Cathay Pacific Cadet Pilot Programme

[paida]

hi, does anyone know if helicopter pilots stand a chance in getting into the CX cadet programme? and are there interviews in South Africa?

[Mr_Pilot]

CX experience.

What to expect from Cathay:

It was a long time ago I applied and I was in a much worse off place that I am now, so if you have just applied, be patient. The process for me took just over one year.

I did not make it all the way through, and am not disappointed. I would have like to worked for CX but was not happy about the pay they were offering, this came about because of personal circumstances current job and other issues (women).

Hopefully the following is something that you can all look through and appreciate as some information garnered through the trial and tribulation I endured. I loved the process and and used it for what it was, good practice.

The following is some info that I memorised and had on que cards to study and revise on top of the basic info they give you. It came in handy for me, and hopefully it may for you too. I will try and present it in chronological order with initial letter first then all subsequent information needed for initial and secondary interviews/selection then my 2 HKD’s worth.



Dear Mr_Pilot

With reference to your application to the Cathay Pacific Airways Second Officer, we confirm our conversation inviting you to an Initial Interview in XXX at XXXX on XXXX.

Venue: Cathay Pacific Office
XXXX
***Please continue to correspond with our Hong Kong office and only contact the XXXX office in the event of a cancellation on the day of your interview
XXXX

Kindly present the original and a photocopy of the following documents at the interview:

· Flying Licence, if applicable
· Medical Certificate applicable to above-mentioned Flying Licence
· All logbooks
· Results of PPL/CPL/ATPL theory examinations and proof of Multi-Engine Instrument Rating, if applicable
· Passport
· Education Qualifications including public exam results, high school certificates, university transcripts and certificate
· An update copy of your resume
· One passport size photograph with your name and application number on the reverse

Following this interview, shortlisted candidates will be invited to attend further assessments in Hong Kong. The necessary tickets on Cathay Pacific Airways and accommodation for the duration of the interview process will be provided. Kindly note that expenses will not be paid for attendance at the initial interview.

Enclosed is a confidential medical questionnaire which you are required to complete and submit at the interview in a sealed envelope, marked with your name and application number. An attachment entitled “Job Knowledge Information” is also included. This information should be studied in preparation for the 45 minute technical multiple-choice questionnaire.

If you have any queries, please contact XXXX

Yours sincerely

CX Office


**************************


Cathay Pacific Airways is pleased to invite you to attend our Second Officer Initial Selection in XXXX.

The process comprises of the following components:
- Interview with both Personal and Technical Questions (45mins)

(This is easy and should not pose a problem if consideration and preparation is done in accordance with the practice questions and you make up additional ones of your own)

- Technical multiple-choice Questionnaire (45mins)

So easy that it was not funny for someone with some flying experience – for those with none, you will need to study the book that they give you from the early turn of the century, I would recommend some addition basic reading too on Basic Aeronautical Knowledge, you should be able to fine enough online or go to a flying school and see if you can buy or borrow one, about 40 USD I would expect, or even half for a used one.

- Reasoning Test (45mins)

Again this was an absolute breeze, very much different to the QF boxes reasoning test, but matrix aligned reasoning of addition multiplication and substitution or rotation in picture format. I got a copy that some d1ckheads before me decided to write all over. I was happy to see they circled about 5 wrong. This is easy again if you look into your local library, or look up MENSA testing and do some practices to get the hang of what is required.

- A Personality Assessment (30mins)

I can not remember if I did do this, I don’t think I did. I honestly believe these are BS in the most part, but sometimes do keep the loons out. Hence maybe the reason I did not progress further than I did.


I did want to attach the basic letter of offered conditions here and will do so when I relearn how to do so via an outsorced HTML site. Basically it is 4 pages of notes, so the figures and fact are then public.



This is what you should prepare to know:


Approx 180,000 aircraft movements per year.
Just under 27 million pax per year.
1.8 million tonnes of freight.
90 million dollar revenue, 14 million profit.
19,000 core staff
27,000 in subsidiaries.

