MAS Floodgates Open(Merged).
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MAS Floodgates Open
For the first time in history MAS has employed / is employing foreign pilots on its 744 fleet.
Local pilots are all on high hours and flights are "re-scheduled" almost daily.
Knee jerk reaction?
Or just plain bad management?
There goes the Nationalisation Policy in one fell swoop.
Local pilots are all on high hours and flights are "re-scheduled" almost daily.
Knee jerk reaction?
Or just plain bad management?
There goes the Nationalisation Policy in one fell swoop.
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you won't belive it MAS just open a walk in interview in JKT on 27/28/29 April and 11/12/13 May SariPanPacific hotel they will recruit 70-80 pilots for its wide & narrow body so be happy-lah and good bye MAPA, apparently MAS will have cheap pay indon pilot's than rising their local pilots
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Speedtwoten,
I am just, if not more dissapointed than you. Yes, MAS would rather employ outsiders and eventually pay more than give concessions to locals. Also MAS (Taody) too proud to make moves to at least encourage those that left to come back. Even the govenment is trying to entice professionals to come back and serve the nation. But for MAS no way. Too proud/arrogant I guess.
I heard (from the scheduling people) that many pilots have exceeded hours. Many flew more than 100 hrs per month and heck, 1 chap even logged 140 hrs. Mockery of the FTL scheme, I say. And MAS has the cheek to go and ask DCA for dispensation to exceed 90/900 hrs quoting national interest.
MAS Flight Safety and DCA, what have you to say? And MAPA, I reckon you should encourage your members to refuse those call ups cos at the end of the day you're helping a company that does not appreciate your value. Those rescheduled call ups disrupt your family life and in the end will upset you. Then your health will be affected. Remember that unwittingly, you are helping MAS cover up their mistakes.
Should this sad state of affairs continue, I am forced to draw the conclusion that MAS operations are neither safe nor legal.
Sad, really sad.
I am just, if not more dissapointed than you. Yes, MAS would rather employ outsiders and eventually pay more than give concessions to locals. Also MAS (Taody) too proud to make moves to at least encourage those that left to come back. Even the govenment is trying to entice professionals to come back and serve the nation. But for MAS no way. Too proud/arrogant I guess.
I heard (from the scheduling people) that many pilots have exceeded hours. Many flew more than 100 hrs per month and heck, 1 chap even logged 140 hrs. Mockery of the FTL scheme, I say. And MAS has the cheek to go and ask DCA for dispensation to exceed 90/900 hrs quoting national interest.
MAS Flight Safety and DCA, what have you to say? And MAPA, I reckon you should encourage your members to refuse those call ups cos at the end of the day you're helping a company that does not appreciate your value. Those rescheduled call ups disrupt your family life and in the end will upset you. Then your health will be affected. Remember that unwittingly, you are helping MAS cover up their mistakes.
Should this sad state of affairs continue, I am forced to draw the conclusion that MAS operations are neither safe nor legal.
Sad, really sad.
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hmmm.. and i thought not so long ago somebody in the higher management said that the company had enough drivers to last them a lifetime...
I wonder what song they are singing now... "desperado'' by the eagles would be a nice song to start off..
I wonder what song they are singing now... "desperado'' by the eagles would be a nice song to start off..
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shintaro9 and emilio69
like I said soon you are going to be stranger in your own plane mann, MAS has approval of 70 to 80 direct entry Capt and F/O limitation only F/O must hold ATPL or frozen ATPL that's all and soon they becoming Commander giving instruction to local F/O and TOADS and his club band going to A380 and be retiring at age of 60, and say thank's to MAPA to make a little noise
like I said soon you are going to be stranger in your own plane mann, MAS has approval of 70 to 80 direct entry Capt and F/O limitation only F/O must hold ATPL or frozen ATPL that's all and soon they becoming Commander giving instruction to local F/O and TOADS and his club band going to A380 and be retiring at age of 60, and say thank's to MAPA to make a little noise
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speedwoten
Dunno how cheap the indon pilots are but the local aviation industry is taking a dive with the rising fuel price and most would like to get a job somewhere, anywhere....beats sitting at home...
I know that a lot of pilots showed up for the interview in Jakarta, they will be contracted through a 3rd party agency. Not sure about what they are offering but like I said better than being an unemployed pilot.
