Pax point out hole in Air Berlin aircraft
"Mildly" Eccentric Stardriver
Years ago I was flying Trislanders. Because a failure of the centre engine wasn't that obvious, there was a light on the panel marked "No. 2 Engine Fail". The system was switched on before takeoff, and subsequently the light began to flash. Bearing in mind that the first pax row is directly behind the pilot, and we frequently had a passenger in the RHS, it was common to get the dig in the back of the neck and.."Ere, pilot".
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You never know
A long long time ago, when I was about 15yrs old, took a flight (without parents) from LHR to Jersey, in a viscount. In the cruise I noticed a crack across the top of the LHS inside engine mount, slowly getting longer. I ask the CC if it was normal - they didn't know, but told the flight deck. Man with stripes arrived, looked at it and with horror in his eyes said "that's normal young man, but we will stop the engine to be on the safe side". Safe 3 engine landing was the result.
Most Tridents had slats, though presumably the OP is referring to Papa India which, being a 1C, had droops instead.
Either way, PI certainly didn't take off with the crew having forgotten to deploy them.
Either way, PI certainly didn't take off with the crew having forgotten to deploy them.
Yes North African..it was actually Air Algerie who had taken eco tankage into GVA and onto ZRH. Our ground crew had checked but not checked and there was a layer of clear ice on the wings which my skipper spotted. Ex Luftwaffe strarfighter...incredibly talented the whole bunch.
The crew went all the way to the threshold of 23, lined up and put on loads of power which saw my skipper go white but they were just speeding up the process of getting back to the ramp. It took two full goes to clear the ice.
Our DC9s had tell tales added to aid clear ice detection as it is extremely difficult to see.
The ANC case was also ex Luftwaffe...but everyone could see an inch or so of dry snow on the wing...quite sure that the local FAA tolerated the practice.
WRT to dents..her indoors had five hours getting drunk in Nimes after a frog loader drove into FR cargo hold frame...engineer decided that he couldn't inspect the internals so they flew down another 737.
And we had a big airways "senior first officer" tell us all how he was a clever boy and had discovered a dent at LHR on a 74 with the paint peeling off...the insides weren't much better with threadbare carpets and the entertainment system not working...haven't been back since.
The crew went all the way to the threshold of 23, lined up and put on loads of power which saw my skipper go white but they were just speeding up the process of getting back to the ramp. It took two full goes to clear the ice.
Our DC9s had tell tales added to aid clear ice detection as it is extremely difficult to see.
The ANC case was also ex Luftwaffe...but everyone could see an inch or so of dry snow on the wing...quite sure that the local FAA tolerated the practice.
WRT to dents..her indoors had five hours getting drunk in Nimes after a frog loader drove into FR cargo hold frame...engineer decided that he couldn't inspect the internals so they flew down another 737.
And we had a big airways "senior first officer" tell us all how he was a clever boy and had discovered a dent at LHR on a 74 with the paint peeling off...the insides weren't much better with threadbare carpets and the entertainment system not working...haven't been back since.
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Over the years I have had many passengers tell me about things they find strange. The first thing I do is thank them for their comment. Then I have a look and then explain what I have found. If I can't see what they told me about, I get them outside to show me. To date, nobody has found anything we didnt know about beforehand but plenty of items on the MEL have been spotted by eagle eyed pax. I hope they never stop looking.
A female passenger boarding what was to become the Hawaii convertible 737 noticed the crack but decided to say nothing on the premise that they (the airline) know what they're doing. Wonder the reaction now if the pax had said something.
C-FONF was a F-28 that crash on take off due to snow and ice contaminated wings. A DC-9 Captain and a Dash 8 Captain were both dead heading, the latter stated that "professional courtesy" precluded an off duty pilot drawing the attention of flight crew to a safety concern.
We're a weird lot.
C-FONF was a F-28 that crash on take off due to snow and ice contaminated wings. A DC-9 Captain and a Dash 8 Captain were both dead heading, the latter stated that "professional courtesy" precluded an off duty pilot drawing the attention of flight crew to a safety concern.