Founded 25/09/1946 by an American, Roy C Farrell, and Australian, Sydney H De Kranzow.

Major achievement in 1998 was achieving permission of the polar routing to NYC direct.

Swire group is the parent company and controlling intrest. They have a large stake in and control over many other businesses around asia, including – Air China, AC Cargo, Air Hong Kong, Dragon Air, etc.

Destinations:

Johanesburg
Adelaide
Brisbane
Cairns
Melbourne
Perth
Sydney
Auckland
Beijing
Shanghai
Taipai
Bahrain
Chenai
Dehli
Mumbai
Karachi
Jeddah
Ryadah
Colombo
Dubai
Paris
Frankfurt
Milan
Rome
Moscow
Amsterdam
London
Toronto
Vancover
Los Angeles
New York
San Fransisco
Denpesar
Jakata
Surabaya
Kula Lumpor
Penang
Cebu
Manilla
Singapore
Bangkok
Ho Chi Minh
Fuokoka
Nagoya
Osaka
Supporo
Tokyo
Seoul


Need to know: Hong Kong Lat Long: 22 deg 18 min 32 sec north. 113 deg 54 min 52 sec east.

Hong Kong: 95% ethnic Chinese – spoken language in my opinion is about 95% as well. Although you can get around speaking English it is about equivalent to living in Qubec city… although english is another official language people do treat you differently if you can not speak the language… although unlike the French Canadians I found the ethnic majority of Chinese to be very pleasant and accepting that I could not speak much of the language.

City consists of 7 million people.

New territories have been added. Know something about these.

Three goals of CX:
Safety first
Grow winning team
Socially and Environmentaly responsible

Base starting salary:

Approx 45,000 HKD refer to pictures for more official documentation and reasoning.

After expenses of living (housing, eating out, transport, bills and leisure expenses the take home pay after tax I calculated to be about 10,000HKD)

NB/ this is being frugal and living below my current standard of living. It is important to look for a place that you want to be happy living in when over there.


A/C and numbers:

Subject to change and I have found many varying sources from both official CX websites and documentation contradicting itself and other user posts here on prune.

120 currently online:

777-200 (5)
777-300 (12)
777-300ER (19)

747-400 (21)
747-400F (6)
747-400BCF (12)
747-400ECF (6)

A340-300 (11)

A330-300 (32)


AC on order: 90

777-300 (27)
747-8F (10)
A350-900 (32)
A330-300 (21)


Engines currently used on each AC:

777-200 T877
777-300 T884B
777-300ER GE90-115B

747-400 variants:

PW 4052
RB211-524

A340-300 CFM-56-564

A330-300 T772


You should know static or full thrust ratings for these engines, but will not post these as you need to know why the engines designators are what they are:

Ie. T877 is the Trent 8th series engine with 77,000 pound of thrust (from memory).

You need to know this if questioned.


NB// For anyone with previous flight experience; know your type and the speeds etc. Know what does what and why.

I unfortunately got asked some curly questions and was told to explain why certain aspects are used for certain periods in flight and why we do not change our speeds etc (company policy for us). But you will get asked to demonstrate the knowledge you have… not just regurgitate it.

Know your emergency procedures: (you should already) and more importantly think about the reasoning behind why.

Questions I was asked through various stages and prep’ed for:

