What the hell is happening in MAS?

[levelflight]

A word about MAS A friend of mine who is working for MAS told me this story: A guy applied to MAS recently together with 9 other guys and they were interviewed, checked out on sim, did all the medicals and exams. It seems that all 6 were selected. All these happened in the midst of the retrenchment!

My question is why recruit when MAS is retrenching?

In the midst of all these, 2 of the selected guys are malaysians and apparantly they have already started training on F50s! It seems that these 2 guys' dads are captains in MAS!

The rest of the guys are apparantly expats who are fresh pilots just out of MFA for the twin otters FO position. They were also told that they were selected although not in B&W. However, they are not hired yet. The reason from MAS "we are retrenching..... so we don't know abt your situation"!

My question is.... if they are retrenching, why did they do all the selection processes? Then how come MAS hired the locals if they are retrenching?

Another joke is, some of these foreigners were called when they were in their home countries. They had to buy their flight tickets and pay for hotel stay, food, etc here! It has been about 2 and a half months already and they have not got a reply! Poor these fellows....!

[levelflight]

Originally Posted by levelflight

A word about MAS A friend of mine who is working for MAS told me this story: A guy applied to MAS recently together with 9 other guys and they were interviewed, checked out on sim, did all the medicals and exams. It seems that all 6 were selected. All these happened in the midst of the retrenchment!

My question is why recruit when MAS is retrenching?

In the midst of all these, 2 of the selected guys are malaysians and apparantly they have already started training on F50s! It seems that these 2 guys' dads are captains in MAS!

The rest of the guys are apparantly expats who are fresh pilots just out of MFA for the twin otters FO position. They were also told that they were selected although not in B&W. However, they are not hired yet. The reason from MAS "we are retrenching..... so we don't know abt your situation"!

My question is.... if they are retrenching, why did they do all the selection processes? Then how come MAS hired the locals if they are retrenching?

Another joke is, some of these foreigners were called when they were in their home countries. They had to buy their flight tickets and pay for hotel stay, food, etc here! It has been about 2 and a half months already and they have not got a reply! Poor these fellows....!

News just in!!!! Thoses expat interviewed and selected for FO position for Twin otter/F50, ALL OF THEM WERE KICKED OUT! They awere all apparantly been selected as they were informed over the phone.......Poor fellows..... spent so much of money for their flight tickets, hotel stay. food just to attend these MAS clowns' interview! Wasted 3 months of their precious time!

Reason from MAS: Route rationalisation..... retrenching.

Hot news...... MAS giving up ALL F50s and Twin Otters to some local company........you all know which one! All Sabah and sarawak routes abandoned!

There's more! 2 other locals who appeared for the same interview got in and currently on training in SIM! Apparantly, these 2 clowns' daddys are MAS captains!

All this happening even after Idris Jala took over "mismanagement" from MAS.... to be " mismanaged " again! Wow well done Idris!

I wish my dad was a captain here.... then i can also get hired amidst the retrenchment process and route rationalisation!!!!!
L

one hell of a joke!

[Cross Check]

Glasshouses...

Perhaps you should ask the Malaysian Government as to why the currrent situation is how it is... very shortly RAS will not be Malaysian Airlines' responsibility and your buddies can thank AirAsia for that desicion

Before you start casting aspersions off the cuff about MAS, Jala, etc would be good if you did a little homework to comprehend the state of play in KUL right now... unfortunately MAS is a behemoth and they are fighting a much more agile opponent and with "a hand tied behind their back" so to speak. The processes you speak of did not just happen overnight, but likely over the last 6 months. The crisis going on at the moment only became publicly apparent at the end of March - internally no one was really sure if the situation would pan out the way it has.

[levelflight]

what the hell is happening?

Cross check..... if an airline calls you up one day, wouldn't you think you will go to give it a shot? Talk of doing my homework.....i have been in KUL for the past 2.5 years and closely monitoring the aviation scenes here! That is in fact my only job! In fact i have been an aviation consultant for a flight school here! You are telling me do my homework?

