Singaporean self-sponsored CPL holders - where are you?
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I suppose you're right on that account, Mr 9M-. However, I believe that most people who went to obtain their CPL at their own expense will have a contingency plan in the event that employment in SQ is not possible. That was my mindset when I first went for the course. I guess its really too huge a gamble to take if one pursue one's own license just so that SQ might employ. I've heard of many cases where people who possesses their own licenses got rejected as well. I can't imagine how devastated they will be IF they only want a job at SQ & not anywhere else...
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Originally Posted by sgrookie
I suppose you're right on that account, Mr 9M-. However, I believe that most people who went to obtain their CPL at their own expense will have a contingency plan in the event that employment in SQ is not possible. That was my mindset when I first went for the course. I guess its really too huge a gamble to take if one pursue one's own license just so that SQ might employ. I've heard of many cases where people who possesses their own licenses got rejected as well. I can't imagine how devastated they will be IF they only want a job at SQ & not anywhere else...
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As I was trained in Australia, I guess I can only give comments about flying in Australia, so here goes...
Employment in Australia is generally not possible unless you're a PR there. With respect to most Singaporean's skills, we will be 5 points short of getting a PR as being a commercial pilot counts as a skill BUT if you're willing to move to the smaller towns/cities, the requirements for PR is less stringent.
If you plan to move out of the 5 major cities, namely; Perth, Brisbane, Sydney, Melbourne & Adelaide, there will be other small cities like Broome, Darwin (?) or even Tamworth for that matter who might get you a job. Its hard to find a good job with good pay, fair enough but as long as you don't mind what you're flying you'll find work. That much is certain & I've heard rumours (?) that MFA once wanted to hire an Australian instructor so... it might be a lead. I have a coursemate who completed his IR & is now flying the Cessna 207. Its not much but at least its a start if you know what I mean. Beggars can't really be choosers, I suppose.
Following are rumours & stuff I've heard from the GA side in Australia. True or not? I can't confirm it so if you're really interested, do check it up on them & talk to people. Some of the jobs won't be advertised online.
On the Indian side, if you have an Indian PR or citizenship, you might be able to seek employment from the Indian airliners as they're in shortage of pilots right now. Just some twin hours might get you the job, but I won't really bet on it though.
Employment from China. Go look it up. The major airliners are recruiting fully qualified FOs & Captains but within the next 5-10 years, the GA in China seems to be opening up as they're seeking the help of FAA to assist them in their airspace re-structuring. I think I read the latter somewhere in a magazine, not sure if its FAA or CAA though...
Notice that I mentioned GA most of the time? Well, unless you're in a cadet program, else chances of an airline giving a pilot with less than 1,500 hours flying time to be in the right hand seat will be like a god-send. So, build up the hours & work hard! This route is a really, really tough route so if there are even any doubts that you can withstand this lifestyle, I advise you not to go for your license. Heaps of self-sacrifice is involved here... not to mention the big hole you'll have in your pocket.
Employment in Australia is generally not possible unless you're a PR there. With respect to most Singaporean's skills, we will be 5 points short of getting a PR as being a commercial pilot counts as a skill BUT if you're willing to move to the smaller towns/cities, the requirements for PR is less stringent.
If you plan to move out of the 5 major cities, namely; Perth, Brisbane, Sydney, Melbourne & Adelaide, there will be other small cities like Broome, Darwin (?) or even Tamworth for that matter who might get you a job. Its hard to find a good job with good pay, fair enough but as long as you don't mind what you're flying you'll find work. That much is certain & I've heard rumours (?) that MFA once wanted to hire an Australian instructor so... it might be a lead. I have a coursemate who completed his IR & is now flying the Cessna 207. Its not much but at least its a start if you know what I mean. Beggars can't really be choosers, I suppose.
Following are rumours & stuff I've heard from the GA side in Australia. True or not? I can't confirm it so if you're really interested, do check it up on them & talk to people. Some of the jobs won't be advertised online.
On the Indian side, if you have an Indian PR or citizenship, you might be able to seek employment from the Indian airliners as they're in shortage of pilots right now. Just some twin hours might get you the job, but I won't really bet on it though.
Employment from China. Go look it up. The major airliners are recruiting fully qualified FOs & Captains but within the next 5-10 years, the GA in China seems to be opening up as they're seeking the help of FAA to assist them in their airspace re-structuring. I think I read the latter somewhere in a magazine, not sure if its FAA or CAA though...