 Name and identify the following AC and give reason to how you came to your choice. (best practice – go on airliners.net and have a look through there as there are multi-choice games where you can pick AC types, after a while you should form some distinction)
 What is the x-wind limit of current AC type, is this a demonstrated limit, what does demonstrated mean?
 This is the landing designated, wind is XX/XXX tell me x-wind and headwind components: I used the 60/45/30 method of 90/75/50 for my answering which seemed fine.
 What does a SO do? What would a likely roster be? How much time on and off do you expect to have?
 What AC do we operate?
 Where do we fly in Europe/Asia/Australasia/Japan/Middle East/Americas?
 What AC are on order?
 Why did you want to fly?
 What have you done towards getting your qualifications to fly?
 Why did it take you so long?
 Why did you choose your degree?
 What aspects did you enjoy most?
 Which aspect did you struggle with?
 What will you do if you don’t work for CX?
 How did you fund your PPL?
 How long did this take?
 Why did it take this long? Is this normal?
 When did you go solo?
 What other activities do you do?
 Why should we hire you?
 What would your friends say about you?
 What would ex bosses say about you?
 What role do you assume in teamwork?
 Are you a leader or follower? Why… justify your answer and give and example.
 Why did you choose aviation?
 How did you find out about the program?
 What is the differences b/n leading edge and trailing edge devices? What are the associated advantages of both.
 Why do we use flaps?
 Do we have nosewheel braking?
 What is the antiskid brake system… explain.
 What affect does G loading have on stall speeds… how is this calculated?
 Describe current job, boss, working environment.
 Tell me about CX.
 Who founded it.
 What was the first jet aircraft brought onto line?
 How did the idea for CX get started?
 Given a choice for AC type which would you choose and why?
 If you smelt alcohol on the Capt. Breath what would you do?
 Flight planned into sev turb what do you do?
 What is fly by wire and how does it work?
 Choosing between the A340 and 777 give reason for choice.
 Flex (derated) thrust… give three reasons for use.
 Define Vmcg Vmca Va V1 V2 at what height do you have to be one engine out at V2 what gradient is then expected? Gross and Net.
 What is the point of trim tanks, which AC have them?
 What engines does each plane operate?
 Why do we fly at high altitude?
 Rostered duty times? 5o 3off x 3 then 10 days rostered off. Normal pattern.
 3 reasons of why you wanted to become a pilot?
 What is the operating level of a 777?
 TOD calculations?
 Jet engine operations explain?
 How does a jet slow down? In air, and on ground?
 AC used at Parafield?
 Timings for each course at Parafield?
 Allowance paid while at Parafield?



Stage two acceptance letter:

Dear Mr_Pilot

Further to your application for the Cadet Pilot Programme and subsequent selection, we are pleased to advise you that you are shortlisted for the Stage 2 Interview.
We will inform you of the exact date of your interview in due course. Please contact us XXXXXXXXXXXXX if you have any queries.
Yours sincerely
Flight Crew Recruitment (Cadet Pilot)

Then…


Mr_Pilot

We hereby invite you to attend a Stage 2 Cadet Pilot Program Interview in Hong Kong on XXXXX.

Kindly provide the following information:

1) The airport you wish to use for departure and arrival; it must be a Cathay Pacific Airways on-line port and provide your name according to the passport.

2) Air passage will be provided to your spouse should he/she be interested in joining with you during the trip. Please provide copy of marriage certificate and passport details.

3) Current correspondence address and updated contact number for delivery of your tickets from Hong Kong (please provide physical address as FedEx does not deliver packages to Post Office Boxes).

4) Cathay Pacific will provide two to three nights' hotel accommodation only. The number of nights provided is determined by your flight schedule. You are welcome to extend your stay by arriving early or departing later at your own expense (please kindly arrange accommodation on your own), so please provide the travelling dates intended.

For entering Hong Kong, kindly visit the following web-site for visa enquiries:
The Government of the Hong Kong Special Administrative Region - Immigration Department

Any fines payable as a result of failure to have the correct travel documentation and/or Hong Kong visa at the time of travel ill be borne by the applicant.

Best Regards,

CX Cadet Program




Dear Mr_Pilot

SECOND OFFICER INITIAL INTERVIEW

Welcome to CX city, blah blah… Enclosed is a map of the surrounding areas for navigation. Access is strictly controlled, get your pass from downstairs in the main entrance.

Day 1:

Welcome brief:
Nothing to really say.

Interview:

Laid back and mostly informal – the process is varied, as some were interviewed by HR and a pilot where some were interviewed by just pilots it seemed. Know how to explain things about aviation if you are already a pilot, know timings and how these change with Longtitude and why. Know distances and timings of aircraft to fly between places.