Well, just to reiterate some points which i think will make you understand this issues. These friends who i was talking abt.....were in their home countries at the time of call for interview. This airline must have been in desperation.... that's why they called someone from other nationality to come and work for them! If a major airline is calling a bunch of people to come for interview....... then what does it tell of the situation in MAS? That too were for FO position for the twin otters! These guys would have imagined the best case scenario.

ALL these guys at the interview apparantly had asked the clowns sitting at the interview rooms why the hell are they hiring when there were roumours of retrenchng and MAS giving up sabah n sarawak routes. They were apparantly told "not to worry about that....... you just wait for our call"!

I was right outside there at MAS building for a meeting at that time and these foreigners chatted with me and since then they have been in touch with me.

Now... will MAS pay for the loss of time and money for the poor fellows? Why must these fellows pay their money for the negligence, irresponsibility, complacency, inconsideration, stupidity,unintelligent decisions of MAS?

you talk abt MAS as behemoth........ ya rite! Such a big, powerful airline that you claim it to be......do they know anything abt planning, organising, leading, monitoring, forercasting or decision making? Maybe they should stop consulting their bomohs too much!

Who told you these all were 6 months process? If they were in a difficult predicament, then why they could hire the 2 locals whos daddys are captains with MAS, within 2 weeks? Mate i am seeing it all.....you need to go and attend to the backlog of your homeworks, mate!

I am throwing profanity at MAs/idris... because nothing can be talked out to get a solution with the clowns of MAS! Their response, which i myself have gone through are typically, "cannot", "I don't know", "....ah...this one you must ask that person", "come next week", " go to that department..."go to this department" "the person in charge not in....off for 2 weeks!".....etc.There is no justice or logic there. I am only left with

[MAStake]

Of course it would be prudent to note that the "opponent" was very much more disadvantaged when the behemoth was strutting around and doing its own thing at the taxpayers expense.

Credit has to be given to Air Asia for, among other things, exposing the incompetence in MAS by proving that domestic flights within Malaysia can be profitable, and not at the expense of Malaysians.

[captain_planet]

Corrupt Airline

And I am one of the expats who did their sim assessment, interview,got selected for twin otter,did the pre emp medical & all paper work & now I am still wasting my time in here.
Well actually good to see somebody is talking abt this.
Can anyone tell me to whon they are selling these F50's & twin Otters to?

[babyboeing400]

where could it be other than AK?

[Cross Check]

Everyone's a critic...

MAStake: I know you've been around a while and through a few hoops before so I'm not gonna argue with ya, but AK always winge they were disadvantaged, but they had a lot of concessions too... Made a profit... yes sir they did in spite of all the internal scandals - and it was in part at the expense of their employees in more ways than one (dare I say medical and Loss of licence premiums not paid...)

BB400: Yup, got it in one. But not "sold" - AK will be ultimately responsible for their operation, but will very likely be sub-contracted.

CptPlanet: You too huh, you have my sympathies. And how long have you been doing all this for? 6 months easy right? I've been at it for 12 months to be standing on the doorstep, but the door is still locked...

LF: Can you see what I'm getting at? And by behemoth I meant slow and lumbering, not mighty and powerful - that would be a juggernaut. The whole application/interview process doesn't happen overnight (hence at least 6 months as I suggested) - I've been doing it for 12 months mah so don't lecture or blast me about not knowing the situation... I'm living it buddy, I get to read the news everyday and know enough people on the inside to know what's going on. I don't like what I see or hear either - but little outbursts like yours don't exactly help our situation either. Prior to March 20th MAS were cautious but upbeat that recruiting was still safe (they were much more pessimistic in Jan/Feb). Between 20-26th it was the Idris & Tony show and on the 27th with the Government announcements MAS HR got "winded". MAS has much to answer for in its long history and Idris has a job and a half on his hands, but it's too easy just to point the finger at MAS and say "your fault"... Tony's star is on the rise (both in the public eye and "behind the scenes"), so what do you want to do about it lah? As for the "special treatment" for a selected few - what airline hasn't done this on many an occasion - you think Qantas and Ansett were angels in this regard... get real, it happens, you can't change it, so live with it... particularly in Malaysia.

