PAL Pilot Exodus
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It's his (BB) head that must roll first. What did he expect? And to claim that they expected some attrition after declaring said pilots as redundant.The arrogance and stupidity of it all. And now FASAP has filed for a notice of strike....Di ba you can only issue hold-departure orders for criminals/potential criminals with risk of flight?...It's true what they say..you wanna test a man's character...give him power.
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sirs,
i would like to ask if those pilots of PAL have also Moratorium like in LTP mechanics?!
and i'm really curious about the cebupac aircraft parked at balagbag hangar
i would like to ask if those pilots of PAL have also Moratorium like in LTP mechanics?!
and i'm really curious about the cebupac aircraft parked at balagbag hangar
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tax cuts?
these guys just do not get it. it is not a pay issue anymore, today it is an issue on trust and job security. something that pal management has repeatedly failed, miserably.
let me quote mister SONG CULAngkulang. "you are redundant in PAL, file a leave of absence and we will let you fly with Airphil on their terms OR be terminated, get your separation pay and you will have a slim chance of flying with us ever again."
poorBIDA BADiolax has been frequenting the A320 lately, went berzerk upon knowing one instructor has resigned. he did not know it was two. 3 "redundant" first officers have also resigned today. beda, your threats will only mean more parked airplanes.
in 1998 they killed the union, today they fight against a ghost.
the best resource in any organization is its people. take care of them and they will take care of you. sad to say, this is not part of pal management's vocabulary.
godspeed everyone.
let me quote mister SONG CULAngkulang. "you are redundant in PAL, file a leave of absence and we will let you fly with Airphil on their terms OR be terminated, get your separation pay and you will have a slim chance of flying with us ever again."
poorBIDA BADiolax has been frequenting the A320 lately, went berzerk upon knowing one instructor has resigned. he did not know it was two. 3 "redundant" first officers have also resigned today. beda, your threats will only mean more parked airplanes.
in 1998 they killed the union, today they fight against a ghost.
the best resource in any organization is its people. take care of them and they will take care of you. sad to say, this is not part of pal management's vocabulary.
godspeed everyone.
Last edited by bisaya; 29th Jul 2010 at 16:12.
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ahoy there.
Bidang Bida B is still at it? no need to give him powers to see his true character. it showed a long time ago. you can smell that he stinks from a mile away. even before he got the position, he always brag about his "connections", always name dropping.
hold departure order? dare him to do it. tell him to put actions into his words. he is full of hot air.
tax break? it is not about money. it is the management that is chasing the pilots away. how can you work for someone who is always watching you and waiting for you to make mistakes? how can you work for someone who hates pilots (even if he is a pilot himself). maybe insecure because they look good compared to him.
all the best to everybody. there are other airlines out there that is much better than the little kingdom that julie andrews built. life is greener on the other side of the fence.
Bidang Bida B is still at it? no need to give him powers to see his true character. it showed a long time ago. you can smell that he stinks from a mile away. even before he got the position, he always brag about his "connections", always name dropping.
hold departure order? dare him to do it. tell him to put actions into his words. he is full of hot air.
tax break? it is not about money. it is the management that is chasing the pilots away. how can you work for someone who is always watching you and waiting for you to make mistakes? how can you work for someone who hates pilots (even if he is a pilot himself). maybe insecure because they look good compared to him.
all the best to everybody. there are other airlines out there that is much better than the little kingdom that julie andrews built. life is greener on the other side of the fence.
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planned disaster
[quote]
let me quote mister SONG CULAngkulang. "you are redundant in PAL, file a leave of absence and we will let you fly with Airphil on their terms OR be terminated, get your separation pay and you will have a slim chance of flying with us ever again."
very smart words by song cu
. as the way things are happening right now, it gives me an impression that this is a planned disaster from within. pilots are just instruments to make the plan worked. first the union, MAYBE now the whole company.
let me quote mister SONG CULAngkulang. "you are redundant in PAL, file a leave of absence and we will let you fly with Airphil on their terms OR be terminated, get your separation pay and you will have a slim chance of flying with us ever again."
very smart words by song cu. as the way things are happening right now, it gives me an impression that this is a planned disaster from within. pilots are just instruments to make the plan worked. first the union, MAYBE now the whole company.
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Systems Failure
The above thread has been a recurring "systems failure" in the organization. No one is capable of solving it, thus, it magnified and affected all levels in a very uncontrollable way. Throughout PAL's history, the Pilots were always the easiest "sacrificial lambs". Now it is getting worst.
For the properly trained pilots, any sign of "fire" dictates an "appropriate action". If your experience dictates that fighting a "fire" is an exercise in futility, all you need to do is to "evacuate" in the shortest possilble time. You have more chances of saving lives, to include your families.
Join Us!!!
Make A Difference!!! 