Group exercise:

Scenario given where each member has 5 minutes to read a brief of what is involved and requested of them to choose a commander for space mission.

NB/ Each member is given different information for the selection. There are numerous applicants on the table in the middle, be sure to pick these up the examiners do not say anything and will not comment.

Use the board for working things out. Work together and divide tasks. They are looking to see you can work as part of a team. You then have to choose someone to present your decision and then answer each a question proposed by the interviewer.

How did you feel about the choice?
If you walked out for five minutes and came back, what would you change?
How did you think the group worked together?
What would you do differently?
Who was a leader?
Were they good?
What role do you think you played?
Was this more important or less important?
Etc.

Flight Planing exercise:

Given to a group of two you are given 10 minutes to digest an information package and prepare for a series of following questions?

NB/ you are given different information and should collaborate from the start. Ask to compare notes and make sure you both understand the additional differences.

Then you are given a series of scenarios at which you are asked to work both seperately and together.

At the end of the exercise you are required to write a report for management, into how and why you came to your decisions.

Mental Maths:

Seriously hard for some questions. Of absolute no real relevance to flying but more so conceptual equations like .9999 x 9999.9 x 1/9 = xxxxxxxxxx there is no multiple choice given for this, but you have to give a numerical answer. Horrible. I did okay I think as I have taught some of this crap maths, but find it provides no real benefit except for flight calculations or approximations in conceptualising data or timings.It may be good to revise again a math section on an IQ booklet if you have one, or again borrow one from the local library.

Harrison Test:

I like working with my hands.
I like being appreciated for my worth.
I like being paid a lot.
I like being autonomous.
I like talking others around to my point of view.
I like helping others.
I like teaching

Rank in order of importance.

Again, I feel like this is absolute BS and can not be studied for. I took this semi-seriously finishing about 17 questions in 13 minutes, at the end I was given a question that others were not (that I spoke to) saying to judge the relation of importance from highly like to dislike on areas of science math, being outdoors, etc etc.

Do not try and prep or manipulate as you should never try and fit into an organisation you are not designed for. Work for a company that want you for who you are otherwise you will end up being very unhappy. As I have tried and tested, changing my resume and profile to suit others.


Day 2:

Un/fortunately I did not pass and thus am unable to comment on any of the following, but I am sure there is some information on here for you to sift through.

Instead I got to go see the Big Budda via crystal cabin cable car – awesome and well worth the experience (although I don’t know about the management interview or medical having your balls felt up (– speaking to others), I guess that could have been just as enlightening!!! = - )

General Briefing:

English Language Test:

Medical Exam:

Uniform Measurement:

Management Interview:


Conclusion:

All in all I loved the experience that CX offered me. Speaking to my partner before we set off and after receiving the initial letter of consideration we were excited. However, with time and reading through posts and crunching the sums and life cost of moving, the excitement waned. However, the idea of a free trip was nice enough to push up the motivation levels again.

It is always good to feel loved and appreciated (god knows there are enough GA operators out there that would rather feed their dog than a working pilot). But I applied when I was not working, I then have moved on to a wonderful operator and do not want to leave unless I get something with more respect and money advancing my career towards and airline.

CX does provide this outcome for you. But I believe I came unstuck in the interview section for voicing my concerns over the pay package offered and that CX was now considered very much to be a seniority based airline. Interviewing with 1500+ hours I did not think I would have much trouble in adapting to the flight requirements and adjustment of an airline as I have done some GA time. Taking the package a s a whole would be a pay cut for me, and I would still be away from home the same amount. I have a lovely home and am able to live in a big city, in better conditions and location than anything near on offer in HK.

However, as one post beautifully put it, it does not matter if you have a million hours and 69 touch and goes on spaceship one, you are still going to get paid and treated the same as someone with no experience. You will not get promoted in front of these people and will not get recognition. This irritated me, and I made these concerns somewhat felt. In retrospect it was not the smartest thing to do. And ultimately may not have even been my reason for not being considered further.