[bfd777]

RAS Subcontract

Hmmm, could you imagine if AK subbed the rural service out to Transmile? Or`perhaps it would be Hornbill? Which would yield the most political mileage at the right price?

[levelflight]

Originally Posted by Cross Check

LF: Can you see what I'm getting at? And by behemoth I meant slow and lumbering, not mighty and powerful - that would be a juggernaut. The whole application/interview process doesn't happen overnight (hence at least 6 months as I suggested) - I've been doing it for 12 months mah so don't lecture or blast me about not knowing the situation... I'm living it buddy, I get to read the news everyday and know enough people on the inside to know what's going on. I don't like what I see or hear either - but little outbursts like yours don't exactly help our situation either. Prior to March 20th MAS were cautious but upbeat that recruiting was still safe (they were much more pessimistic in Jan/Feb). Between 20-26th it was the Idris & Tony show and on the 27th with the Government announcements MAS HR got "winded". MAS has much to answer for in its long history and Idris has a job and a half on his hands, but it's too easy just to point the finger at MAS and say "your fault"... Tony's star is on the rise (both in the public eye and "behind the scenes"), so what do you want to do about it lah? As for the "special treatment" for a selected few - what airline hasn't done this on many an occasion - you think Qantas and Ansett were angels in this regard... get real, it happens, you can't change it, so live with it... particularly in Malaysia.

Cross Check:

What? If you don't mind me asking....Why you took so long? 12 months? What were you doing there?

Anyway, i know this isn't english class..... but to my knowledge the word "behemoth" does mean powerful and mighty! Correct me if am wrong. Also i realised it doesn't do any good writing about the mess that has been going on in MAS. There's no point arguing with you or anyone for that matter.... it's just me getting frustrated and really really tired of all the injustice MAS has done to many and victimised some of my friends!

No one can do anything abt these! I don't think Idris can do any good either! Idris's decision to cut down the routes shows his incapabilities and his first move itself was a blunder! Only a "Matsalleh" or whatever you call it there can do some good...i guess!

[nostep737]

Did you sign a Contract

Just wondering Capt Planet did you sign a contract with MAS or were you waiting to sign? Even still a you think you get better treatment from a PROFESSIONAL AIRLINE.

[MAStake]

Crosscheck, don't get me wrong. I ain't no fan of either of them. Just giving credit where credit is due.
There's no doubt that inadequecies exist in both of them. But one is a national airline and the other isn't. When you are supposedly the pride of the nation you have to ensure that your staff are well-trained and kept happy to reflect the aspirations of the people. But somewhere along the line it became a gravy train and continued on this route till the loss of RM1.26b became public. Of course the clamour over this has been reduced somewhat over a period of time with other events taking precedence in the headlines. But in the public eye MAS has become synonymous with nepotism, incompetence, inefficiency and a candidate for government bailout.
Methinks Idris has the best intentions but has both hands tied behind his back. Changing the direction of a charging train going downhill at a tremendous rate is going to take a lot of effort even with Idris going full out, especially when his team is more concerned with protecting their asses and their empires.
As for the boys in red they are not without their inefficiencies. As you mentioned, the staff is being given the shaft especially with the culture of multi-tasking and cost-cutting. Seems that Tony is the only one moving while the others around are still looking for direction. However, to go from 2 737s to where it is today with an order for 100 320s was quite a feat and to continue to stay in the black says a lot about their determination. The thinking, unfortunately, has stayed small and many at the upper echelons cannot get out of their cut-cost small airline mindset. Will they end up the same way as MAS? Your guess is as good as mine.
Levelflight, the last sentence on your post is probably the reason why you will still be waiting for another 12 months.

