Lion 737 skids off runway
 

Why is this company still operating?

Their AOC needs to be suspended ASAP imho.

Anyone want to speculate on damage? Write off or repair? If 2 writeoffs then how will insurers react?

One user wrote in Indonesian: "Thank god all the passengers are safe."

Others reacted with resignation, including one person who said "Lion being Lion again", possibly referring to the airline's recent troubles.

Easy to criticise, particularly with no facts. (poss defective brakes, flaps, slats, hydraulics) Any number of abnormals can affect landing distance adversely.

And unless you have operated in the Indonesian arena, you have no idea of the truly nasty weather that can occur without warning, and often over airfields with pretty basic support.

I'm not making excuses for them, simply pointing out how easy it is to point the finger of blame without any background.

To echo RoyHudd, if you read the fantastic book about PanAm, Skygods, by Robert Gandt, you'l lrecall that unlike all other domestic US carriers, who had a multitude of navigation beacons and ILS approaches to fly to, PanAm had to fly all over the third world and into horrendous weather. WIth nothing but NDBs often, there were, unfortunately several tragic accidents. Today, we'd be calling for their AOC to be pulled, " Typical PanAm" ,etc. etc. Granted, they didn't have IRS, GPS and modern RNAV1 on their 707s, but the weather is no better nowadays.

Having said that, Lion Air are not known for their skill in handling the aircraft and the Ex pats they employ are also said to be not exactly top of the heap in reputation sometimes. I remain unconvinced of these accusations. I wouldn't fly with them just in case though....

Another 20m of runway and we wouldn't have heard anything about it. An interesting evacuation, just about every passenger was carrying something off the plane.

The engines look knackered. The NLG is stuffed, MLG probably also stuffed. I reckon it's worth more as parts than to try and fix it.

Perhaps some of you should take a more detailed look at Lion's safety record. The number of runway excursions is shocking.

They've even had 2 over-runs at the same airport in less than 24 hours. There's also the Bali crash where they flew into the sea - that makes for interesting reading.

The stories from people who've worked there show there is zero safety culture - which is true of Indonesia in general. Just look at their record with ferries.

One of the owners is a Politician with a lot of influence - that means he is above the Law in that part of the world.

The JT610 report will be an interesting read as well.

The mains look OK in the photos I've seen, just well bogged down in the soft ground. The same may well be the case for the NLG. Assuming they are OK, you don't scrap an 8-month old aircraft just for the sake of a couple of engines.

There was a time when the manufacturer (presumably under pressure from the feds) would say enough is enough and parachute in a new training department.

yes well - lots of small airports, lots of bad weather and these days lots and lost of flights - there IS a Safety Culture but TBH it's more like the USA or Europe 40 years ago. Better than it was and improving I think.
I can remember Nigerian A/W putting three F-27's off the end of the runway at Enugu in 4 days - similar reasons

One of the prices you pay if you fly in that part of the world - and the roads and ferries are much much worse

Long landing on a short, wet runway. Predictable results.

Go-around = Loss of 'Face' in this culture.

Garuda 200 in 1997 is an extreme example of this.

Flap setting? Application of reverse above idle?
 

Are the flaps at 15º for the landing? (they appear to be extended at 40º during the evacuation).

Did the engine sound appear NOT to increase during the landing roll?

I think all your assumptions are correct! :sad:

The back half of the aircraft was still over the runway. Apparently there was no urgency in getting off the plane (See youtube video) Why did they evacuate?? Looks like poor airmanship and decision making all the way to the end to me!

It makes sense to get as much weight as possible off the wheels before attempting a recovery but I am rather surprised that they did not bring stairs.