I am curious to what is the present condition of the company, since I've heard that there was an exodus of Malaysian pilots to the middle east, thus creating the present shortage of qualified/rated pilots. As I am sure that hiring of expats will be a short term solution, like to hear all of your opinion to what is really going on within the company and how you all feel about the hired guns driving MAS airplanes soon.
Thanks!
Dunno how cheap the indon pilots are but the local aviation industry is taking a dive with the rising fuel price and most would like to get a job somewhere, anywhere....beats sitting at home...
I know that a lot of pilots showed up for the interview in Jakarta, they will be contracted through a 3rd party agency. Not sure about what they are offering but like I said better than being an unemployed pilot.
I am curious to what is the present condition of the company, since I've heard that there was an exodus of Malaysian pilots to the middle east, thus creating the present shortage of qualified/rated pilots. As I am sure that hiring of expats will be a short term solution, like to hear all of your opinion to what is really going on within the company and how you all feel about the hired guns driving MAS airplanes soon.
Thanks!
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MAS, present conditions and trends
Before this thread is going to be merged with other similar topic about MAS, I like to know from all pilots who are presently flying for MAS. (malays, other locals and expats)
1. Reasons for many local pilots fleeing MAS, thus creating shortage of crew. (of course the obvious for more money) but like to hear your opinions anyway.
2. How many expat crew and countries
3. How do you all feel about more expat crews coming on board
4. MAPA or MAS pilots assoc stand towards MAS management
I am not a journalist looking for a story, I have been offered a SIM eval soon as part as the expat crews coming on a contract basis and would really like to know how you all feel about this....
1. Reasons for many local pilots fleeing MAS, thus creating shortage of crew. (of course the obvious for more money) but like to hear your opinions anyway.
2. How many expat crew and countries
3. How do you all feel about more expat crews coming on board
4. MAPA or MAS pilots assoc stand towards MAS management
I am not a journalist looking for a story, I have been offered a SIM eval soon as part as the expat crews coming on a contract basis and would really like to know how you all feel about this....
Last edited by freightdriver; 16th May 2005 at 07:37.
Moderate, Modest & Mild.
speedtwoten, with the apparent hole MAS have dug for themselves - by allowing their EXPERIENCED Captains to depart - what did you think the solution was going to be, other than to replace EXPERIENCE with EXPERIENCE?
Upgrade F/O's who are not yet ready, in terms of experience?
Further, I doubt that - even if that option were exercised - the training department could handle the volume required, nor do it quickly enough to prevent the "re-scheduling" from eventually becoming ongoing cancellations.
MAS has cut off their nose, to spite their face, by allowing their long term Captains to leave the company, rather than increase their benefits to retain them - a decision they are going to regret, and one that is going to cost them FAR MORE than they have saved.
Upgrade F/O's who are not yet ready, in terms of experience?
Further, I doubt that - even if that option were exercised - the training department could handle the volume required, nor do it quickly enough to prevent the "re-scheduling" from eventually becoming ongoing cancellations.
MAS has cut off their nose, to spite their face, by allowing their long term Captains to leave the company, rather than increase their benefits to retain them - a decision they are going to regret, and one that is going to cost them FAR MORE than they have saved.
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hey speedwoten... sorry to dissapoint but i have been flying with a different company since last year (thank god!)...and looking at the mess which i am seeing now in mh which gets even harder even to clean at regular intervals... looks like my decision to leave was not bad at all..
What irks me is that the so called 'big' boss has boasted that they do not have a problem making up the numbers....and at the same time hiring outside help and depriving your own pilots what is due to them is,i personally feel, really acting on bad faith.But then again...does he really give a s**t?
What irks me is that the so called 'big' boss has boasted that they do not have a problem making up the numbers....and at the same time hiring outside help and depriving your own pilots what is due to them is,i personally feel, really acting on bad faith.But then again...does he really give a s**t?
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Top Brass in MH is either
a)not giving a s**t
b)too dumb to give a s**t
and its all of the above, they are more interested in saving 'face' and their position rather than be interested in how the future of MAS will be.
So much for the 300 pilots we have to be put in place of these "traitors" who have left for greener pastures and much better companies.They are now re-scheduling on a daily basis and asking for an increase in yearly hours.Short term thinking for short folk...
