Air Japan (AJX) B767
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Over the Pacific mostly
Posts: 1,043
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
They continue to hire DEC's due to the fact that we have a deficit to be able to cover the current flying (little alone take any new flying) although we are fat on captains (kind to think of it, we have always been fat on captains) and the priority is to hire F/O's they will hire DEC when a suitable applicant comes around, there are two DEC's on the latest class. The highest attrition is on F/O's with guys from the US being the majority in search of nirvana.
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: 日本
Posts: 456
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
737lpa,
If you apply you will apply as a DEC and they will accept that application because you are qualified as such. You will train and 'test' as a DEC. I have not heard of any DEC being offered FO, in the pretty unlikely event of not getting through.
Given your qualifications, I would think it very likely you would pass the course. Although not absolute (and there have been some quite big surprises), the ones who are not successful are normally those that cannot just shut their mouths about what they've done before and just pretend the Japanese way of doing things is great :roll eyes: We all know it's not and we all know there are far better ways of operating but, at the end of the day, it's their train set and so you just keep your head down and say 'thank you' when you're told a complete load of crap by one of the Japanese instructors. It's all a game and all you've got to do is play it by their rules for 6 or 7 months. Once you're on the line you'll find it is a LOT more relaxed and, for the most part, like any other airline you've ever flown for......but without the 64 sectors per day of RYR
As Mr Dominican says; they are still short of pilots and will recruit you as a DEP. The agencies are sometimes quite surprised because they find what they think are very suitable applicants but, for reasons only known to themselves, AJX do not even put them through the selection process. With this in mind, if you apply and are asked to attend the interview then there's a good chance you're already a LONG way to getting the job.
Good luck and let us know how you get along.
If you apply you will apply as a DEC and they will accept that application because you are qualified as such. You will train and 'test' as a DEC. I have not heard of any DEC being offered FO, in the pretty unlikely event of not getting through.
Given your qualifications, I would think it very likely you would pass the course. Although not absolute (and there have been some quite big surprises), the ones who are not successful are normally those that cannot just shut their mouths about what they've done before and just pretend the Japanese way of doing things is great :roll eyes: We all know it's not and we all know there are far better ways of operating but, at the end of the day, it's their train set and so you just keep your head down and say 'thank you' when you're told a complete load of crap by one of the Japanese instructors. It's all a game and all you've got to do is play it by their rules for 6 or 7 months. Once you're on the line you'll find it is a LOT more relaxed and, for the most part, like any other airline you've ever flown for......but without the 64 sectors per day of RYR
As Mr Dominican says; they are still short of pilots and will recruit you as a DEP. The agencies are sometimes quite surprised because they find what they think are very suitable applicants but, for reasons only known to themselves, AJX do not even put them through the selection process. With this in mind, if you apply and are asked to attend the interview then there's a good chance you're already a LONG way to getting the job.
Good luck and let us know how you get along.
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Over the Pacific mostly
Posts: 1,043
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The Excel hotel is still the main choice for the ones that have chosen the hotel route because of the price mainly but also because they will store your bags and regular transportation to the airport and to town (Narita) but many pilots have apartments now.
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Earth
Posts: 91
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
"The reason we are so excited to have you join as a Direct Entry Captain is because the last 3 DEC's that joined AJX are all unemployed now."
I understand that this job has that bit of a gamble, but I think I could come back to RYR after a year with my head down, should I fail the training, and get my job back. I've been here long enough for that and those irishmen can always use a known troubleless driver like me. It's not like I plan to slam the door on the way out.
Besides, if I fail, I would have still gotten paid for 9 months, with hotel paid for, and have the chance to experience Japan and their ways, not to mention the SIM experience and training which will definetely help me on my next hunting spree.
What I don't understand that much though, is why are you "so excited" about seeing 3 people go down the drain...
I can only think that maybe some of you who are inside think that by not getting people to apply, management would struggle somewhat and improve terms, which I can sympathize with, although everyone knows that they will keep coming. Or maybe some disappointed F/O's who were waiting for their upgrade obviously don't appreciate DEC's applying and jumping the q, which I can totally understand even more.