If I was living in a Donga that I was four+ years ago on half my wage flying in the stinking heat and crap of just moving into GA, I would jump at this opportunity and not look back. It would maybe mean that I was even up for probationary first officer at this current time. However, I chose a different path. I am paid well, I am enjoying my life, and I have the ability to move and change my employer when I want – or when I am told by my boss or partner!

But I do wish everyone luck that does apply for this scheme. I do hope that you fly because you love it. I do hope you are going to be happy with your decision. I do hope that when things do pick up you get better conditions. I do hope that these conditions do not come until others that waited it out get them first, because I for one will be casting the first stone of annoyance if you think things will change. The bar has been set and it has been set low. As long as you are happy to live with this decision and raise kids etc in a local lifestyle mannar.

But I do hope that you realise what you can get paid somewhere else if you do wait it out.
I do hope you have read through all the pages previous and that you are happy in knowing that you may not fly for a while. I hope you like living in Hong Kong and realise what a life of an Airline pilot entails. It is not all glitz and Glamour, and if you are young and starry eyed, know very well, you will having nothing to look back on if you enter the program with no experience doing anything else.

Live within your means, and these will change. The flight crew you will be working with, are on 3-6 times as much money as you, and it is doubtful you will ever be able to accumulate as much money as these people. These will not be the people that you are able to make stable friendships and alliances as you are coming in on the local equivalent wage. Do not expect to eat at expat restaurants or get blind drunk in the Fong without worrying about where your next 70HKD are from. Although I hope you are able to find friends and make it all work out, I would think long and hard about leaving mates in whatever country you are that are happy to pay for a round and support you where you are on equal footing.

That being said I do know people that are in CX and are happy there. I guess once you are there and set up and established it may be alright as you hang out with other SO’s or expats, but again, not many people go there unless on a lot of money. And by a lot I mean more than twice what some of them get paid for doing the same thing in an equivalent first world country.

But judging from the postings and experience levels of people that came before, I felt somewhat embarrassed to apply for this scheme. Just as I would if someone with 500 hours applied and was hired for my job. Not to mention the proposed safety risks I would not like being undercut in pay.

I thank everyone for the postings they have helped put up as it has helped me make an informed and I believe balanced decision. CX do not care about you as an employer now as much about you as a number that can be incorporated into their system. I would love to be a number in this system, but the numbers being offered to me for this ‘opportunity’ are non-negotiable, and unfortunately a breaking point for many people.

All in all, the thing is I love my job, and still have room to grow in it. I am treated well and respected by my boss and colleagues. Hopefully with time and the growth in global economy again expansion or eventual retirement will force out more pilots, and the increased demand allows me to work locally for an operator that values the time and effort I have already invested in not only myself but aviation in general. This may be prudent to remember in that you are betting the next ten years of your life (6 years to probationary FO, then other 4 to accumulate enough hours to become competitive in a labour force for repatriation or to any other carrier re:P2X rating) against the concept that CX will improve your conditions above another upturn in the economy. And if this upturn occurs they will increase your wage to that of expatriated labour forces brought in ahead of you to ease any shortcomings? Again, I do not want to push my views on others as it is a decision for each persons circumstances, and if given the same thing a year ago I would have been a lot more humble and tried to suck up my pride. I want to let anyone out there that is aspiring to move onwards and upwards that although CX does offer something now that is good for some it is not always good for all. If you have the drive and passion for aviation it will still remain. I know people who love flying are now depressed and considering career moves away from aviation as they do not get to fly in being a SO. Just because you do not become a airline pilot now does not make you a failure in any means. There are a myriad of jobs out there and employers do look for people with the right attitude. Channel your passion to shaping the right stuff and you will be fine.

Good luck to all and I hope this helps someone out there as many before have helped and inspired me.

MP

[captain.weird]

Thank you very much MP!

[ArmstrongLimit]

Recent Stage 2 Interview

Any recent stage two invitations?

