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-   -   Right into the storm! (https://www.pprune.org/safety-crm-qa-emergency-response-planning/498240-right-into-storm.html)

KiloMikePapa 17th Oct 2012 08:56

Right into the storm!
 
Is this acceptable?

This will be a full stop landing! - YouTube

Wirbelsturm 17th Oct 2012 09:57

Personally I would have held off.

Perfect place for microbursts AND he was low on the approach, 4 reds on finals. Unless there was a dire fuel emergency there was no reason not to hold off unitl the cell went through.

But we don't get the whole story from a YouTube video.

KiloMikePapa 17th Oct 2012 11:34

Going around? Rather not I think.
 
And what about a possible go-around? Would have been 'interesting' in these conditions.

TowerDog 17th Oct 2012 11:59

What type of airplane was it...?

ZFT 17th Oct 2012 12:07

Fokker 100

lurkio 17th Oct 2012 12:58

Wirbelsturm - totally agree but if you are going to make an approach make the chap in the RHS put the camera away and concentrate on what they are paying him to do. Looks great on youtube but not so good at the accident investigation.

Sciolistes 22nd Oct 2012 04:50

I've seen this one before. The FOs WX radar pointing at the ground and displaying predominantly ground returns whilst flying towards a CB.

Airline WX radar training has been seriously lacking in both airlines I worked for.

Lookleft 22nd Oct 2012 11:32

Have a look at the tilt. That was the TS that it was painting! Nine times out of ten they will get away with a landing like that but as AF found out in Toronto one day its going to bite you. Better off having the fuel to hold and wait for it to pass. Like some have said if you do have to go-around on short final you might just take on a whole new world of pain.

Smudger 12th Nov 2012 20:39

Schoolboy stuff.... wait for it to go through or divert... if you don't have the fuel to do that then that is your fault... these are the decisions that us captains are paid to make... does no-one remember Dallas ? Obviously these two fools did not.

Hotel Tango 6th Dec 2012 19:45


make the chap in the RHS put the camera away and concentrate on what they are paying him to do.
I'm pretty convinced that the camera was secured and not hand held during the later phases of the approach and landing. These guys fly in that kind of c**p almost every day in these countries. I'd say that they have more local wx experience than some of u 6 flights a month long haul drivers :oh::E

de facto 8th Dec 2012 03:46


These guys fly in that kind of c**p almost every day in these countries. I'd say that they have more local wx experience than some of u 6 flights a month long haul drivers
Seriously??Your post was obviously ironic so im gonna keep my mouth :mad: as I may get temporarly banned..:E

Hotel Tango 8th Dec 2012 20:28

Only one bit. I must be losing my touch ;)

GlueBall 11th Dec 2012 14:11

Wirbelsturm . . .
 

..."he was low on the approach, 4 reds on finals."
Weather minimums required this to be an ILS approach, (ILS Rwy-06 minimums 800 meters). Keep in mind that the ILS electronic glide path at many airports is not always precisely aligned with the VASI/PAPI, it often varies, as may be apparent in this approach to Rwy-06 at HAV.

Before turning "red," the left outer PAPI light in fact, remained illuminated white until 150 feet on short final, which technically is within visual glide-path limits of narrow body airplanes as this Fokker. The R/A altitude announced "50" (feet) crossing the threshold, and that's not "low." (B747 threshold crossing heights at standard ILS installations is typically 53 feet).

On this required ILS approach, there was no (below) "glide-slope" warning, so the flight path must have been within the limits of the electronic glide path.

As a side note: Why would you give preference to the visual glide path guidance on short final during an ILS approach when on profile?

Especially if it were a coupled approach, on-glide-path, . . . would you suddenly go-around if you caught a visual glimpse of four "reds" on a PAPI, on short final at 100, or 150 feet? :ooh:

Lookleft 22nd Dec 2012 07:01


These guys fly in that kind of c**p almost every day in these countries. I'd say that they have more local wx experience than some of u 6 flights a month long haul drivers
I didn't realise that some countries have different thunderstorms to other countries.


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