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-   -   Malaysian Airlines MH370 contact lost (https://www.pprune.org/rumours-news/535538-malaysian-airlines-mh370-contact-lost.html)

Phileas Fogg 11th Mar 2014 11:46

This incident comes to mind:

http://www.pprune.org/rumours-news/4...zhma-komi.html

Bushfiva 11th Mar 2014 11:47


Originally Posted by Mixture
Oh dear.... :ugh:

You evidently do not realise that unless you are paying a commercial satellite operator $$$ for a bespoke tasking, ALL satellite imagery you see on the public internet, and especially all imagery you see for free is taken from historical archives .... if you are lucky it might be a few months old, but most imagery is a couple of years old at least.

Oh dear.... you evidently don't realise DigitalGlobe, which owns Tomnod, retasked two of its 5 satellites to photograph the area on Sunday.


Edit: But Tomnod's been wilting under the load for a while now, but did serve something like 22000 images while it was up.

ASY68 11th Mar 2014 11:49

Can the B777 have both IDGs turned off and still operate? What would said system affect?

ASY68 11th Mar 2014 11:54

Tim - Highly unlikely as both those islands have large Australian Government presence on them and we would know they have rocked up there already.

glenbrook 11th Mar 2014 11:55


Originally Posted by Heliads (Post 8366409)
I have been in Asia for over a decade. An Asian person laughing or smiling/joking may often suggest nervousness rather than humour. Please correct me if you think I am wrong about this. Still not had an answer to: has anyone checked the Paracels yet?

Absolutely true, if you complain to someone in Asia, first thing they will do is laugh at you. But it's for your benefit, to help stop you getting angry and losing face.

The Paracels are very carefully monitored by China. Furthermore as has been pointed out, the Malaysians have admitted that the a/c flew over the Malay peninsula towards Indonesia.

MrMachfivepointfive 11th Mar 2014 11:58

Elephant in the room. Another Silk Air 185, LAM 470, Egypt 990? Vertical impact at >M1.0 would leave very little in terms of a debris field.

Hempy 11th Mar 2014 12:06


Originally Posted by MrMachfivepointfive (Post 8366459)
Elephant in the room. Another Silk Air 185, LAM 470, Egypt 990? Vertical impact at >M1.0 would leave very little in terms of a debris field.

Disregarding surface tension of course..

Tim Hamilton 11th Mar 2014 12:07

I was just thinking very big picture (Tom Clancy) stuff.


I think we are all scenario exhausted.


I am sure the truth has already been discussed in one of these 1700 posts


Just which one remains elusive.


I still feel we are not been told everything.

MrMachfivepointfive 11th Mar 2014 12:16


Disregarding surface tension of course..
The resulting confetti will get lost in the trillions of plastic grocery bags already floating in those waters.

Frequent Traveller 11th Mar 2014 12:16

@ Tim Hamilton re "I am sure the truth has already been discussed in one of these 1700 posts"

You may safely assume 1900+ posts, adding all posts that have been edited away, such as the Ukraine Theory, or the Gold Bullion cargo manifest theory

Coagie 11th Mar 2014 12:25

YRP
"Michelson interference? As in the Michelson-Morley experiment on the speed of light that demonstrated the lack of an ether (or that by a coincidence we happen to be stationary relative to the ether... always wondered why they discounted that possibility so readily -- okay only being tongue-in-cheek here :) ). I'm not quite sure what that has to do with underwater acoustics..."




YRP, Michelson's interference theory is about frequencies and what happens when they mix with one another, etc. It applies to light waves, radio waves and sound waves. It's the basis of the heterodyne circuit I wrote about, that's used in radios, fiber optic telecommunication, as well as sound beacon detection equipment, allowing it to focus on only one frequency, as sensitivity is lost, as the band you're listening for widens.

Anyway, My whole point was the submarine in the AF447 search was not set up for finding the 37.5khz pinger, and that I hoped something was learned from that, and we shouldn't assume a submarine is the best way to listen for a pinger, unless it's specifically set up for it. This disappearance is puzzling. Maybe more is known, but just not leaked to the press. Maybe the governments in that part of the world, don't leak info, but instead, wait 'till they have all their stuff in one sock to report. Maybe the western press is spoiled by it's leaky governments!

mommus 11th Mar 2014 12:27

Even at 500 mph there would still be parts (whatever hit the water last) big enough to float or be seen from the air.

Not to mention a huge fuel slick

Stanley11 11th Mar 2014 12:30

Let me try this again...

Regardless of what made the aircraft change its course and profile...

The discrepancy between the transponder track and radar track could simply be the radar operator falling asleep or took an extended smoke break just as MH370 turned back. When questioned, he simply said that there were no abnormalities and the report went upwards. The truth only came out when the tapes were reviewed and now the top brass have to face the public for the delay of vital information. I do tend to offer a generous amount of professional courtesy to the top dogs but sometimes they are placed in positions that are caused by operators way below the food chain.