Notice that I mentioned GA most of the time? Well, unless you're in a cadet program, else chances of an airline giving a pilot with less than 1,500 hours flying time to be in the right hand seat will be like a god-send. So, build up the hours & work hard! This route is a really, really tough route so if there are even any doubts that you can withstand this lifestyle, I advise you not to go for your license. Heaps of self-sacrifice is involved here... not to mention the big hole you'll have in your pocket.
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Originally Posted by sgrookie
As I was trained in Australia, I guess I can only give comments about flying in Australia, so here goes...
Employment in Australia is generally not possible unless you're a PR there. With respect to most Singaporean's skills, we will be 5 points short of getting a PR as being a commercial pilot counts as a skill BUT if you're willing to move to the smaller towns/cities, the requirements for PR is less stringent.
If you plan to move out of the 5 major cities, namely; Perth, Brisbane, Sydney, Melbourne & Adelaide, there will be other small cities like Broome, Darwin (?) or even Tamworth for that matter who might get you a job. Its hard to find a good job with good pay, fair enough but as long as you don't mind what you're flying you'll find work. That much is certain & I've heard rumours (?) that MFA once wanted to hire an Australian instructor so... it might be a lead. I have a coursemate who completed his IR & is now flying the Cessna 207. Its not much but at least its a start if you know what I mean. Beggars can't really be choosers, I suppose.
Following are rumours & stuff I've heard from the GA side in Australia. True or not? I can't confirm it so if you're really interested, do check it up on them & talk to people. Some of the jobs won't be advertised online.
On the Indian side, if you have an Indian PR or citizenship, you might be able to seek employment from the Indian airliners as they're in shortage of pilots right now. Just some twin hours might get you the job, but I won't really bet on it though.
Employment from China. Go look it up. The major airliners are recruiting fully qualified FOs & Captains but within the next 5-10 years, the GA in China seems to be opening up as they're seeking the help of FAA to assist them in their airspace re-structuring. I think I read the latter somewhere in a magazine, not sure if its FAA or CAA though...
Notice that I mentioned GA most of the time? Well, unless you're in a cadet program, else chances of an airline giving a pilot with less than 1,500 hours flying time to be in the right hand seat will be like a god-send. So, build up the hours & work hard! This route is a really, really tough route so if there are even any doubts that you can withstand this lifestyle, I advise you not to go for your license. Heaps of self-sacrifice is involved here... not to mention the big hole you'll have in your pocket.
Employment in Australia is generally not possible unless you're a PR there. With respect to most Singaporean's skills, we will be 5 points short of getting a PR as being a commercial pilot counts as a skill BUT if you're willing to move to the smaller towns/cities, the requirements for PR is less stringent.
If you plan to move out of the 5 major cities, namely; Perth, Brisbane, Sydney, Melbourne & Adelaide, there will be other small cities like Broome, Darwin (?) or even Tamworth for that matter who might get you a job. Its hard to find a good job with good pay, fair enough but as long as you don't mind what you're flying you'll find work. That much is certain & I've heard rumours (?) that MFA once wanted to hire an Australian instructor so... it might be a lead. I have a coursemate who completed his IR & is now flying the Cessna 207. Its not much but at least its a start if you know what I mean. Beggars can't really be choosers, I suppose.
Following are rumours & stuff I've heard from the GA side in Australia. True or not? I can't confirm it so if you're really interested, do check it up on them & talk to people. Some of the jobs won't be advertised online.
On the Indian side, if you have an Indian PR or citizenship, you might be able to seek employment from the Indian airliners as they're in shortage of pilots right now. Just some twin hours might get you the job, but I won't really bet on it though.
Employment from China. Go look it up. The major airliners are recruiting fully qualified FOs & Captains but within the next 5-10 years, the GA in China seems to be opening up as they're seeking the help of FAA to assist them in their airspace re-structuring. I think I read the latter somewhere in a magazine, not sure if its FAA or CAA though...
Notice that I mentioned GA most of the time? Well, unless you're in a cadet program, else chances of an airline giving a pilot with less than 1,500 hours flying time to be in the right hand seat will be like a god-send. So, build up the hours & work hard! This route is a really, really tough route so if there are even any doubts that you can withstand this lifestyle, I advise you not to go for your license. Heaps of self-sacrifice is involved here... not to mention the big hole you'll have in your pocket.
Well as for airline jobs around china or hongkong, yes they do advertised like 1000+ hours CPL with frozen atpl they will take u in. But read up on the other thread and u will know u r competing with the world and that means competing with pilots with 4000-5000 hours trying to secure the second officer position
This is a tough road i know because i am still walking it. Try flying in malaysia and u will know what i mean. Take care and hope to see u flying around this region soon.