For the properly trained pilots, any sign of "fire" dictates an "appropriate action". If your experience dictates that fighting a "fire" is an exercise in futility, all you need to do is to "evacuate" in the shortest possilble time. You have more chances of saving lives, to include your families.
Join Us!!!
Make A Difference!!!
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Philippine Airlines today (31 July 2010) apologized to its inconvenienced passengers affected by the disruption of several PAL flights due to inadequate flight deck crew to fly its Airbus A320 airplanes.
The indiscriminate resignation of PAL's A320 pilots for flying jobs abroad whose salaries PAL is unable to match, is in violation of their contracts with PAL as well pertinent government regulations that require resigning pilots to give PAL six months prior notice to be able to train their replacements.
PAL will soon file appropriate charges against pilots who chose not to report for work immediately after submitting resignation letters. Most of the pilots still owe PAL the cost of their aviation school training, which run into millions of pesos per pilot.
PAL is currently adjusting its schedules by merging some flights, upgrading aircraft to a bigger type in order and fielding of management pilots to lessen the inconvenience to affected passengers.
The indiscriminate resignation of PAL's A320 pilots for flying jobs abroad whose salaries PAL is unable to match, is in violation of their contracts with PAL as well pertinent government regulations that require resigning pilots to give PAL six months prior notice to be able to train their replacements.
PAL will soon file appropriate charges against pilots who chose not to report for work immediately after submitting resignation letters. Most of the pilots still owe PAL the cost of their aviation school training, which run into millions of pesos per pilot.
PAL is currently adjusting its schedules by merging some flights, upgrading aircraft to a bigger type in order and fielding of management pilots to lessen the inconvenience to affected passengers.
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Now that it has gone to public knowledge on this PAL Pilot Exodus...Management will try to show that its the Pilot's Fault...Pilot Error...High Salary...etc. Reading this thread prior to this event it was this transfer to AirPhil that started it all...Should I say more..Will the public know about this.. or will it be within the PAL Pilot Corp Only
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The Real Score
Today, a lot of PAL flights were cancelled, both domestic and regional flights were affected. The reason given, NO AVAILABLE CREW TO FLY THE PLANES!
Real score why pilots are leaving.
Last October 2009, the service contracts of 4 Captains (who are above 60 years old), namely De Dios, De la Cruz, Guttierez and Roma were terminated. The reason given was redundancy. 2 of these pilots were due to end their contracts, one in about 3 months time, and the other in about 6 months.
This event had the young pilots thinking, if this could be done to the old guys, it could easily be done to them as well ( 2 in the group who were terminated were returnees for the company during the strike). Because of this, as early as November last year, there were already some guys who applied for jobs somewhere else.
Then come February this year, 11 senior Captains and 7 of the most junior First Officers were given the same treatment. Again the reason was redundancy, when at that time, the average flying time was around 90 hours. The real reason was, they were going to open a Low Cost Carrier at Airphil, using the A320s, to counter the surging dominance of Cebu Pacific in the domestic as well as regional routes. Passenger market share was already 60% for Cebu Pac and 40% for PAL.
So, by late March this year, two of the A320 from the PAL fleet were transferred to Airphil together with the 11 elder captains plus 7 young first officers. Thrown to the other side of the fence to fly the planes, with compensation around half of what they used to get. Maybe PAL management's reasoning was, "... wala namang mapupuntahan ang mga iyan!"("...those guys don't have anywhere else to go to!")
Info leaked out that planes and pilots will be transferred from PAL to Airphil. It was announced during the Inaugural flight that 20 A320s is the initial target. In fact, there will be 4 brand new planes to be delivered between September to November, then another set next year.
This got the pilots thinking, where will they get the pilots to fly them?
The obvious answer was, from PAL. So the info was for real!
Knowing fully well what the working conditions and compensation are waiting for them at the other side of the fence, the A320 people started to explore other options before they got hit.
Although the compensation outside is may be bigger, the present pay scale may seem to be substantial, what with all the incentives that were packaged because of the last exodus. The real reason for this exodus is, the pilots (who have not union nor collective bargaining agreement to protect themselves), cannot take the "pambrabraso" (strong arm tactics) anymore. If they don't have security of tenure at PAL, then it would be a lot better to work elsewhere with the same unsecured job but with maybe better compensation.
Now, press releases from the company are again out to discredit the pilot group. Supposedly pilots are leaving and violating their contracts because of higher pay elsewhere. The veracity of PAL's claims is not accompanied by factual evidence and as it is intended, mask the true goings-on in the company and manipulate public opinion.
This is the score.
Real score why pilots are leaving.
Last October 2009, the service contracts of 4 Captains (who are above 60 years old), namely De Dios, De la Cruz, Guttierez and Roma were terminated. The reason given was redundancy. 2 of these pilots were due to end their contracts, one in about 3 months time, and the other in about 6 months.