[tithybo]

not exactly true

Hye,

I just would like to correct some facts. The main change (which is enormous) is the housing allowance which now starts at 10,000 $HK per month, is taxable, and tops at 36,000 $HK when you are a senior captain.
The former housing allowance was around 80,000 $HK, even when a SO from what I've understood.
Your "regular" salary is not really changed, you are on the same scale.
The duty per diem has changed, it's now 10% of you salary.

So the other flight crew won't get 6 times more than you (I mean, i you compare yourself to another former SO), he will get definitely more (and a lot), but just be aware of the figure.

aloha

[crwjerk]

The duty per diem has changed, it's now 10% of you salary.

Only if you work 84 hours.

[SloppyJoe]

Rental allowance for a CN on the old terms is about HK$100K a month, when you make CN in around 14-18 years this will probably be more than your total package including the housing you get as is tied to the government rental index, something nothing in this new deal is. It will be a fight every time you try to increase it and will probably lose as they then have you getting up the seniority list and know it would be hard to start again elsewhere. This is not just a short term thing, it is your whole career and soon the HK$36K will be insignificant especially by the time you start to get that amount if you are joining now. The reason the CN expat rental is high is because that is what a CN has to spend to live in a place he would expect to be able to with his family if he were a CN with a legacy carrier in his home country. Joining on the new deal it is very unlikely that you will ever be able to live in a house, ever.

[Sparcky]

Just wondering im in the uk would they accept my application and if so do you think they would interview me here i know they fly from heathrow

[SloppyJoe]

Don't be a lazy bard and at least read their website. It answers your first question. Read maybe two pages of this thread if your too lazy to read the whole thing and it answers your second.

[Mr Hankey]

To take it further

So based on Titan 404's correct calculation you get about $35000 a month.

I just moved into a rented 2 bedroom 900 square ft apartment in a very "local" area in Kowloon, my rent is $38000 a month. It is very modest and in a complex with no other expats.

[Voiceofreason]

404 Titan's numbers make it seem like that 31% or 34% is paid every year. It's not. It's the first year that hurts, yes, but after that, even going by his figures, the annual tax rate on that amount would be 66486 / 604852 = 11%.

@ Hankey - that's nice for you. You could easily have chosen somewhere more affordable. I won't use my own place as an example, because others will throw it back at me and say I am a local, and therefore my comments don't apply for some reason. So, I will use another example of some friends who moved into an 1000sqft apartment in DB for $18,000 or others who moved into a 1400sqft place in S Lantau for $15k.

All depends on where you want to live. Sure, neither place is the height of activity, but it's the choice of space over convenient access to bars etc. Funnily enough, most cities around the world have that exact same dilemma...

[SpiritofMGL]

Did anyone who applied around last January hear back from CX?

[Voiceofreason]

Apart from EK/QR/EY, know any other airline that offers anything like a genuinely index-linked package? I don't want to live in the desert, but others do to get that, so fair enough. Index-linked packages are NOT the norm.

The question CX needs to ask itself is: is the package sufficient to attract enough people to join? Right now, it looks like it is, although who knows what kind of people are joining. If it's not the case in 10-15 years time, and people start leaving because they can't afford the rent/mortgage, do you really think they'll leave it there? They have a business to run. Simple supply and demand.

[404 Titan]

Voiceofreason

404 Titan's numbers make it seem like that 31% or 34% is paid every year. It's not. It's the first year that hurts, yes, but after that, even going by his figures, the annual tax rate on that amount would be 66486 / 604852 = 11%.

You must have a comprehension problem because I made it very clear it only applied to the first year. Quote:

In you first year of employment in Hong Kong you also need to budget for Provisional Tax, i.e. one year’s tax in advance. Therefore you need to double the above tax figures for your first tax bill.