In any case, don't forget that I'm coming from RYR, and that is pretty much the bottom of the pyramid, so don't think I don't understand these feelings because I have been contracting myself for over 2 olympic games now and if you think your management is playing rough on you, wait until you fly an aircraft with a blue arp on its tail where you stir you own coffe in a plastic cup of hot water while you see your conditions degrade for every single mile you fly.
I have definetely valued your comments on the risk of not suceeding, and I'm most grateful for your advice, but from where I'm coming from, I'll just be happy if they manage to put a stop to my deglamourization process and teach me how to grab a fork and knife again and how to put a tie around my neck in the morning, something I haven't done in quite some time now.
If on top of that I'm lucky enough to learn how to fly a heavy boat on a decent carrier, while making twice my pay and flying half the hours in a new and challenging environment, I'll just consider it the icing on the cake...
I understand that this job has that bit of a gamble, but I think I could come back to RYR after a year with my head down, should I fail the training, and get my job back. I've been here long enough for that and those irishmen can always use a known troubleless driver like me. It's not like I plan to slam the door on the way out.
Besides, if I fail, I would have still gotten paid for 9 months, with hotel paid for, and have the chance to experience Japan and their ways, not to mention the SIM experience and training which will definetely help me on my next hunting spree.
What I don't understand that much though, is why are you "so excited" about seeing 3 people go down the drain...
I can only think that maybe some of you who are inside think that by not getting people to apply, management would struggle somewhat and improve terms, which I can sympathize with, although everyone knows that they will keep coming. Or maybe some disappointed F/O's who were waiting for their upgrade obviously don't appreciate DEC's applying and jumping the q, which I can totally understand even more.
In any case, don't forget that I'm coming from RYR, and that is pretty much the bottom of the pyramid, so don't think I don't understand these feelings because I have been contracting myself for over 2 olympic games now and if you think your management is playing rough on you, wait until you fly an aircraft with a blue arp on its tail where you stir you own coffe in a plastic cup of hot water while you see your conditions degrade for every single mile you fly.
I have definetely valued your comments on the risk of not suceeding, and I'm most grateful for your advice, but from where I'm coming from, I'll just be happy if they manage to put a stop to my deglamourization process and teach me how to grab a fork and knife again and how to put a tie around my neck in the morning, something I haven't done in quite some time now.
If on top of that I'm lucky enough to learn how to fly a heavy boat on a decent carrier, while making twice my pay and flying half the hours in a new and challenging environment, I'll just consider it the icing on the cake...
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: 日本
Posts: 456
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
737lpa,
It is very true that AJX is not what AJX & AJV used to be and they have got a long way to go before we will be the happy bunnies we used to be. Some things have improved, such as the introduction of the commuting days but those have been paid for, in the main, by the AJV pilots losing a day off and the AJV captains having their pay reduced. Yes, all the pilots are now on the same terms and conditions but the Company does still wonder why many of us were not singing their praises at the changes. Basically, I bought an extra day off per month whether I liked it or not, in order to placate myself after the complete balls-up they made of the 'integration'. The point I'm trying to make is there are still a lot of unhappy pilots, AJX needs to address a fair few points to get it right and I am not some happy-clappy driver who thinks all is well in the company.
However, I am not as bitter as some and whereas I think I know the reason for PoinDexter's vitriol, I'm not getting into that. I think he was trying to stress that nothing is guaranteed and if you fail then you're out of a job but I would ask if there's any place where this isn't true. I have to admit I was surprised by one of the DECs. He seemed to be doing everything right; he'd got through the type and ATPL checks and basically flunked the 'Captain' check (or wasn't put up for it being more accurate). A very personable pilot who kept his head down and certainly seemed to be making the right noises at the right time; it was certainly a shock when I heard he wasn't here any more. The others were less of a surprise from reports I've heard. I won't discuss them any more, as it is unfair to them and based on hearsay but it will ALWAYS be the case with ALL airlines that some people aren't suited to either that airline, that aircraft or that culture and so they don't get through.
They have already suffered the consequences of their mis-managed 'integration' and managed to piss-off so many of us that word quickly spread throughout the aviation circles, leading to a dramatic reduction of applicants. They have been forced to improve conditions and that has been a good thing and, should they continue, they'll get back the support and encouragement that we always used to give, leading to full classes whenever they ran them (which is not the case now). Yes, it is good to have a few cards up our sleeves to force their hand but I don't think any of us think we have the ability to influence the Company through our Internet comments.