This event had the young pilots thinking, if this could be done to the old guys, it could easily be done to them as well ( 2 in the group who were terminated were returnees for the company during the strike). Because of this, as early as November last year, there were already some guys who applied for jobs somewhere else.
Then come February this year, 11 senior Captains and 7 of the most junior First Officers were given the same treatment. Again the reason was redundancy, when at that time, the average flying time was around 90 hours. The real reason was, they were going to open a Low Cost Carrier at Airphil, using the A320s, to counter the surging dominance of Cebu Pacific in the domestic as well as regional routes. Passenger market share was already 60% for Cebu Pac and 40% for PAL.
So, by late March this year, two of the A320 from the PAL fleet were transferred to Airphil together with the 11 elder captains plus 7 young first officers. Thrown to the other side of the fence to fly the planes, with compensation around half of what they used to get. Maybe PAL management's reasoning was, "... wala namang mapupuntahan ang mga iyan!"("...those guys don't have anywhere else to go to!")
Info leaked out that planes and pilots will be transferred from PAL to Airphil. It was announced during the Inaugural flight that 20 A320s is the initial target. In fact, there will be 4 brand new planes to be delivered between September to November, then another set next year.
This got the pilots thinking, where will they get the pilots to fly them?
The obvious answer was, from PAL. So the info was for real!
Knowing fully well what the working conditions and compensation are waiting for them at the other side of the fence, the A320 people started to explore other options before they got hit.
Although the compensation outside is may be bigger, the present pay scale may seem to be substantial, what with all the incentives that were packaged because of the last exodus. The real reason for this exodus is, the pilots (who have not union nor collective bargaining agreement to protect themselves), cannot take the "pambrabraso" (strong arm tactics) anymore. If they don't have security of tenure at PAL, then it would be a lot better to work elsewhere with the same unsecured job but with maybe better compensation.
Now, press releases from the company are again out to discredit the pilot group. Supposedly pilots are leaving and violating their contracts because of higher pay elsewhere. The veracity of PAL's claims is not accompanied by factual evidence and as it is intended, mask the true goings-on in the company and manipulate public opinion.
This is the score.
Last edited by srs78; 1st Aug 2010 at 22:22. Reason: english translation of the phrase
right on
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real score srs.78
whoever you are you got it right.
hopefully this thread will be sent to local papers, espescially" PHILIPPINE DAILY TRIBUNE"
who claims to have unbiased reporting
"WITHOUT FEAR OR FAVOR"
reading local dailies, news about this exodus are only excerpts from the pal press release ,scanned and copied from a certain jonathan gesmundo, who doesn't even know the real score.
1998...pal wanted to destroy the union by removing the existing pal-alpap retirement benefits
2002...pal retrenched wide body contractual pilots on
pretext of redunduncy..
only to train wide body captains after one month , for the same postion declared REDUNDANT
these lucky pilots who were trained were the famous magnificent seven, who after getting their command and flying time, left pal and opted also for other airlines.
what happened next was what srs.78 is saying
QUESTION:
WHAT HAPPENED TO ALL THOSE PAL BRIGHT BOYS WHO DECIDED ON 5 YEAR FUEL HEDGING WHEN OIL PRICES ZOOMED UP TO MORE THAN 100 US$ A BARREL?
PROBABLY WE MIGHT BE ENLIGHTENED WHY PAL IS LOSING HEAVILY, AND IN RETURN POOR PILOT'S ARE MADE SCAPEGOATS.
THIS CURRENT EXODUS HAS BEEN FORCED ON THE PILOTS.
IT HAS BEEN PLANNED IN SUCH A WAY THAT MISTAKES DONE BY PAL BRIGHT BOYS WILL BE BLAMED ON THE PILOTS.
hopefully this thread will be sent to local papers, espescially" PHILIPPINE DAILY TRIBUNE"
who claims to have unbiased reporting
"WITHOUT FEAR OR FAVOR"
reading local dailies, news about this exodus are only excerpts from the pal press release ,scanned and copied from a certain jonathan gesmundo, who doesn't even know the real score.
1998...pal wanted to destroy the union by removing the existing pal-alpap retirement benefits
2002...pal retrenched wide body contractual pilots on
pretext of redunduncy..
only to train wide body captains after one month , for the same postion declared REDUNDANT
these lucky pilots who were trained were the famous magnificent seven, who after getting their command and flying time, left pal and opted also for other airlines.
what happened next was what srs.78 is saying
QUESTION:
WHAT HAPPENED TO ALL THOSE PAL BRIGHT BOYS WHO DECIDED ON 5 YEAR FUEL HEDGING WHEN OIL PRICES ZOOMED UP TO MORE THAN 100 US$ A BARREL?