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Originally Posted by 9M-
I have a friend who have gotten his cpl/ir and came back failed the interview and went back to his accounting job till now. Wasted 50k+ for nothing.
Originally Posted by sgrookie
Employment in Australia is generally not possible unless you're a PR there.
Originally Posted by 9M-
At least they give fixed pay unlike most other flying clubs around asia or australia that pay instructor on commission base. If u got 2 students a month then u can eat grass.
Last edited by demandpump; 1st May 2006 at 08:22.
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Originally Posted by demandpump
That's so sad! I was about to ask if anyone had come back with a CPL and then went back to their old jobs because they couldn't find a flying job. Did you tell him not to give up and continue searching? Did he ONLY want to work for SIA and nothing else?
hmm... are you able to live comfortably while working as an instructor? Or do you need to do 2 jobs?
hmm... are you able to live comfortably while working as an instructor? Or do you need to do 2 jobs?
Well what i can say is the money one earn will let one live comfortably if teaching in any of the flying school in malaysia. Cant afford a second job not much time left got to work everyday and maybe only weekends off.
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well, it's all very realistic isn't it? i guess for many, passion only comes if one has enough $...we are in such a pragmatic society 
sad that the aviation industry is not really big here...so few opportunities. i'm considering to go into the field of airport management...haha...so totally way off frm what i used to study.
sad that the aviation industry is not really big here...so few opportunities. i'm considering to go into the field of airport management...haha...so totally way off frm what i used to study.
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Loan Sharks?
Hi,
Just wondering whether anyone out there borrowed money from any legitimate institutions for their CPL? Or even type ratings? Could cost a bomb, or 5 years of your life scringing and saving...
Welcome any thoughts and comments.
Cheers,
Cruiser
Just wondering whether anyone out there borrowed money from any legitimate institutions for their CPL? Or even type ratings? Could cost a bomb, or 5 years of your life scringing and saving...
Welcome any thoughts and comments.
Cheers,
Cruiser
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I really wouldn't think it would be a wise idea to borrow money from loan sharks to fund the CPL training.
Anyway, on the topic of training costs...
To be an instructor in Malaysia, after spending about S$70K+ on the CPL/fATPL, we would still need to do our own flying (spend more money) to reach 150 solo hours before qualifying for the AFI course?
Once we complete the AFI course and start looking for an instructor job, I believe we would have already spent more than S$100K!!
Anyway, on the topic of training costs...
To be an instructor in Malaysia, after spending about S$70K+ on the CPL/fATPL, we would still need to do our own flying (spend more money) to reach 150 solo hours before qualifying for the AFI course?
Once we complete the AFI course and start looking for an instructor job, I believe we would have already spent more than S$100K!!
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Originally Posted by 9M-
Yes u r right. I have a friend who have gotten his cpl/ir and came back failed the interview and went back to his accounting job till now. Wasted 50k+ for nothing. Like i said earlier, if u have all the qualification from australia and came back to singapore. If SQ rejects u, what r u going to do? Where else can u go? Care to share what u think about this? and i will give u the answer with it.
Could your friend who went back to his accounting job not find an instructing job? Or did he just want to appply for the airline? I hate to think that someone who has spent his life savings on his training cannot fulfill his dreams of flying. Surely like what you had mentioned in your previous posts, there are instucting jobs in one of the few clubs in malaysia?
Hope to hear from you guys soon!
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Stupid bird has to fly first
Hi again,
While saving really hard for the CPL/IR course I am also reading up on one of the UKCAA recommended Air pilot's manual. Currently reading volume 2: Air Law and Operational procedures. While theses manuals adhere to the standards of the UKCAA, how relevant (or helpful/unhelpful) would it be to me who will do the course somewhere in malaysia who conforms to ICAO standards?
Any comments?
By the way " Flying the big jets" is an interesting book about the basics of flying!
Cheers,
Cruiser.
While saving really hard for the CPL/IR course I am also reading up on one of the UKCAA recommended Air pilot's manual. Currently reading volume 2: Air Law and Operational procedures. While theses manuals adhere to the standards of the UKCAA, how relevant (or helpful/unhelpful) would it be to me who will do the course somewhere in malaysia who conforms to ICAO standards?
Any comments?
By the way " Flying the big jets" is an interesting book about the basics of flying!
Cheers,
Cruiser.
