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-   -   Tow truck on fire (https://www.pprune.org/rumours-news/609970-tow-truck-fire.html)

skadi 12th Jun 2018 08:44

According to a german newspaper the turbocharger of the towtruck exploded...

skadi

Stan Woolley 12th Jun 2018 13:49

Has such an event ever happened with a loaded aircraft with the crew in the flight deck?

Secondly I was surprised to hear that there was nobody on board. I thought that there had to be someone to set and release the brakes, how does the tug driver get it on and off?


Tom Sawyer 12th Jun 2018 13:50


Originally Posted by sandos (Post 10171111)
Thats a valiant effort, any idea what sort of exploded? I guess it was something in the tug and not from the aircraft. They were lucky there wasn't a bigger explosion. Thinking oxygen tanks, that could have been interesting.

Same thing happened to me few years ago (funnily enough while towing an A340) and it was a high pressure hydraulic leak spraying on to the hot engine. As it was a towbar and not towbarless tug we were able to disconnect the towbar and let the aircraft roll back under control of the brake rider (luckily the ramp had a slight slope backwards). We couldn't put the fire out either despite best efforts, but luckily no damage to the airframe at all. Believe the tugs (Bliss Fox) were modified after that to have a fire suppression/extinguisher system installed.

Tom Sawyer 12th Jun 2018 14:46


Originally Posted by Stan Woolley (Post 10171391)
Has such an event ever happened with a loaded aircraft with the crew in the flight deck?

Secondly I was surprised to hear that there was nobody on board. I thought that there had to be someone to set and release the brakes, how does the tug driver get it on and off?






Certainly with some Airbuses there is a connection point on the Nose Leg that can give the tug driver control of the aircraft brakes as they are electrically controlled, hydraulically actuated system, so with power connected from the tug, the appropriate control system in the tug and sufficient accumulator pressure, the brakes can be released/set. Can't remember full details of the system (just the basics from my various Airbus type courses) as never used, or seen the system used anywhere but appears LH tugs may use the system. All my experience is based around tug driver/headset operator/brake rider operations both towbar and towbarless tugs.

In reply to your PM as well Stan.

Stan Woolley 12th Jun 2018 14:55

You learn something every day. Thanks Tom.

I found this an interesting if tricky scenario from a pilots pov. If the driver bails out when he’s on headset too, the crew are blind to what’s happening. I realise it may be the same when an engine catches fire, but this just seems to me more sinister. :ok:

SMT Member 12th Jun 2018 18:44


Originally Posted by Stan Woolley (Post 10171391)
Has such an event ever happened with a loaded aircraft with the crew in the flight deck?

Secondly I was surprised to hear that there was nobody on board. I thought that there had to be someone to set and release the brakes, how does the tug driver get it on and off?

As Tom kindly explained, some 'busses have a toggle switch on the NLG to set/release brakes. On other types, or where the system is installed but not used, the driver will connect the tractor (usually, if not exclusively, a TBL type) and set its brakes. Then he'll enter the aircraft, release parking brakes, exit aircraft whilst closing the door and remove the jetty/stairs. Opposite procedure when towing has been completed. This is, at some airports, performed as a single-man operation - both push-back and towing.

BAengineer 13th Jun 2018 00:13

What model of Airbus has a remote parking brake selector switch on the nose gear?. I am Licenced on A320 series, A330 and A340 and have never come across anything as described. The only components on the Nose gear are the Nose Wheel Steering bypass selector and the indicator light showing whether brakes are applied or not.

Is this a customer option on something like the A318 biz jet?

krismiler 13th Jun 2018 01:26

The same thing happened 6 months ago with an SQ B777.

Considering the age of the aircraft involved and it's unpopularity on the used market it will likely have to be written off as repaires will cost more than its worth.

Tom Sawyer 13th Jun 2018 09:53


Originally Posted by BAengineer (Post 10171742)
What model of Airbus has a remote parking brake selector switch on the nose gear?. I am Licenced on A320 series, A330 and A340 and have never come across anything as described. The only components on the Nose gear are the Nose Wheel Steering bypass selector and the indicator light showing whether brakes are applied or not.

Is this a customer option on something like the A318 biz jet?


You maybe right that it is an option. Just been through the AMM for a couple of the Airbuses I work on for different operators and can find no reference or procedure for towing with a "remote" parking brake operation. Pretty sure it was discussed on my various type courses (A320/330/340/380) and SMT seems to have a similar idea to me. Time to get the course notes out if I can find them.

BAengineer 13th Jun 2018 12:31

I'm struggling to see how a remote brake selector would work. If you are going to use reservoir pressure then you will have to get on the flt deck to check the gauges and possibly top up the pressure before you set off so you may as well use the parking brake switch that is on the flt deck.

wiedehopf 13th Jun 2018 12:53

Ok so this is probably a really dumb question:

With a supertug that lifts the front wheels can't you just use chocks only?
Why would you even need the parking brake that is released when the aircraft is parked?

BAengineer 13th Jun 2018 13:24

Not a dumb question at all. Some operators do exactly what you suggest.

sb_sfo 13th Jun 2018 16:27

I'm with BAEngineer-never seen that system installed on any Airbus. This could have easily been a live pushback with hundreds of pax aboard. I had heard years ago that LH was towing departures almost to the runway threshhold- is this still the case? I have a hard time trusting the towbarless tractors, but they do move an aircraft in a hurry.

gearlever 13th Jun 2018 16:40


Originally Posted by sb_sfo (Post 10172272)
I had heard years ago that LH was towing departures almost to the runway threshhold- is this still the case?

NO.
It was a trial, during fuel crisis.

NEVER EVER SOP.

sb_sfo 14th Jun 2018 05:43

Gearlever, thanks for clearing that up for me.

LeadSled 15th Jun 2018 04:06

Folks,
Re. a "Hull Loss", if this is written off, it will be a hull loss in the statistics.
Almost every year, there are hull losses that are not the result of an "accident" as defined, or an act of war. The insurance market is quite smart enough to differentiate between a hull loss as the result of an accident, and one the result of some other misadventure --- several cases of cleaners managing to set fire to aircraft comes to mind.
Tootle pip!!

EDML 17th Jun 2018 20:55


Originally Posted by gearlever (Post 10172276)
NO.
It was a trial, during fuel crisis.

NEVER EVER SOP.

No, there is a lot more behind it.

There is a project called "TaxiBot" that is certified to use a special tug controlled by the cockpit crew to bring a loaded airplane to the runway. It is certified for B737 and A320 and has been used for LH passenger flights departing FRA.

Marcus

EDML 17th Jun 2018 20:57

Here is a video about the A320 certification in Tolouse:

BAengineer 17th Jun 2018 22:27


Originally Posted by EDML (Post 10175349)
There is a project called "TaxiBot" that is certified to use a special tug controlled by the cockpit crew to bring a loaded airplane to the runway. It is certified for B737 and A320 and has been used for LH passenger flights departing FRA.

Marcus

Its an interesting concept but I am struggling to see the point. This system still has tug drivers in the cab so why go to all the expense of fitting extra steering systems in the aircraft for the pilot to steer when the tug drivers can just tow the aircraft to the departure point and drop it off.

EDML 18th Jun 2018 10:48


Originally Posted by BAengineer (Post 10175399)
Its an interesting concept but I am struggling to see the point. This system still has tug drivers in the cab so why go to all the expense of fitting extra steering systems in the aircraft for the pilot to steer when the tug drivers can just tow the aircraft to the departure point and drop it off.

The aircraft is not modified to use the system.

Marcus


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