PROBABLY WE MIGHT BE ENLIGHTENED WHY PAL IS LOSING HEAVILY, AND IN RETURN POOR PILOT'S ARE MADE SCAPEGOATS.
THIS CURRENT EXODUS HAS BEEN FORCED ON THE PILOTS.
IT HAS BEEN PLANNED IN SUCH A WAY THAT MISTAKES DONE BY PAL BRIGHT BOYS WILL BE BLAMED ON THE PILOTS.
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any contract can be disputed in court. There is a thing called a "contract of adhesion," i.e. a
contract so imbalanced in favor of one party, and which at the time of the signing the other party
had no other choice but to sign. Any agreement found to be a contract of adhesion can be rescinded.
I don't know what a PAL or AirPhil contract says, but my point is it can be challenged in court and actually
resolved in favor of the pilots (although realistically, that'll take many decades to resolve).
If a management representative (or even the CEO) stands before a roomful of pilots and declares all of
them "redundant", who wouldn't start looking elsewhere? Why wait for the ship to sink or to get thrown out,
contract or no contract? If the company is f*cking you, f*ck them back. If everyone at that pilot's meeting was "redundant," why are flights being canceled?
Aha... now the company's finding out, the hard way, that those guys weren't so redundant after all.
Contracts? Leave that to the lawyers. Pilots shouldn't be in the business of interpreting contracts anyway.
There's really more to this than just ink on paper. If this were only about the contract, PAL may have the high legal ground.
But do they have the high moral ground? That's a different story. There is a lot more to this story than pilots just leaving looking
for greener pastures elsewhere. The question that needs to be asked is, why is this problem peculiar to PAL?
Why aren't Cebu Pac and ZestAir A320s sitting on the tarmac for want of pilots?
Breaking that contract already has a remedy, which is to reimburse the company for the cost of the training,
which most guys are willing to do anyway. The company holds post-dated checks covering the training bond which can be encashed anytime.
contract so imbalanced in favor of one party, and which at the time of the signing the other party
had no other choice but to sign. Any agreement found to be a contract of adhesion can be rescinded.
I don't know what a PAL or AirPhil contract says, but my point is it can be challenged in court and actually
resolved in favor of the pilots (although realistically, that'll take many decades to resolve).
If a management representative (or even the CEO) stands before a roomful of pilots and declares all of
them "redundant", who wouldn't start looking elsewhere? Why wait for the ship to sink or to get thrown out,
contract or no contract? If the company is f*cking you, f*ck them back. If everyone at that pilot's meeting was "redundant," why are flights being canceled?
Aha... now the company's finding out, the hard way, that those guys weren't so redundant after all.
Contracts? Leave that to the lawyers. Pilots shouldn't be in the business of interpreting contracts anyway.
There's really more to this than just ink on paper. If this were only about the contract, PAL may have the high legal ground.
But do they have the high moral ground? That's a different story. There is a lot more to this story than pilots just leaving looking
for greener pastures elsewhere. The question that needs to be asked is, why is this problem peculiar to PAL?
Why aren't Cebu Pac and ZestAir A320s sitting on the tarmac for want of pilots?
Breaking that contract already has a remedy, which is to reimburse the company for the cost of the training,
which most guys are willing to do anyway. The company holds post-dated checks covering the training bond which can be encashed anytime.
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balagbag boys already know about the transfer of A320[classic] in airphil..
3227 and 3231 are the two [classics] aircraft already used in airphil..
lately, some info from balagbag boys that all classics and enhanced A320 will be transferred in airphil..and those remaining wide-body aircraft will be retained and only used in international flights.
and also, PAL decided to leave balagbag hangar as their maintenance provider and all of the S1 and S2 checks will be no longer be performed by the balagbag boys.
and it will be started by September this year. And the maintenance provider will handle for the meantime?!
A+ of cebupacific
PAL already planned to form it's own "mechanic" for their aircraft
some balagbag boys have a 7yrs contract and some seniors have a moratorium.
many of the balagbag boys already leaved the country.
and it will continue..
same situation as pilots did....
3227 and 3231 are the two [classics] aircraft already used in airphil..
lately, some info from balagbag boys that all classics and enhanced A320 will be transferred in airphil..and those remaining wide-body aircraft will be retained and only used in international flights.
and also, PAL decided to leave balagbag hangar as their maintenance provider and all of the S1 and S2 checks will be no longer be performed by the balagbag boys.
and it will be started by September this year. And the maintenance provider will handle for the meantime?!
A+ of cebupacific
PAL already planned to form it's own "mechanic" for their aircraft
some balagbag boys have a 7yrs contract and some seniors have a moratorium.
many of the balagbag boys already leaved the country.
and it will continue..
same situation as pilots did....