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Originally Posted by cruisercruiser
Hi again,
While saving really hard for the CPL/IR course I am also reading up on one of the UKCAA recommended Air pilot's manual. Currently reading volume 2: Air Law and Operational procedures. While theses manuals adhere to the standards of the UKCAA, how relevant (or helpful/unhelpful) would it be to me who will do the course somewhere in malaysia who conforms to ICAO standards?
Any comments?
By the way " Flying the big jets" is an interesting book about the basics of flying!
Cheers,
Cruiser.
While saving really hard for the CPL/IR course I am also reading up on one of the UKCAA recommended Air pilot's manual. Currently reading volume 2: Air Law and Operational procedures. While theses manuals adhere to the standards of the UKCAA, how relevant (or helpful/unhelpful) would it be to me who will do the course somewhere in malaysia who conforms to ICAO standards?
Any comments?
By the way " Flying the big jets" is an interesting book about the basics of flying!
Cheers,
Cruiser.
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Nice to see this thread come to life again!
I have that book too! A very interesting read on flying the 747. Recently I bought some of those cockpit videos by itvv. It gives quite a detailed look at some of the systems in the aircraft (A330, MD-11, concorde etc) and also how the crew operate. Got it from a shop at Sim Lim square.
9M-,
I have a pressing question. The 150hr PIC requirement for the AFI rating is only for PPL holders, right? What about CPL holders? Do they also need 150hrs PIC before being allowed to do the AFI course? If that's the case, then the CPL graduate (with only about 70-80 PIC hrs) would still need to fly some more to reach 150hrs before going for the AFI course. That would mean a lot more money would have to be spent on top of the CPL course just to qualify for entry to the AFI course? Can a CPL graduate go straight into the AFI course?
Also, just out of curiosity, how many flying hours have you accumulated over your years of flying?
Thanks guys, and keep the thread alive!
Originally Posted by cruisercruiser
By the way " Flying the big jets" is an interesting book about the basics of flying!
9M-,
I have a pressing question. The 150hr PIC requirement for the AFI rating is only for PPL holders, right? What about CPL holders? Do they also need 150hrs PIC before being allowed to do the AFI course? If that's the case, then the CPL graduate (with only about 70-80 PIC hrs) would still need to fly some more to reach 150hrs before going for the AFI course. That would mean a lot more money would have to be spent on top of the CPL course just to qualify for entry to the AFI course? Can a CPL graduate go straight into the AFI course?
Also, just out of curiosity, how many flying hours have you accumulated over your years of flying?
Thanks guys, and keep the thread alive!
Last edited by demandpump; 4th Jun 2006 at 04:09.
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Seletar upgrading - GA in Singapore coming to an end?
A bit off topic...
But with the impending upgrading works at Seletar airport, even the future of syfc hangs in the balance. I wonder what will happen to those two other clubs?
But with the impending upgrading works at Seletar airport, even the future of syfc hangs in the balance. I wonder what will happen to those two other clubs?
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Originally Posted by demandpump
Nice to see this thread come to life again!
I have that book too! A very interesting read on flying the 747. Recently I bought some of those cockpit videos by itvv. It gives quite a detailed look at some of the systems in the aircraft (A330, MD-11, concorde etc) and also how the crew operate. Got it from a shop at Sim Lim square.
9M-,
I have a pressing question. The 150hr PIC requirement for the AFI rating is only for PPL holders, right? What about CPL holders? Do they also need 150hrs PIC before being allowed to do the AFI course? If that's the case, then the CPL graduate (with only about 70-80 PIC hrs) would still need to fly some more to reach 150hrs before going for the AFI course. That would mean a lot more money would have to be spent on top of the CPL course just to qualify for entry to the AFI course? Can a CPL graduate go straight into the AFI course?
Also, just out of curiosity, how many flying hours have you accumulated over your years of flying?
Thanks guys, and keep the thread alive!
I have that book too! A very interesting read on flying the 747. Recently I bought some of those cockpit videos by itvv. It gives quite a detailed look at some of the systems in the aircraft (A330, MD-11, concorde etc) and also how the crew operate. Got it from a shop at Sim Lim square.
9M-,
I have a pressing question. The 150hr PIC requirement for the AFI rating is only for PPL holders, right? What about CPL holders? Do they also need 150hrs PIC before being allowed to do the AFI course? If that's the case, then the CPL graduate (with only about 70-80 PIC hrs) would still need to fly some more to reach 150hrs before going for the AFI course. That would mean a lot more money would have to be spent on top of the CPL course just to qualify for entry to the AFI course? Can a CPL graduate go straight into the AFI course?