AJX don't have a quota to fill in terms of a balance of captains and first officers. They would promote every FO if their turn came up and they jumped through all the hoops. That's not to say there are not extenuating reasons for FOs not getting the 'nod'. Some are political (especially with the Japanese FOs), some are valid (in that the FO is not ready.....how touchy-feely was that 
) and some are just plain stupid, making you realise some of the Japanese 'management' really don't have a clue. However, the point I'm making, badly, is that DECs don't jump the queue and they don't harm the FOs chances of upgrading.
It is important that you do come here with your eyes open. There will be a lot of angst caused by travelling half way round the world to go to work. There will be even more caused if you have a family and are not home regularly, even if it is for a short time. It's great having a big block of time off at home but you can guarantee the washing machine will pack up the instant you leave to go to Japan for 3 or 4 weeks and Skype is crap for fixing leaking pipes. Flying somewhere different is good for a while but it will become just as tedious as flying the same routes elsewhere. As for flying something bigger; well I reckon they're all the same size once the flight deck door is closed, so I'm not into all of this 'wide body' crap. Again, in my bad point-making, I'm trying to say it is certainly not bright and rosy and some aspects will be worse than RYR. However, this is not China and you're not dealing with the Chinese, who I wouldn't entertain flying for even if I was out of a job. You'd be coming in with the expectations of the salary you'd receive now, unlike a good deal of us who have seen it plummet and if you're happy with that remuneration then that's god for you. The Japanese are bonkers but they're generally decent, polite, respectful people and it's a far, far better place to work than a good deal of other places. The aircraft are the best maintained you will ever find anywhere in the world and they have all the bells and whistles fitted.
So long as you come here with all this in mind and are still happy to do so and you're prepared to just buckle down, play the game and tell them how marvellous their advice is, then you'll almost certainly be fine. The guy who surprised us by not getting through was just that; one guy. Compare and contrast that with those who have got through and also those who didn't but just about everybody knew they wouldn't.
PS: Cross country = everything outside the circuit. Don't get bogged down with it, just knock off all the time you mucked around in a Cessna doing circuits (technically I think it's within 7nm of the airfield) and the rest is cross country.
It is very true that AJX is not what AJX & AJV used to be and they have got a long way to go before we will be the happy bunnies we used to be. Some things have improved, such as the introduction of the commuting days but those have been paid for, in the main, by the AJV pilots losing a day off and the AJV captains having their pay reduced. Yes, all the pilots are now on the same terms and conditions but the Company does still wonder why many of us were not singing their praises at the changes. Basically, I bought an extra day off per month whether I liked it or not, in order to placate myself after the complete balls-up they made of the 'integration'. The point I'm trying to make is there are still a lot of unhappy pilots, AJX needs to address a fair few points to get it right and I am not some happy-clappy driver who thinks all is well in the company.
However, I am not as bitter as some and whereas I think I know the reason for PoinDexter's vitriol, I'm not getting into that. I think he was trying to stress that nothing is guaranteed and if you fail then you're out of a job but I would ask if there's any place where this isn't true. I have to admit I was surprised by one of the DECs. He seemed to be doing everything right; he'd got through the type and ATPL checks and basically flunked the 'Captain' check (or wasn't put up for it being more accurate). A very personable pilot who kept his head down and certainly seemed to be making the right noises at the right time; it was certainly a shock when I heard he wasn't here any more. The others were less of a surprise from reports I've heard. I won't discuss them any more, as it is unfair to them and based on hearsay but it will ALWAYS be the case with ALL airlines that some people aren't suited to either that airline, that aircraft or that culture and so they don't get through.
I can only think that maybe some of you who are inside think that by not getting people to apply, management would struggle somewhat and improve terms, which I can sympathize with, although everyone knows that they will keep coming.
Or maybe some disappointed F/O's who were waiting for their upgrade obviously don't appreciate DEC's applying and jumping the q, which I can totally understand even more.