Let's hope that this new piece of information will lead to finding the aircraft.

ASY68 11th Mar 2014 12:31

MH370: Did authorities visit crash site today (Tuesday) | Plane Talking

Stuffy 11th Mar 2014 12:35

Unverified, but.......


China Times reports that "the U.S. Embassy said the 2:43 U.S. military bases stationed in Thailand U-Tapao SOS signal was listening to some of Malaysia Airlines Flight MH370 emergency call, said the aircraft cabin facing disintegration driver call, t

rachcollins 11th Mar 2014 12:35

US Department of Defense funded Indonesian Maritime Surveillance System
 
Given that the US Department of Defense funded Indonesia’s Integrated Maritime Surveillance System, you would hope that they would be aware of it's detection capabilities in the Malacca Strait.

US Embassy Fact Sheet

"U.S. DEPARTMENT OF STATE
Office of the Spokesperson
November 18, 2011
2011/1967
FACT SHEET

DoD-funded Integrated Maritime Surveillance System

From FY2006 to FY2008 the U.S. Government provided approximately $57 million via the National Defense Authorization Act Section 1206 to support Indonesia’s establishment of an Integrated Maritime Surveillance System (IMSS) strategically located to cover Malacca Strait, Sulawesi Sea, and Moluccas Strait.


Read more: http://iipdigital.usembassy.gov/st/e...#ixzz2vepwcOE9


I believe that the US currently has at least one P-3C searching in that area.

If anything was identified by that system you'd hope that the Americans and Indonesians would be much more forthcoming with information.

It's an extremely strange scenario though, the evidence seems to suggest that MH370's transponder was not operating, and no radio contact has been reported since the aircraft disappeared on route to IGARI.

Even if those systems were somehow rendered inoperable it would still have been possible to make contact with the ground via cellphone while overflying the island, the seemingly complete lack of contact from the aircraft baffles me the most :confused:

Ian W 11th Mar 2014 12:39


Originally Posted by Che Xindamail (Post 8366263)
The complete lack of traces, debris or witnesses can only mean one thing, hijacking. Turn off the transponder, pull the ACARS cb's, and you are invisible to all but military primary radar. Descend low and not even they will see you. You are now in a fully functioning aircraft with astounding navigational capability, but invisible to the world. Where do you want to go?

The search area should be a seven hour fuel endurance radius of last known position. Since no ELT has gone off means it didn't crash, it landed. Remote airfields in China? Indonesia? Philippines? It means you must know how to navigate and land a 777. How many pilots in the world have undergone 777 training? Even just simulator training would suffice. 5000?

Looking forward to your thoughts.

I hate to disrupt the trusting faith that "ELT's go off in a crash" but they invariably don't. Indeed there was a discussion on here after the Ethiopian 787 fire at Heathrow on their usefulness at all. I have been involved in numerous incidents where they have gone off inadvertently. I would be interested if anyone can report the case of a crash where an ELT signal was useful. I have been involved in cases where military SARBEs worked as advertised but not ELTs.

nupogodi 11th Mar 2014 12:45


Originally Posted by mommus (Post 8366528)
Not to mention a huge fuel slick

Correct me if I'm wrong, but considering the temperatures of the water and ocean currents in the region and the properties of Jet-A, would any fuel slick not have dispersed and evaporated by this point?

konstantin 11th Mar 2014 12:49

I haven`t read every page on this thread (dear lord!) but just wondering - whether six hours of Jindalee records are being (have been?) very closely examined.

BTW, in relation to the capability (and recalcitrance) of certain organisations - "neither confirm nor deny" type stuff...and before continuing, google "VH-SKC"...

There was no assistance forthcoming from a supposed "ally" unit in central Oz.
[As a counterpoint to that, an Emirates flight a couple of hours out of Sydney, listening to the A/G exchanges, with several hundred miles to run to crossing point, piped up with "Centre, we`ve been doing some sums and we think we`ll come close to seeing that aircraft". And they did.]

A year later I walk in for a morning shift, the doggo dude tells me that not very long after the 9/11 news broke that very same unit called Melbourne Centre and demanded the assigned SSR codes and flight details of all aircraft intending to pass within a certain distance of YBXX.

Ain`t nuthin to see here, move along, y`all...

mixture 11th Mar 2014 12:51


Oh dear.... you evidently don't realise DigitalGlobe, which owns Tomnod, retasked two of its 5 satellites to photograph the area on Sunday.
To be honest I didn't click on the link, Tomnod is a silly name and sounded like someone's personal website !

I'd still wonder about whether any useful information will come of it... people with no SAR experience will simply be tagging general rubbish that can be found floating around the worlds waters..... all Tomnod will likely end up with is a database of false positives.

In all honesty, I think its more of a PR marketing exercise for DigitalGlobe than anything useful.


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