Also, just out of curiosity, how many flying hours have you accumulated over your years of flying?
Thanks guys, and keep the thread alive!
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Originally Posted by 9M-
Now malaysia dont really have PPL holders afi course anymore. All requirement will have to be CPL/IR then can go for AFI course. Yes the 150 PIC time still applies. Flying hours i would say about 800+ in 10 months.
Does anyone know whether SYFC have this requirement?
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Originally Posted by cruisercruiser
Wow...Got to spend MORE on top of the 70-80k to get that 150 PIC.
Does anyone know whether SYFC have this requirement?
Does anyone know whether SYFC have this requirement?
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License conversion in SYFC
Originally Posted by 9M-
SYFC if accepted by them they will train you. Although they did not state they need u to have 150 hrs pic but they do require a CAAS CPL. Which one will never be able to obtain unless u r a dropout from sia or came thru massey uni or ex air force retiree.
Heard or what you said above. Also heard of people with canadian and malaysian licenses converting their licenses in SYFC after being employed. Just wondering how they decide to employ. Types pf license, preference for license holders from particular schools etc.
Could people who had done it and now in SilkAir advice? Would appreciate your help very much!
cheers
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I was Singaporean. Married a US Citizen and am now myself a US Citizen. Started training in 1999, spent a year as a flight instructor, flew freight in the PA31 and BE99 for about 2 years, and now have been a EMB-145 FO for 2 years. Next week I start Captain training.
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after reading the posts........ i started wondering...
why do most of the Self-Sponsored pilot only think of Entering SIA(it seems that SIA is EVERYTHING) right after grtaduation?
probably, your friend who went back to accounting Doesn't have the COrrect Mind-Set and Attitude, thus SIA rejected him. i say he doesn't have the correct mind-set is because he went back to accounting right after he got rejected without even putting in some effort and trying...... maybe he thinks that the sleepless nights spent at the flying school revising CPL papers are enough........ i mean.. come on.. $50k is a BIG SUM of money!! don't he think that it's a big waste if he just waste his license like that?
Well.. notice Many young generation of Singaporeans( as general, not limited to aviators) want it the easy way..... perhaps it's the society or the education system that moulded them into such person.
i think both the Films 'I NOT STUPID' and ' I NOT STUPID II' potrays this fact rather well, Singaporeans put expectations without actually understanding their ability and the limits
____________________________________________________________ __
now i heard something interesting from one of my friend(he got fed up of waiting and went straight into SYDNEY flight training,the school is currently training some MAS cadets)......
Apparently, you can convert your CASA CPL into A DCA Malaysian one..
here's how..
go Aust for training until CPL(ONLY)
Come back to Malaysia, Do IR and ATPL theory .... in MFA or HMA
and in the end, you'll get a DCA Malaysia license( I'm not sure whether you need to sit for CPL papers or not)
well... he said it was told to him directly by DCA director CAPT Yahaya when he contacted DCA.
BTW, we're both malaysian.
why do most of the Self-Sponsored pilot only think of Entering SIA(it seems that SIA is EVERYTHING) right after grtaduation?
probably, your friend who went back to accounting Doesn't have the COrrect Mind-Set and Attitude, thus SIA rejected him. i say he doesn't have the correct mind-set is because he went back to accounting right after he got rejected without even putting in some effort and trying...... maybe he thinks that the sleepless nights spent at the flying school revising CPL papers are enough........ i mean.. come on.. $50k is a BIG SUM of money!! don't he think that it's a big waste if he just waste his license like that?
Well.. notice Many young generation of Singaporeans( as general, not limited to aviators) want it the easy way..... perhaps it's the society or the education system that moulded them into such person.
i think both the Films 'I NOT STUPID' and ' I NOT STUPID II' potrays this fact rather well, Singaporeans put expectations without actually understanding their ability and the limits
____________________________________________________________ __
now i heard something interesting from one of my friend(he got fed up of waiting and went straight into SYDNEY flight training,the school is currently training some MAS cadets)......
Apparently, you can convert your CASA CPL into A DCA Malaysian one..
here's how..
go Aust for training until CPL(ONLY)
Come back to Malaysia, Do IR and ATPL theory .... in MFA or HMA
and in the end, you'll get a DCA Malaysia license( I'm not sure whether you need to sit for CPL papers or not)
well... he said it was told to him directly by DCA director CAPT Yahaya when he contacted DCA.
BTW, we're both malaysian.