) and some are just plain stupid, making you realise some of the Japanese 'management' really don't have a clue. However, the point I'm making, badly, is that DECs don't jump the queue and they don't harm the FOs chances of upgrading.It is important that you do come here with your eyes open. There will be a lot of angst caused by travelling half way round the world to go to work. There will be even more caused if you have a family and are not home regularly, even if it is for a short time. It's great having a big block of time off at home but you can guarantee the washing machine will pack up the instant you leave to go to Japan for 3 or 4 weeks and Skype is crap for fixing leaking pipes. Flying somewhere different is good for a while but it will become just as tedious as flying the same routes elsewhere. As for flying something bigger; well I reckon they're all the same size once the flight deck door is closed, so I'm not into all of this 'wide body' crap. Again, in my bad point-making, I'm trying to say it is certainly not bright and rosy and some aspects will be worse than RYR. However, this is not China and you're not dealing with the Chinese, who I wouldn't entertain flying for even if I was out of a job. You'd be coming in with the expectations of the salary you'd receive now, unlike a good deal of us who have seen it plummet and if you're happy with that remuneration then that's god for you. The Japanese are bonkers but they're generally decent, polite, respectful people and it's a far, far better place to work than a good deal of other places. The aircraft are the best maintained you will ever find anywhere in the world and they have all the bells and whistles fitted.
So long as you come here with all this in mind and are still happy to do so and you're prepared to just buckle down, play the game and tell them how marvellous their advice is, then you'll almost certainly be fine. The guy who surprised us by not getting through was just that; one guy. Compare and contrast that with those who have got through and also those who didn't but just about everybody knew they wouldn't.
PS: Cross country = everything outside the circuit. Don't get bogged down with it, just knock off all the time you mucked around in a Cessna doing circuits (technically I think it's within 7nm of the airfield) and the rest is cross country.
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: SI
Age: 44
Posts: 128
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
commuting
Hi all,
I am thinking of applying for FO and I got a few questions regarding commuting. As I understand there are 14 day off available (yearly leave included ;10+2+2).
-that is per month? so 14 days off and 16 or 17 days on?
- is it possible when and if you finish early on your last work day to catch a direct flight to your home destination? Got yourself +1 day. So you are at home 13 whole days.
Thanks for explanation.
Cheers,
A
I am thinking of applying for FO and I got a few questions regarding commuting. As I understand there are 14 day off available (yearly leave included ;10+2+2).
-that is per month? so 14 days off and 16 or 17 days on?
- is it possible when and if you finish early on your last work day to catch a direct flight to your home destination? Got yourself +1 day. So you are at home 13 whole days.
Thanks for explanation.
Cheers,
A
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Over the Pacific mostly
Posts: 1,043
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
-that is per month? so 14 days off and 16 or 17 daysA
- is it possible when and if you finish early on your last work day to catch a direct flight to your home destination? Got yourself +1 day. So you are at home 13 whole days.
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Earth
Posts: 91
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
After 72 hours of sorting out my x-country time, I can proudly say that I have sent my application to Parc, which they have succesfully accepted and forwarded to AJX today.
I will post the next event, shoud there be one, that is...
Many Thanks to all the contributors to this post, including the uppers, the downers, the ones who left this gig, the ones who stayed, the ones who keep saying they're gonna leave but never actually do (we have hundreds of those in RYR, including myself), and in summary, the good fellow contractors out there.
PS: Just one more quick thing that is not very clear to me by reading this entire thread: Is there any training involved before actually flying the line?
I will post the next event, shoud there be one, that is...
Many Thanks to all the contributors to this post, including the uppers, the downers, the ones who left this gig, the ones who stayed, the ones who keep saying they're gonna leave but never actually do (we have hundreds of those in RYR, including myself), and in summary, the good fellow contractors out there.
PS: Just one more quick thing that is not very clear to me by reading this entire thread: Is there any training involved before actually flying the line?
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Over the Pacific mostly
Posts: 1,043
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Training
It is not as much teaching you how to operate the 767 in regular line operations as it is a rehearsal for a play to be presented to an individual that will criticize you on wether your response to the PM calling "minimums" for a circling approach was "continue" or "check" to the play critic that will be of the outmost importance instead of your deviation from speed or altitude, the understanding of that philosophy early in the training seems to be the difference between the people that cruise through it and those that need to be placed on suicide watch.
We get very little factual information from the training center as to why individuals did not make it, the stories that we do get have taken a life of their own and seem to be different from actual occurrences 10 fold, the only thing that we know for sure in the case of the DEC in recent times that made it all the way to the company check before the JCAB check just to be let go at the end is that we for sure do not know what happen, if it was just an unceremonious way of playing politics just to be cruel or they keep trying to pump money to salvage quarter of a million dollar investment of a trained pilot, we will never know because the training center managements doesn't let us in their decision making process. One thing I do know, bs spreads very easily out here on the line and when it does get to you, is nowhere near the bulls original droppings.
