerns. Try being away on course when your latest child is born, has happened to many of us.
Many of us have suggested a change to the way things are done, in order to make the job more attractive. So far nothing has changed, I do not expect anything to change, so the choice is jump in or walk away.
The 787, as things stand, is not an option for newhires, how things work out in the future, your guess is as good as mine. It will probably end up being the senior fleet, at this stage selection is based on seniority for Captains. If this continues for F/O's, well, plan on joining on the 767. I understand the plans are to keep the 767 freighters for a long time.
Trying to be as realistic as possible, not negative.
I understand your concerns, they have been an issue since the start of operations in 2001 and they are very valid concerns. Try being away on course when your latest child is born, has happened to many of us.
Many of us have suggested a change to the way things are done, in order to make the job more attractive. So far nothing has changed, I do not expect anything to change, so the choice is jump in or walk away.
The 787, as things stand, is not an option for newhires, how things work out in the future, your guess is as good as mine. It will probably end up being the senior fleet, at this stage selection is based on seniority for Captains. If this continues for F/O's, well, plan on joining on the 767. I understand the plans are to keep the 767 freighters for a long time.
Trying to be as realistic as possible, not negative.
Join Date: Nov 2017
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APBabySitter.
I understand your concerns, they have been an issue since the start of operations in 2001 and they are very valid concerns. Try being away on course when your latest child is born, has happened to many of us.
Many of us have suggested a change to the way things are done, in order to make the job more attractive. So far nothing has changed, I do not expect anything to change, so the choice is jump in or walk away.
The 787, as things stand, is not an option for newhires, how things work out in the future, your guess is as good as mine. It will probably end up being the senior fleet, at this stage selection is based on seniority for Captains. If this continues for F/O's, well, plan on joining on the 767. I understand the plans are to keep the 767 freighters for a long time.
Trying to be as realistic as possible, not negative.
I understand your concerns, they have been an issue since the start of operations in 2001 and they are very valid concerns. Try being away on course when your latest child is born, has happened to many of us.
Many of us have suggested a change to the way things are done, in order to make the job more attractive. So far nothing has changed, I do not expect anything to change, so the choice is jump in or walk away.
The 787, as things stand, is not an option for newhires, how things work out in the future, your guess is as good as mine. It will probably end up being the senior fleet, at this stage selection is based on seniority for Captains. If this continues for F/O's, well, plan on joining on the 767. I understand the plans are to keep the 767 freighters for a long time.
Trying to be as realistic as possible, not negative.
I fly 777's now and a 787 is just a fancy 777
so the aircraft type doesn't really bother me. The idea of flying a 767 actually sounds like a fun change.As for the training you are totally right, I just need to make a decision one way or the other and commit to it. Cheers
AJX does not own any aircraft, it dry leases them from ANA then wet leases them back (I think that's how it works).
Most of the flights we operate are an ANA callsign, except for 1 pax and 1 cargo pattern which use the Air Japan call sign.
Our cabin crew are all dedicated AJX cabin crew, though we have had some ANA cabin attendants on secondment to us.
Our management and check pilots are all ANA pilots on temporary secondment to AJX, as are most of the office staff.
Most of the flights we operate are an ANA callsign, except for 1 pax and 1 cargo pattern which use the Air Japan call sign.
Our cabin crew are all dedicated AJX cabin crew, though we have had some ANA cabin attendants on secondment to us.
Our management and check pilots are all ANA pilots on temporary secondment to AJX, as are most of the office staff.