+1

Instead of suggesting how the situation was handled was somehow 'wrong', perhaps those criticizing could suggest an alternative that would have been better. Clearly most of those on board were innocent and had a 'right' to continue their flight within a reasonable time frame. Personally the only thing I can think of would have been to have a double roster of cabin crew / security guards sent down to man the toilets and check after each person used it. Any other reasonable suggestions?

According to The Australian newspaper, "lighters and matches were confiscated in Jakarta before passengers were let back on the flight" Presumably the aircraft was also searched for lighters and matches.

Given the disruption routinely caused by minor security breaches (Melbourne Airport's spokeswoman's phrase in this particular case today, not mine) at airports with no evidence at all of any malicious intent, it seems quite extraordinary that in the face of clear evidence that an actual arsonist intent on setting fire to the aircraft was amongst the passengers, the flight continued with the culprit(s) aboard.

I don't have the answers; there was little else they could do but continue on, since they were unable to identify the culprit(s), but this seems to fly in the face of the efforts made to rectify airport security breaches on the ground and the level of resultant disruption considered acceptable.

Seriously, it's OK to strand thousands for a few hours because someone turned their back on a door for 30 seconds, but it's not OK to strand several hundred people when you KNOW one of them has already made several attempts to set fire to a long haul aircraft which is about to fly hours from land, because you don't know which one it was? After all, at the end of the day, its clever people with a death wish that bring down planes, not nail clippers or bottled water.

It always surprised my that you can't bring a yoghurt or toothpaste on board an airplane now, and yet matches and lighters are fine

@Teach me : double roster of crew? The crew from the other EY flt in CGK?Safety guards? Where do you find them? Do you know they have to be rated, trained, approved to fly on an aircraft? 2 months?
I don't know the solution but as Nonsense said : you find it OK to fly with the pyroman just because you haven't found him?:ugh::ugh:
So YES, as myself a long-haul captain, I'm criticizing the decision to take-off again from CGK in these conditions. Find him or find a solution but do not go with such a risk unsolved!

Serious nonsense. After the police have done all they're willing to do, what is the captain to do? Questioning their authority or competence is not unlikely to create negative consequence for the captain himself.

Were the pax further questioned at their destination?

So FBW390..... Just how many days/weeks would you holiday in CGK hoping that the culprit would give up and cough....

And if they never did? You'd retire there?

Any thoughts that this person wasn't a crazy fire bug but was conducting a dry run for a new terrorist attack?

Sure, they confiscated matches and lighters from pax on subsequent legs of this flight. But the telling piece if information will be the authorities willingness to prohibit such material on all flights in the future. Even if this was just a nut job, the bad guys are most certainly watching this.

Time to be serious
 

If we were serious about flight safety, then years ago we would have banned the carriage of cigarettes, cigars etc AND the matches and lighters that accompany them. We would also have banned all flamable liquids from the cabin, & that includes all alcoholic drinks and perfumes and anything you can't prove is just water.
There should be random searches for such items and HUGE penalties (prison) for being caught.
I know it would upset the owners of the shopping malls that we all fly from, but are we serious about safety or do we only care about the retail industry and "security" job-creation industry??

Jaytee54
 

A total overreaction I think, the whole industry is not going to change in response to the stupid acts of one individual.

So goeasy, you take off and it burns...It nearly happened! If you have the good, safe and legal solution , please tell me.

Eengr, You have almost read my mind in your last posting.

What I was, and am about to say/ask is: What will the new security measures entail now? Confiscation of lighters, matches and cigarettes before boarding?

That has happened to me at one or two African airports. One security officer even confiscated all my spare camera batteries. The irony of it was, he let me keep the batteries that were in the camera. That really had me muttering a bunch of words stringed together in long sentences that I dare not repeat here.

Has that happened to anybody in any of the european ir US airports?

Like Richard Reid?

… or Ibrahim Savant, Arafat Khan and Waheed Zaman ?

(OK, that's three)

Jaytee

All airports with services to the U.S. Have the beverages, food items etc screened before being allowed passed security. U.S. Officials check this regularly (not sure how). There was a big kerfuffle in Dublin a few years ago when one of these random inspections found the checks being done were not of the required standard.

FBW390
 

You are missing my point.

It is unfair to criticise a fellow colleague, without having your own explanation, of what YOU would have done to identify the perpetrator, or ensure 100% safety to continue the flight.

We all operate in an environment of compromise between sensible practicable safety measures, and completing the operation we are employed for.

Can you please explain what you would have done in this situation, without a confession from the guilty?

OK goeasy here we go -

As Captain, (without a confession from the numpty perpetrator):

1. Everyone off in Jakarta
2. Thorough security inspection of entire aircraft
3. All hand baggage, handbags, laptop bags, coats into the hold (or you're refused boarding)
4. Pat down of every passenger in the air bridge for lighters and matches, that include burkhas and tea towels
5. One crew member guarding every pair of toilets for remainder of flight

ONLY then, blast off for Abu Dhabi. (If you're not out of hours by then)

Anything less than that stinks of 'the unmentionable airline' interfering with the Captain's authority.

Goeasy:
Flying Clog has been faster than me! Very good answer!:ok:

Could a captain arrange 1-5 to a level that instills sufficient confidence for him/her to continue the journey?

There was always the option not to continue the journey any further.

Some bright spark in management might make that a standard for all flights!

Ok... I can understand some of those checks helping. Most of which were done, as far as media reported.

Though the flight would probably still be there now, whilst the arguments about surrendering hand baggage/valuables raged on...

And fully agree with banning all cigs matches/lighters on all flights. And make smokers travel naked, because their clothes stink too!

And even if the flight was cancelled, or discontinued, the perpetrators would just hop on the next flight, whatever the airline.... hopefully yours FBW, so you could cancel it, and go back to hotel for a beer!

Cheers :ok: :}