M
I'll try to post what I believe is the key to a successful training here at AJX's one big happy family.
1) "Calls and SOP's"
This is where the majority of your concentration at the early stages of training should be placed, you MUST learn all calls (and we have a very chatty cockpit here) and sing them out at the correct time during the very scripted sim session as if it was second nature, don't worry if you blow through your altitude by 150 feet or if you can't keep the speed within 10 knots, if you make your required calls you will be OK, I just cannot stress this enough, they know that they will give you (if I may use a Texas unit of measurement here) a **** load of sim sessions to get your hand flying under control so they are not worried, but if you are still struggling by sim 6 with the calls and SOP's, even if you are the best damn hand flyer on the planet, they will interpret that as that you don't care too much about learning it the ANA way, you need to sit in the CBT at the training center with your partner and do some chair flying and get familiar with all our calls or nothing else matters, if you think that many of our calls are over kill or you know of a more efficient way from a previous life or you might have a sincere suggestion to make things better, KEEP IT TO YOURSELF
2) Follow the script
Repeat after me, "It is a rehearsal" not a sim session, you will be given a training manual that has all the lessons on it and you will know what malfunction will come and when during the lesson it will come, be prepared for it, tab your QRH in the checklists you will need for that lesson and only take the approaches that you will need for that lesson, you will know what ILS, VOR or NDB approach you will shoot so the time to take them out of the binder is before you enter the sim, not when the PF calls to prepare for the approach, they view you going through a binder looking for a plate or fumbling trough the QRH looking for the appropriate check list as you not beeing organized and prepared, you have a script in fron of you, take it with you to the sim and while there are a few seconds of inactivity for the PM while you are waiting to intercept the inbound course (there is a good minute or more that you are just sitting there as a PM) grab your QRH and flip it to the next checklist you will use, is on the script, you already know which one it is, grab the next approach plate and have it on the top so that the observer ( the play critic) interprete this as you are studying hard and that you are prepared for the lesson, make notes on your plate, sim profile for the day to remind you of the calls and timing of the calls, highlight frequencies and altitudes, on the plates and use them as a reminder of the timing you need to make calls, highliting stuff means you are studying they LOVE IT.
3) Learn the SIMISMS
The sofwere on our sims have some bad habits that are not on the actual airplanes and they will come out at the worst times during a sim session, one of the things is that when you divert back to the origin airport (and you will know when that will happen, it is on the script) and you select the approach to be conducted, the normal operator will look on the last pages for the RWY center line intercept, bring it to the first legs page top, make the inbound course bib and execute, right? Fat dumb and happy! Well, the FMS's on the sim will give you a string of discontinuities that will take you more than a few attempts to get rid off, all while the play observer is sitting there thinking, "This guy doesn't know how to use the FMS" but nobody tells you the FMS has that glitch nor they tell you how to fix it, they expect you to figure this on your own but the correct time is NOT in front of your sim instructor because he is not really an instructor, he is a critic, there is no instruction here, there is criticism of you performance.
The best way to bypass this glitch is before you select the approach, go to the last fix on the legs and bring it to the top of the first leg, in effect erasing all the other points on the legs and just leaving the last fix on the first legs page and execute, then you can go to the DEP/ARR page and select the approach and extend the center line as you normaly would, this prevents the discontinuities and will save you from being perceived as not understanding the FMS, this believe it or not has been the undoing of many people here. Also the set up of the NDB approach the way they want it to be set up is a little conversome and it does take some practice so the time to do it is not with your instructor in the sim because there isn't one, there is a critic there that will interprete this as you being fumbling through it. I have the solution for that too, there is a contraption on the training center called "the FMS trainer" the best way I found to be proficient at setting this approaches in a short period of time was to go on my day off, start up the thing and just set the approaches (both the ILS and NDB) over and over again including the technique described above to prevent the discontinuities, I did it over and over again until it just took me a few seconds
to set up even the conversome NDB approach, the FMS trainer has a schedule on that room so if there is nobody scheduled to use it, just go in a learn how to bypass these SIMISMS quickly.