On the contrary to what Kaptin M has said, most FO's have the hours required for command and because of the lack of ability to plan, they have not been getting their upgrades and are now leaving in droves to other jobs.IF what spedwoten has said is true, that will push even the guys who are/were thinking of remaining in mh and will compound the problem....
a)not giving a s**t
b)too dumb to give a s**t
and its all of the above, they are more interested in saving 'face' and their position rather than be interested in how the future of MAS will be.
So much for the 300 pilots we have to be put in place of these "traitors" who have left for greener pastures and much better companies.They are now re-scheduling on a daily basis and asking for an increase in yearly hours.Short term thinking for short folk...
On the contrary to what Kaptin M has said, most FO's have the hours required for command and because of the lack of ability to plan, they have not been getting their upgrades and are now leaving in droves to other jobs.IF what spedwoten has said is true, that will push even the guys who are/were thinking of remaining in mh and will compound the problem....
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Freightdriver, welcome to the perpetual circus call Malaysia Airlines.An airline which has more take offs & landings (as proudly claimed by the SGMFO) than a popular national carrier down south but inexplicably,they can't even make a decent profit, let alone retain their pilots.
Contrary to popular propaganda by the management, pilots are leaving not because of the 'pull' factors (more known as the USD factor), rather it's the 'push' factors
Working contracts (the locals call it the MoU) are not being honoured, medical benefits are eroded, travel perks are curtailed & the wanton dirsregard of the MoU by management have made the pilots demoralised.Leave are all but frozen now to meet the shortcomings of the mismanagement of the manpower requirements.
While you will not get the red carpet treatment by the locals,don't expect to be treated unfairly either.They are generally a good bunch of blokes (albeit demoralised) & professional to the core.The present pilots are in the midst of a pay revision & the management are torpedoing this effort by taking in expats at a 'penny wise pound foolish' face saving exercise by taking in expats while waiting for the '300' cadets to fill in the present void
So defintely your presence will make all parties uncomfortable except management of course
Another word of caution, think very carefully why MAS are not able to retain their locals let alone their expats pilots.Bottom line is if you are offered a contract by them, read it very,very carefully.You might just be in the same boat as the locals if you blindingly accept the first 'version' If they treat locals till they leave their own country what would that make you? 
Contrary to popular propaganda by the management, pilots are leaving not because of the 'pull' factors (more known as the USD factor), rather it's the 'push' factors
Working contracts (the locals call it the MoU) are not being honoured, medical benefits are eroded, travel perks are curtailed & the wanton dirsregard of the MoU by management have made the pilots demoralised.Leave are all but frozen now to meet the shortcomings of the mismanagement of the manpower requirements.
While you will not get the red carpet treatment by the locals,don't expect to be treated unfairly either.They are generally a good bunch of blokes (albeit demoralised) & professional to the core.The present pilots are in the midst of a pay revision & the management are torpedoing this effort by taking in expats at a 'penny wise pound foolish' face saving exercise by taking in expats while waiting for the '300' cadets to fill in the present void
So defintely your presence will make all parties uncomfortable except management of course Another word of caution, think very carefully why MAS are not able to retain their locals let alone their expats pilots.Bottom line is if you are offered a contract by them, read it very,very carefully.You might just be in the same boat as the locals if you blindingly accept the first 'version'
If they treat locals till they leave their own country what would that make you?
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EY777 thank you for your cander insight.
As much as I do not want to be part of the problem for the guys fighting for their rights or be part of a lousy management temporary quick fix, what is being offered so far is attractive for me to consider making the move.
As I am sure there will be fine prints that needs to be clarified and further examined.
Facts: management in this part of the world still mesmerized with past glory days of monopoly that they have not adapted to today's supplies and demands.
To all MAS driver, my best wishes for your fight and struggle and know that for most of us we have been through this hard times one to many and for what is worth know that if we do come, we come in peace....
As much as I do not want to be part of the problem for the guys fighting for their rights or be part of a lousy management temporary quick fix, what is being offered so far is attractive for me to consider making the move.
As I am sure there will be fine prints that needs to be clarified and further examined.
Facts: management in this part of the world still mesmerized with past glory days of monopoly that they have not adapted to today's supplies and demands.
To all MAS driver, my best wishes for your fight and struggle and know that for most of us we have been through this hard times one to many and for what is worth know that if we do come, we come in peace....