We're a weird lot.
As an FO, I DID point out that we were high and fast on a short wet runway. (Used all of those terms)
Ol' skip carried on and landed anyway, bursting all the maingear tyres. Fortunately we didn't go off the end.
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I was six years old on my first flight heading to visit the grandparents sitting window over port wing of a DC-6. Only thing kids could do then is look out the window and marvel at the ability to fly. Noticed oil streaming back out of the cowling of the port inner back over the wing during cruise. Tugged on mum's shirt, she flagged down the stew who took a quick look and then went forward. One of the front office came back, leaned over took a look and said in what was classic pilot vernacular 'that's normal for these old buckets but thank you and keep watching it for me' after which I received my first set of wings. I knew what I wanted to do for a living and my doodling in school was airliners from then on - no more trains.
A few years back in YOW, I noticed a fine sprinkling of precip on the wing and pressed the CC call button to ask if the precip was liquid or frozen.
The captain called me forward and suggested that at 3C it had to be liquid. I stated that in my a/c I'd be putting a finger on it to make sure.
I abstained from discussing the physics of cold soaked wings and fuel tanks.
Some years before I observed frost over a tank on a 20+ day, but that type was approved for takeoff with frost in that limited area.
A rampie appeared shortly after and verified it was liquid.
The captain called me forward and suggested that at 3C it had to be liquid. I stated that in my a/c I'd be putting a finger on it to make sure.
I abstained from discussing the physics of cold soaked wings and fuel tanks.
Some years before I observed frost over a tank on a 20+ day, but that type was approved for takeoff with frost in that limited area.
A rampie appeared shortly after and verified it was liquid.
Another time we had been de-iced, noticed residual ice and had the job done again after photographing the evidence.
On yet another occasion, guy threw a bucket of hot water over a cold-soaked wing. Needless to say, it froze on contact.
Boeing 737 taxiing out in the UK. Old lady in front row tells cabin crew she can see out through a gap round L1 door. Ignored by cabin crew. Aircraft launches and fails to pressurise. Air turnback.
Last edited by Private jet; 27th May 2017 at 12:16. Reason: typo
Paxing All Over The World
Piltdown Man has it right:
We now know FOR SURE, that a picture of the hole/defect/speedtape will be on social media before the chocs are pulled. CEOs should be making it very clear that, whilst it may be irritating to get five people pointing out the speedtape - it's cheaper than the social media meltdown afterwards, over something that was not an issue.
The first thing I do is thank them for their comment. Then I have a look and then explain what I have found. If I can't see what they told me about, I get them outside to show me. To date, nobody has found anything we didnt know about beforehand but plenty of items on the MEL have been spotted by eagle eyed pax. I hope they never stop looking.
Last edited by PAXboy; 28th May 2017 at 02:18.
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October 1999 flying Manchester to Gatwick (thence Phoenix, Oakland to join a ship in Oakland) noticed that most of the fasteners, Dzus(?) that secured a wing panel over the right hand engine of the BA737 were missing. When we landed I checked the left hand side and 100% present. Tried asking the cabin crew to pass on to the fight deck, but not interested.
Admittedly nothing was flapping or fell off during the 30 odd minutes MAN to LGW, but I'm sure the fasteners should have been there...
Admittedly nothing was flapping or fell off during the 30 odd minutes MAN to LGW, but I'm sure the fasteners should have been there...
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Multiple layers of speed tape from the inside with a good overlap from the hole, put some heavy bags on top of it and probably good 'til the next D Check. 
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In the late 1980s I was positioning JER-GCI on a clockwork Tristar with another member of crew,we had the last row just below the engine on the fin.The pilot taxied to the hold on two engines,we naturally expected the third engine to start before TO but no we lined up and powered up and started to roll,we both shouted STOP!! The pilot vacated the runway taxied back to the hold and started the third engine and took off.
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