4) How to deal with your critics job?
As I said before there is very little in terms of instruction here, there is observation of your performance and criticicim afterwards, take notes to everything they say and if you disagree or agree with what is being said you will still agree in the group setting, during a normal sim session there will be 4 people there and during progress checks up to 6 , including you and your sim partner, after the briefing is complete, if you have a question or a disagreement or need clarification on anything, take your sim instructor apart of the group, and one on one you can ask, then you inform your sim partner of the correct information, also during progress checks you will be criticized for something that was opposite to what your instructor was teaching you, DO NOT, bring it up during the debrief, just nod and write it down, then take your instructor a side and bring up the discrepancy, him and the progress checker both have ANA badges with low employee numbers on them so they can sort it out without your help.
These are some of the gotchas that I have seen and heard people fall into from guys that went trough training and from some of the company RTC's I hope you find it useful.
We get very little factual information from the training center as to why individuals did not make it, the stories that we do get have taken a life of their own and seem to be different from actual occurrences 10 fold, the only thing that we know for sure in the case of the DEC in recent times that made it all the way to the company check before the JCAB check just to be let go at the end is that we for sure do not know what happen, if it was just an unceremonious way of playing politics just to be cruel or they keep trying to pump money to salvage quarter of a million dollar investment of a trained pilot, we will never know because the training center managements doesn't let us in their decision making process. One thing I do know, bs spreads very easily out here on the line and when it does get to you, is nowhere near the bulls original droppings.
M
I'll try to post what I believe is the key to a successful training here at AJX's one big happy family.
1) "Calls and SOP's"
This is where the majority of your concentration at the early stages of training should be placed, you MUST learn all calls (and we have a very chatty cockpit here) and sing them out at the correct time during the very scripted sim session as if it was second nature, don't worry if you blow through your altitude by 150 feet or if you can't keep the speed within 10 knots, if you make your required calls you will be OK, I just cannot stress this enough, they know that they will give you (if I may use a Texas unit of measurement here) a **** load of sim sessions to get your hand flying under control so they are not worried, but if you are still struggling by sim 6 with the calls and SOP's, even if you are the best damn hand flyer on the planet, they will interpret that as that you don't care too much about learning it the ANA way, you need to sit in the CBT at the training center with your partner and do some chair flying and get familiar with all our calls or nothing else matters, if you think that many of our calls are over kill or you know of a more efficient way from a previous life or you might have a sincere suggestion to make things better, KEEP IT TO YOURSELF
2) Follow the script
Repeat after me, "It is a rehearsal" not a sim session, you will be given a training manual that has all the lessons on it and you will know what malfunction will come and when during the lesson it will come, be prepared for it, tab your QRH in the checklists you will need for that lesson and only take the approaches that you will need for that lesson, you will know what ILS, VOR or NDB approach you will shoot so the time to take them out of the binder is before you enter the sim, not when the PF calls to prepare for the approach, they view you going through a binder looking for a plate or fumbling trough the QRH looking for the appropriate check list as you not beeing organized and prepared, you have a script in fron of you, take it with you to the sim and while there are a few seconds of inactivity for the PM while you are waiting to intercept the inbound course (there is a good minute or more that you are just sitting there as a PM) grab your QRH and flip it to the next checklist you will use, is on the script, you already know which one it is, grab the next approach plate and have it on the top so that the observer ( the play critic) interprete this as you are studying hard and that you are prepared for the lesson, make notes on your plate, sim profile for the day to remind you of the calls and timing of the calls, highlight frequencies and altitudes, on the plates and use them as a reminder of the timing you need to make calls, highliting stuff means you are studying
they LOVE IT. 3) Learn the SIMISMS
The sofwere on our sims have some bad habits that are not on the actual airplanes and they will come out at the worst times during a sim session, one of the things is that when you divert back to the origin airport (and you will know when that will happen, it is on the script) and you select the approach to be conducted, the normal operator will look on the last pages for the RWY center line intercept, bring it to the first legs page top, make the inbound course bib and execute, right? Fat dumb and happy! Well, the FMS's on the sim will give you a string of discontinuities that will take you more than a few attempts to get rid off, all while the play observer is sitting there thinking, "This guy doesn't know how to use the FMS" but nobody tells you the FMS has that glitch nor they tell you how to fix it, they expect you to figure this on your own but the correct time is NOT in front of your sim instructor because he is not really an instructor, he is a critic, there is no instruction here, there is criticism of you performance.