[Brianigham]

levelflight.
The last sentence of your last post says a lot. If you are an aviation consultant it must be for a small outfit. You really do need to do some more homework before calling more competent folk names.
Idris does have his hands tied. Sometimes these binds are there to protect certain interest. Not all "interest" have to be linked to nepotism and corruption you know !
MAS has never been 100% for profit.....and it shouldn't be!
There is a misconception maybe .....that our domestic routes are sure loss making. Do the research.
AK's model is different and their focus and reason for existence is different.
There is no such thing as a level playing feild. MAS have had their hands tied and will continue to have their hands tied....and thats ok.
Yes we do have our inefficiencies and some pretty bad management mistakes. But its up to Idris and MAS to make the changes. While the blueprint is being prepared.....the mill must go on.
What amazes me is that you point out at the bad and the good and complain about both. The good decision to stop pilot intake is now a problem with you cause your new friends are left high and dry. Well what do you propose we do. I say we because I am a pilot with MAS and have been for many years now and I am a little sensitive now about smart statements from the oh so many people. Mostly wrong observations. There are pilots in MAS who have no idea of what lies ahead. Because of the complexity of it all, and all the strings attached...we have to take this one day at a time.
Those clowns you pointed out.....if they did pull a fast one and employ those 2 pilots because their daddy's are MAS captains, have done a good thing. Well done clowns!

[flightleader]

Levelflight,

It is for a cause,be it for a good cause or a plain mistake,we are just human.I don't believe the recruiment people intent to play a jokes on these guys. This airline has some 25,000 staff,thousands of managers,hips of department that all make decisions and communication a rather long process which may not always come out as a good one?

I can understand the your friends' lost.Please tell me which company pay all your expenses including your time for an interview? None. Furthermore,there is no guarentee that those who come for interview suits the job.There are so many expats con their way into airline flying.The airline has its reason and right to interview,screen and employ who fits its criteria.If these guys are not rated on type,they are just trying their luck.In airline environment,qualify means rated on type with operational hours.Those people got into airline as non rated are lucky as the airline must have been desperate.MAS was desperate once but things are changing fast.

I hope you don't bring this sort of outburst into the cockpit nor pass it on the people in the flight training industry.

[Cross Check]

MAStake:

But somewhere along the line it became a gravy train and continued on this route till the loss of RM1.26b became public. Of course the clamour over this has been reduced somewhat over a period of time with other events taking precedence in the headlines. But in the public eye MAS has become synonymous with nepotism, incompetence, inefficiency and a candidate for government bailout.

Well yeah, as was the norm for many legacy carriers (especially GLC ones) and public opinion is... well... endemic with an air of resignation. Bugs me however to sit around having to listen to lectures of "I'm not going to let MAS waste another taxpayer's dollar (sic)" [rowdy applause], but in the same breath we get "Fuel and payroll is too high", "Hang in there, next year will be better" (allahmah... said that last year, and the year before mah), "I'm not gonna let a single one of you guys screw ME"... but it's okay to screw US... brilliant that is...

Some observant PPRuNer said

The really chilling part about all of this is that the culture that has lead us to this situation - the slavish devotion to cost over quality, the intense centralization of authority that deprives middle managers of any ability to affect meaningful solutions, and the belief that the line employees are simply an impediment to the management running a really slick little operation - shows no sign of changing. This is why I and others no longer see a long term future working for this company.

this was about EK... and AK is fitting nicely into the same mold. At least MAS was quality over cost! I for one certainly hope Idris can pull it all together despite the Government's apparent favouritism coz somebody needs to keep the AK GroupCEO's ego in check. "The MAS Way" proforma was a fair assessment - general but understandably their game-plan is their secret.

Just as an aside, have to wonder about all the "100 New Airbuses" hype... last public statement by Airbus in KUL was 60 firm, 40 optioned back in Feb even despite the assult of banners, posters and billboards screaming otherwise... kudos to the marketing department.

Brianigham:

You really do need to do some more homework before calling more competent folk names.

Never a truer word - kasih. Levelflight take note.

Quite right, some of the responsibility MAS is charged with is for the social fabric of the nation, and while it would be nice if this can be done at a profit or even without subsidy, it isn't always possible in a heavily regulated environment. This idea of the Government to split the market into low-cost/high-cost, AK/MH respectively has to be one of the dumbest ideas I've ever heard - that practically guarantees AK good load factors without competition from MH and screws MH out of potential passengers... sorry... did I miss something... wasn't MH supposed to be increasing revenues... zero discounting... yeah like that's gonna win over more passengers and solve everything... well done BN Look on the bright side - at least the MTB contact pier is much more peaceful now - no more crowds of disgruntled, delayed passengers

