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LATAM Airlines finds bullet hole in B767
Latam Airlines finds bullet hole in Boeing 767 in Brazil | Reuters
REUTERS -- Latam Airlines Group found a bullet hole in a wing of a Boeing 767-300 during maintenance in Brazil, the company said on Wednesday, the jet having flown to New York, Barcelona and Lima in the past week. The aircraft, which runs long-range routes out of international airports in Rio de Janeiro and Sao Paulo, went in for routine inspection on Sunday, a Latam representative said. "There is no way to be certain where it happened," she said. "The airplane flies various routes." In a statement, the airline said it had notified federal police and civil aviation authority ANAC, which it was still investigating. ANAC said it was supporting a police investigation. "Latam underscores that the incident did not compromise the security of its operation," said the airline, Latin America's largest carrier. Incident: LATAM B763 at Sao Paulo on Jan 15th 2017, aircraft being shot at http://i.imgur.com/75Dm1AL.jpg |
Being a 7.62, it's probably from an AK47 that are common around Rio de Janeiro. Given the routes for that plane, I'd bet it was shot while landing at GIG. Probably after flying over some "favela", a straight-up shot could reach it.
And considering that drug dealers use to fire just to practice or for fun, I bet someone just aimed and shot. Luckily, no serious damage was done nor a passenger was hit. |
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hmm looks spent to me......
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looks fake to me
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Loma, I am with you. The tip of that projectile is not deformed at all. I'd have thought that it hitting a flying plane might have an impact on the tip ...
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The tip of that projectile is not deformed at all. I'd have thought that it hitting a flying plane might have an impact on the tip ... |
Originally Posted by Small cog
(Post 9646529)
7.62 is also NATO standard.
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Spin-stabilized bullets tend to keep the orientation they had when they left the barrel, not streamline. It's entirely possible that the bullet was falling base-first when the plane hit it. I agree with lonewolf about the tip but I was making my jugements about the damage to the skin is not from a ballistic impact >500 ft/s |
how much damage would you expect in a hard-tipped bullet hitting aluminium? Would be nice to hear from a ballistics expert.
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It's evident from the photo that the bullet hit the LE flap whilst it was extended, and the mushrooming about the tip in the first photo shows that it entered tip first. From experience I would guess the aircraft was probably at about 2,000 feet when hit, if the fire were vertical, of course lower if oblique, which would seem to be the case with LE extended. One occasion I had a crewman sitting on the floor with his back against my seat and we took a burst of AK while flying at 2,000. He jumped up with an expletive and found a round had penetrated the outer skin and caused just a dent to the floor where his buttocks were positioned. It was generally assumed that at 1,500 you were safe from AK.
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It's entirely possible that the bullet was falling base-first when the plane hit it. Also, bear in mind that the round in question looks like a FMJ military round; they will only deform if they strike a material that is harder than their jacket. The skin on the LE flap is probably 2090-T84 aluminium-lithium alloy or possibly 7475-T73 alloy; both are controlled toughness alloys with reasonably high strength that are fracture and fatigue crack resistant. However, they are not particularly resistant to penetration. Given the minimal penetration and lack of deformation it does not appear to have been a particularly high energy impact. If I had to hazard a guess I'd say that the projectile was descending at the point of impact. |
how much damage would you expect in a hard-tipped bullet hitting aluminium? Would be nice to hear from a ballistics expert. |
If I had to hazard a guess I'd say that the projectile was descending at the point of impact. I'll hazard a guess it was a bad shot, aimed upwards, and the bullets energy was largely spent upon contact with the flap. :) It may even have been a "celebratory fire event". Forensic Outreach.com - library - the falling bullet myths legends and terminal velocity |
I'll hazard a guess it was a bad shot, aimed upwards, |
I'd hazard a guess that your guess is wrong. In keeping with what EEngr said, The Forensic Outreach Team make the point that; If fired at an angle between 20 to 45 degrees or even more, then the bullet will travel farther with a greater probability of hitting something (or someone). The uninterrupted ballistic trajectory will make it far less likely to engage in a tumbling motion, and allow it to continue at a higher speed over terminal velocity. If I had to hazard a guess I'd say that the projectile was descending on an uninterrupted ballistic trajectory at the point of impact. |
It was generally assumed that at 1,500 you were safe from AK. |
If I had to hazard a guess I'd say that the projectile was descending on an uninterrupted ballistic trajectory at the point of impact. |
In ancient history, when my squadron was flying in a hot war, the briefing was that the small arms envelope extended up to 3000 ft. and could be considered dense.
That should still be a fairly good number for shoulder fired, gunpowder propelled, projectile weapons. |
In ancient times, when I was in basic training in the German army, we learned the safety distance for a G3 (7.52x51) was 3000m, the effective combat range of the same gun when mounted was 900m.
I don't know at what point the projectile goes transonic (and starts to tumble), but I guess it's probably at 2000+ m. I heard the AK47 has a somewhat shorter barrel, so the bullets should be a bit slower, but they still should reach up a few thousand feet. |
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