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Present MAS Narrowbody Capt/FO package
Any info what current benefits are for narrowbody Captain and First Officer would be appreciated
We could try to demmand at least the same on a contract basis with no job security and no additional benefits
Hoping that we will not obstruct current negotiation of MAS pilots and management.
Just a thought....trying to be wise and seek a win-win formula.
In an ideal world: We could come in and help out...MAS management is pleased and come to their senses, and MAS mainline will get what is deserved...
We could try to demmand at least the same on a contract basis with no job security and no additional benefits
Hoping that we will not obstruct current negotiation of MAS pilots and management.
Just a thought....trying to be wise and seek a win-win formula.
In an ideal world: We could come in and help out...MAS management is pleased and come to their senses, and MAS mainline will get what is deserved...
If you are going in as a widebody FO,you are in the way of at least 500 FO who are trying to get themselves into widebody.If you are going in as a narrow body captain then you are in the way of 800 FO who are trying to get their command. Would you be treated nicely? Depends on who you speak to. Good luck.
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Flightleader
Point well taken, like I said I for one are not trying to get in anybody's way during my 3 year contract as offered.
Hopefully at the end, something else will turn up for me back here or elsewhere. Not that I would not consider staying on at MAS, but I would only do that if they take me on as a regular employee and I will probably the first to join the ranks of my brothers seeking fair and better treatment....(I am known for that)
Anyhow hope to see you and hope you are one of those who'll have an open mind about us coming over.....
Have a good one!
Point well taken, like I said I for one are not trying to get in anybody's way during my 3 year contract as offered.
Hopefully at the end, something else will turn up for me back here or elsewhere. Not that I would not consider staying on at MAS, but I would only do that if they take me on as a regular employee and I will probably the first to join the ranks of my brothers seeking fair and better treatment....(I am known for that)
Anyhow hope to see you and hope you are one of those who'll have an open mind about us coming over.....
Have a good one!
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ClimbGodammitClimb
Is MAS pilots assoc considering going on strike?
If this is the case and IFALPA makes a ruling I don't think any of the guys who attended the open interview at WIII will want to cross the line.
But we need an official confirmation that this is certainly the case. anyone?
Is MAS pilots assoc considering going on strike?
If this is the case and IFALPA makes a ruling I don't think any of the guys who attended the open interview at WIII will want to cross the line.
But we need an official confirmation that this is certainly the case. anyone?
Last edited by BlueEagle; 17th May 2005 at 10:16.
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Mr Freightdriver,
Expats arriving at MAS is definitely gonna piss a lot of people here. Like mentioned in other posts, expats will be stepping and leaping on many aspiring for a promotion. The pilot's assoc is in the midst of negotiating a better deal for locals. You guys coming here will surely throw all their efforts down the drain! Remember it’s not about having an open mind or not. Ultimately you guys will be held responsible if the pilots get a bad deal.
The fleet where you can make a few friends and not be noticed will be DHC-6 Command or FO, or the F-50 FO. Get posted anywhere else and you will find yourself getting cursed in foreign languages, ignored (by the girls too), not being served meal choices or drinks on time, spending layovers alone in the dark, doing all the work (and I mean all sectors and relevant paperwork). Just ask the Indonesian FO’s.
So all the best for your sim check ride.
Expats arriving at MAS is definitely gonna piss a lot of people here. Like mentioned in other posts, expats will be stepping and leaping on many aspiring for a promotion. The pilot's assoc is in the midst of negotiating a better deal for locals. You guys coming here will surely throw all their efforts down the drain! Remember it’s not about having an open mind or not. Ultimately you guys will be held responsible if the pilots get a bad deal.
The fleet where you can make a few friends and not be noticed will be DHC-6 Command or FO, or the F-50 FO. Get posted anywhere else and you will find yourself getting cursed in foreign languages, ignored (by the girls too), not being served meal choices or drinks on time, spending layovers alone in the dark, doing all the work (and I mean all sectors and relevant paperwork). Just ask the Indonesian FO’s.
So all the best for your sim check ride.
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Hi
Hi Mr Jon Lei,
U mentioned about DHC-6,just want to know do u know about their operations in MAS?Would like to know about the conditions,number of flights per day,the ticket price and so on....
Will really appreciate it...thanx.
U mentioned about DHC-6,just want to know do u know about their operations in MAS?Would like to know about the conditions,number of flights per day,the ticket price and so on....
Will really appreciate it...thanx.