levelflight: And how long do you think it takes to get into CX? Or SQ? Or EK? If you haven't worked out what I've been doing for the last 12 months, then don't bother there's no point. Don't think that it's no good to write about what's bothering you... just bother to think about what you are going to write before you do (particulary that last paragraph). It's fine to write about the goings on in MH or AK - that's what PPRuNe is all about. Look in the Middle East forum, there's some marvellous discussions that go on for pages - a rare occurence in South Asia/Far East. I can understand you may be frustrated, but casting aspersions of premeditated deceit and victimisation, etc will just get the wind up people and is hardly gonna create an informative thread, and we're all ambassadors of our respective countries

[boltak]

the intolerance that you see here are products of the previous regime under the mad doctor who today still want to call the shots. only their views matter. just imagine the crm in those cockpits. my way or no way.

just because it is wrong and not very many are doing it does not make it right. to agree loudly is to condon it. i am talking about the nepotisim, corruption, cronyism etc.

the denial that is now being spun about. but the truth is f50s are going, twotters are going. some aircrafts being furloughed. surely there must be excess pilots. also with the cadets fast tracking . simple maths will tell you.

but the top brass would like you to know that they are on top of the situation. they say they will look after the pilots interest. why would they unless they have an incentive to do so. so who will provide the incentives.

just be prepared for a few years of pain. and hope that there will be gain later.

[Cross Check]

So what's MAPA doing Other than a whole lot of chest beating...

Is RAS gonna get any "protection"? Out of the 100-160 drivers speculated to go something between 80-100 would be the RAS fleet plus their 15 or so aircraft. Don't see why Berjaya shouldn't take it on.

If MAPA can't cover them, then AK is the only escape route... out of the frying pan into the fire

[QNH1013]

Out of the Miri base RAS Twin Otter frying pan and in to the KUL base AK Airbus A320 fire doesn't sound THAT Hot actually

Don't make it sound so bad.

But, you could take that statement both ways if you like.

[Brianigham]

Any suggestions

Guys,
Boltak bro. Don't think anyone condones those "ism's".
The thing about MAS now, is that the management themselves have got absolutely no clue about their job security....if you know what I mean.
This New MD and his team have got a mammoth task of cleaning up the whole mess we are in. Its not just Flight Ops that he has to look into, its the whole shop.
In the mean time we must move on with business unusual.
The SSB guys situation is a real bummer isn't it.
Here we have quite a few.....100+ chaps, who haven't got a clue as well whats coming their way.
Any suggestions on what would be the best way, or at least a good way to solve this , assuming they do...do away with the F50 and the Twin otters.
Some chaps think that they have a choice. As though the company is going to ask them where they want to be posted.
Then again AA said they could handle it.
Are they going to use the same planes!
Who is going to crew it!
Is there a secondment deal in their plans!
Is it all going to go back to the drawing board. If AA are going to ask for secondment of MH pilots, to man the same planes with new livery, then maybe....maybe we dont have a problem that big.
What I do believe, is that Idris should be given the chance to turn the company around.
Hopefully he does some maggot treatment to get rid of the undesirable elements within us and when we do come back from the dead, we will once again be a force to be reckoned with.
What say you.

[MASsenger]

Brainigham, I guess you are with RAS. I absolutely agree with your suggestion of maggot treatment at RAS. I do not know much about RHS but I doubt if it`s management style is any different from that of MAS. Having been an X-MAS crew, I can categorically say it is infested heavily with maggots. Idris Jala has to get on with some serious maggot treatment with MAS. However all this is only wishful thinking. It is not that there aren’t capable locals to get the ship on the right track. It`s all do with Cooperate culture dished out by G. That Cooperate culture is so deeply entrenched that nothing much will change. The present fix is only a smoke screen to get everyone to believe the situation is seriously considered and under control. We will continue to see this musical chair syndrome played at the CEO level. I myself got sick of all this crap a decade ago, took a hike never to look back. The single best thing I`ve done in my life. You must realize, you and I will never in a million years be able to change the nepotism, incompetence, inefficiency that they are besieged with. My advice - when the kitchen gets too hot, time to get out!