The best way to bypass this glitch is before you select the approach, go to the last fix on the legs and bring it to the top of the first leg, in effect erasing all the other points on the legs and just leaving the last fix on the first legs page and execute, then you can go to the DEP/ARR page and select the approach and extend the center line as you normaly would, this prevents the discontinuities and will save you from being perceived as not understanding the FMS, this believe it or not has been the undoing of many people here. Also the set up of the NDB approach the way they want it to be set up is a little conversome and it does take some practice so the time to do it is not with your instructor in the sim because there isn't one, there is a critic there that will interprete this as you being fumbling through it. I have the solution for that too, there is a contraption on the training center called "the FMS trainer" the best way I found to be proficient at setting this approaches in a short period of time was to go on my day off, start up the thing and just set the approaches (both the ILS and NDB) over and over again including the technique described above to prevent the discontinuities, I did it over and over again until it just took me a few seconds
to set up even the conversome NDB approach, the FMS trainer has a schedule on that room so if there is nobody scheduled to use it, just go in a learn how to bypass these SIMISMS quickly.
4) How to deal with your critics job?
As I said before there is very little in terms of instruction here, there is observation of your performance and criticicim afterwards, take notes to everything they say and if you disagree or agree with what is being said you will still agree in the group setting, during a normal sim session there will be 4 people there and during progress checks up to 6 , including you and your sim partner, after the briefing is complete, if you have a question or a disagreement or need clarification on anything, take your sim instructor apart of the group, and one on one you can ask, then you inform your sim partner of the correct information, also during progress checks you will be criticized for something that was opposite to what your instructor was teaching you, DO NOT, bring it up during the debrief, just nod and write it down, then take your instructor a side and bring up the discrepancy, him and the progress checker both have ANA badges with low employee numbers on them so they can sort it out without your help.
These are some of the gotchas that I have seen and heard people fall into from guys that went trough training and from some of the company RTC's I hope you find it useful.
Last edited by The Dominican; 17th Feb 2012 at 05:31.
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Earth
Posts: 91
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Thanks Dominican,
Is definitely going to be challenging, but I get the picture of the DO's and the DON'Ts during the training period and the play that we have to act out. In a way, it's really the same in most places. Maybe just a bit (or greatly) exagerated in AJX.
In any case, I'm just waiting for AJX to reply to my application, which is already challenging enough. I have positive energy though, because I'm not jobless, which I think makes a big difference when looking for a new gig.
If I'm lucky enough to get called for an assesment, I'll be asking here for the latest details on the interview, the technical exam and the SIM sessions, to see if there has been any changes from the past (which is greatly explained on this thread already).
Thanks again and maybe see you down the road in the Jetlag, or whatever is called where you guys exercise your drinking manouvres.
Is definitely going to be challenging, but I get the picture of the DO's and the DON'Ts during the training period and the play that we have to act out. In a way, it's really the same in most places. Maybe just a bit (or greatly) exagerated in AJX.
In any case, I'm just waiting for AJX to reply to my application, which is already challenging enough. I have positive energy though, because I'm not jobless, which I think makes a big difference when looking for a new gig.
If I'm lucky enough to get called for an assesment, I'll be asking here for the latest details on the interview, the technical exam and the SIM sessions, to see if there has been any changes from the past (which is greatly explained on this thread already).
Thanks again and maybe see you down the road in the Jetlag, or whatever is called where you guys exercise your drinking manouvres.
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: in a dirty cockpit
Posts: 431
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hi everyone,
I'm a F/O on B737 EFIS with almost 4000 TT and 3800 on the 73 in Europe. As actually I have no career opportunities here due to the slowdown period here in europe together with financial troubles and an upcoming merge of airlines here (probably leading to some redundancies) I was considering this B767 Non-rated opportunity to bring some fresh air to my life, learn about a different airplane, culture and looking for captain upgrading opportunity.
What's the real situation there? How's the work environment, the training provided and all those things that might be interesting to know for an european guy looking to them?
Thank you very much in advance!