For someone that calls themselves a “Voice of Reason” you truly are a sell out to your fellow local cadets. While we are trying to get them the same package we are on you are happy to play the role of the management mole and rosy everything up regarding the iCad scheme. Maybe you should change your name to “Voice of Management” or better still “Voice of Apathy”.

apathy [ˈæpəθɪ] n

1. absence of interest in or enthusiasm for things generally considered interesting or moving

2. absence of emotion

[from Latin, from Greek apatheia, from apathēs without feeling, from a-1 + pathos feeling]

Collins English Dictionary – Complete and Unabridged © HarperCollins Publishers 1991, 1994, 1998, 2000, 2003

[cyrilroy21]

Can an a current Cathay pilot please post the Housing allowance that is given exisiting S/O , F/O and Captains and how this differs from the new cadet pilot housing allowance ?

I also read somewhere that Hong Kong residents / natives who joined as cadets are also not paid housing allowance while expat pilots where paid the same . Is this true ? If so what is the reason ?

[SloppyJoe]

Basic numbers are, as an SO joining now you get 10K/month that will not rise, as an SO. Expats get 60K+/month tied to the government index, rises and falls with the market, locked in for two years when you rent or buy.

Yes if a local joined through the cadet scheme they would get the cadet package.

The reason for this is:

The had 0 experience when they joined

Hong Kong is their home, they are not moving away from home to work.

Expats get a good housing deal because:

It is what is required to get quality experience to move half way around the world to fly your planes.

Most guys who joined as DESO on expat terms had well over 3000 hours, many with a lot of jet time, many ex military, almost all with at least turboprop command time.

Competition was fierce and CX could choose who they wanted.

I am not saying I agreed with the housing deal for locals which until recently was 0. I firmly believe that once they are experienced they should be given a better deal. They pass the same checks, jump through the same hoops, fly the same planes. Many of the local guys who have now got experience are looking elsewhere for a better deal.

[Voiceofreason]

Sorry, it seems I've obviously put a few guys' noses out of joint. Trying to show that not everyone thinks this package is crap, and I'm not alone.

I'll bow out of this thread now, because obviously it's a bit sad having so many current CX crew on a Wannabes forum banging their heads together in disagreement.

If anyone wants a reasonable debate/questions answered, please feel free to PM me.

[stillalbatross]

Dude, its a free forum so you are more than entitled to your opinion. It amazes me how many CX pilots tell me how crap the place is and then look elsewhere and find it's not so bad after all. Which somehow pisses them off more................

If you want an expat job anywhere you need widebody time or you need to get into an airline that takes you without widebody time and gives it to you. There are f*ck all of those about. This is what CX is offering, make the decision for yourself, what is best for you, right now, in your situation, in the current pilot market.

This place is legendary for everyone already here grabbing whatever the company offers because it suits them. And then coming up with some lame ass excuse why they were somehow forced into taking it. If the company is offering and it suits you then take it.

As for the idea that 18K for 1000 sq/ft in DB is going up considerably more, 49out of 50 analysts don't see much more upside in this current market. I' d put a beer on a max 18K/1000 sq/ft being good for the next 5 yrs.

[crwjerk]

Here are this week's figures from DB

1011 sqft = 35K
1037 sqft = 33K
742 sqft = 32K
727 sqft = 20K
718 sqft = 17K
1133 sqft = 50K
1088 sqft = 25K
533 sqft = 12K
515sqft = 10K

Small selection from a brochure. 6 July 2011

[404 Titan]

stillalbatross

I couldn’t care what 49 out of 50 analysts are saying. Most have a vested interest in peddling a particular position. Are they saying how much it will decline by? You have only got to look at the last 11 years to see what has happened to rents in Hong Kong. They have at least doubled and that includes the declines from 911 (2001), SARS (2003) and the GFC (2008). If you think it is going to decline over the next 10 – 20 years, and that is what all new pilots need to consider, you’re dreaming. Remember the HPA is a fixed amount and all new pilots are going to have to fight with the company to have it raised to keep up with inflation and the current market prices. Look how much fighting we have had with the company just for pay rises over the last 11 years. It speaks volumes of what all new pilots will face negotiating any future increases in the HPA. Even if we can’t get the HPA increased for all new pilots right now, it should at least be pegged to the HK rental index.