I'm a F/O on B737 EFIS with almost 4000 TT and 3800 on the 73 in Europe. As actually I have no career opportunities here due to the slowdown period here in europe together with financial troubles and an upcoming merge of airlines here (probably leading to some redundancies) I was considering this B767 Non-rated opportunity to bring some fresh air to my life, learn about a different airplane, culture and looking for captain upgrading opportunity.
What's the real situation there? How's the work environment, the training provided and all those things that might be interesting to know for an european guy looking to them?
Thank you very much in advance!
Join Date: Dec 2011
Location: Chicago
Age: 54
Posts: 26
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Come on over and join us if you can tolerate...
Aussie RTC's who are God's gift to aviation
Japanese Management types who are intent on reinventing the wheel
6-8 month training course (away from your family) where you relearn how to fly
Doing your own Jepp revisions every other day
Sweating profusely in your uniform while in the office before you even step foot in the plane
30 minute briefings covering the most mundane items
Being constantly fatigued
Being treated like crap because your an FO
Having a 20% chance of upgrading the first time around
Japanese Managers who are hypocrites
The majority of pilots here are a great bunch to fly with, but I cringe everytime I am paired up with a Jap pilot. If you want to taste Japanese culture and get a sense of what it would be like to work here, watch "Lost in Translation" and take a ball peen hammer to your nuts. Are things really THAT bad in Europe? I'll trade you jobs in a heartbeat, even if it meant a 50% cut in pay. The amount of b.s. we put up with here on a day-to-day basis is astounding. I can't wait for something better to come along.
Aussie RTC's who are God's gift to aviation
Japanese Management types who are intent on reinventing the wheel
6-8 month training course (away from your family) where you relearn how to fly
Doing your own Jepp revisions every other day
Sweating profusely in your uniform while in the office before you even step foot in the plane
30 minute briefings covering the most mundane items
Being constantly fatigued
Being treated like crap because your an FO
Having a 20% chance of upgrading the first time around
Japanese Managers who are hypocrites
The majority of pilots here are a great bunch to fly with, but I cringe everytime I am paired up with a Jap pilot. If you want to taste Japanese culture and get a sense of what it would be like to work here, watch "Lost in Translation" and take a ball peen hammer to your nuts. Are things really THAT bad in Europe? I'll trade you jobs in a heartbeat, even if it meant a 50% cut in pay. The amount of b.s. we put up with here on a day-to-day basis is astounding. I can't wait for something better to come along.
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: in a dirty cockpit
Posts: 431
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
A lot of pilots are leaving Europe for the sand flat countries (UAE).
Europe pretends to be well joined but it isn't. Every country request a good command of the local tongue and, in my opinion, this is enough absurd than what you expect from "Europe".
As you can imagine, this cut out a lot of opportunities for those (a lot) who don't have full command of dutch, german, spanish, portuguese, french etc. (Italy is the exception to the rule but please, avoid it!! Everything is going adrift there).
For those who want to avoid the hot temperatures of UAE, Asia is the alternate choice.
Europe pretends to be well joined but it isn't. Every country request a good command of the local tongue and, in my opinion, this is enough absurd than what you expect from "Europe".
As you can imagine, this cut out a lot of opportunities for those (a lot) who don't have full command of dutch, german, spanish, portuguese, french etc. (Italy is the exception to the rule but please, avoid it!! Everything is going adrift there).
For those who want to avoid the hot temperatures of UAE, Asia is the alternate choice.
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Over the Pacific mostly
Posts: 1,043
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The 6 months do not include line training, this period is for the validation of your Japanese ATPL, basic indoc, systems and sim. If you are typed then is only the ATPL ride with the JCAB but if you are non-type rated then is two rides in the sim with the JCAB and one line check if you are a DEC, the entire process including line training is about 8 months, provided you don't require additional sim sessions.
I don't really think is particularly difficult once you understand how to play the game, but it is long, boring and repetitive, probably the most difficult part is to keep motivated for that length of time. One good thing is that the company will put you up in a very comfortable apartment (small but nice) and you can have your family with you, some guys had their espouses here for the duration.
I don't really think is particularly difficult once you understand how to play the game, but it is long, boring and repetitive, probably the most difficult part is to keep motivated for that length of time. One good thing is that the company will put you up in a very comfortable apartment (small but nice) and you can have your family with you, some guys had their espouses here for the duration.