Delta 777 vs Jetty at LGW today..
 

Understand a Delta 777 took out the jetty on stand 50M this morning....fair bit of damage to the No1 engine apparently.

Don't like to speculate, but...Is this another case of not realising the stand guidance and stop marker boards are seperate? I believe it's not the first time it has happened at LGW.

Secondly - given the AAIB recommendations in the recent report about a 747 vs a jetty at LHR - the emergency stop button issue seems to be relevant here too??:uhoh:

I dont mind 35kt crosswinds, cat 3 approaches etc, my biggest fear is doing a good job and then crackin a wing off a jet way. I am paranoid coming into stand....my F/O's think what the f is up with this guy....with good reason on my behalf!

Bearcat,

The most dangerous time to operate an airplane is from the time the main gear touches the ground until the main gear leaves the ground again.

Your concerns are very well founded.

Hmmm, a good question; if the dispatcher meeting the flight was on the Jetway; they could and should have activated the STOP button. Which would have alerted the Flt Deck by means of Bright Flashing Stop signs that can't be missed.

However, sometimes the Dispatcher does not arrive until the aircraft is already on stand if things are busy!

Mind you, the view from the Jetway is not that good; indeed the Stop Button and Jetway controls are on the terminal side of the Jetway so, the view is quite limited until it gets noisy!

Apparently the Jetway had to be lifted off the aircraft by a crane and is now U/S.:ugh:

I had a similar incident the other year with an American operator at LGW - apparently some crew who haven't operated to LGW before expect the red 'STOP' sign to come on when they are correctly parked. In my incident an accident was only averted by the quick response of the ground engineer pushing the emergency tit by the guidance controls.

Pity the authorities cannot get together and come up with ome international standard for positioning lights on aprons.

just another example of how we in the UK are more interested in selling crap in the terminal than investing in the infastructure of the airports.
These type of docking stands are a national disgrace and airport owners / managers should be ashamed of themselves, they should all get out to ehhhhh, turkey to see how the latest systems work.

:mad:

Quite like the ones in Dubai, foolproof........famous last words!! :}

This assumes the British Shopping Authority bothered to install a STOP button in the Jetty.... as the B744 v Stand 127 at LHR showed, they didn't in that case... or rather had a program to install them that ran over the next X years (X being a large number).

Even after the accident at LHR, when the AAIB went back to see the "professional" modification BAA / HAL had made, they found a random button installed, confusion over which button did what, and the sign for the button "propped up" on the button - not even installed.

The AAIB report makes sorry reading, especially if you were the (presumably now ex-) Safety manager for HAL :(

At LHR there is an emergency stop button next to the AGNIS lights at the head of every stand. My previous company made us wait there until the aircraft was safely on stand.

AGNIS - PAPA
 

Why oh why are they still using this system?

So far UK and Australia are the only places (in my company's vast network) that uses it. Surely Airlines would insist on the upgraded systems...cost of incidences (agnis-papa) on a global incident survey would be high.

Bearcat, I'm with you here.

Factors other than poor design can cause problems when docking. I was blinded several times by the late afternoon sun sitting slap bang behind the guidance system when taxying on to the LH stand a LAX.

Anybody got pictures yet?

Quickie
I think you meant 'instances', not 'incidences'? Sorry, couldn't help myself.

Blinded by the sun
 

brakedwell:

A properly designed system should take into account such contingencies. Thus, this IS a design problem.

Many ground staff and some pilots think its ok for an aircraft to arrive on a stand with objects inside the box.

The lines were painted for a good reason, if items inside the box, stop the aircraft, I find items get moved quick, even quicker if aircraft blocking a taxi-way.???

Joetom I am with you there.

I am also suprised at the number of pilots who jsut drive onto the stand wether there are lights on or not.

There are some stands at LHR with new style guidance systems that count down the distance for the pilots and then display 'STOP' when the aircraft has reached the appropriate mark.

There is a new landing system for VTOLs or helos landing on ships that uses GPS and some very complicated maths. Just push a red button and the aircraft will land itself on a pitching and rolling ship.

You'd think that for all the time aircraft have been pulling up to gates that a foolproof method for stopping, not dependant on human beings other than the pilot stepping on the brakes, would have been developed.

Well I saw the damage myself on Friday morning as I was being bussed to my aircraft! Two cranes had been brought in to life the airbridge away from the engine by the looks of things!!!
Something similiar happened to me a number of years ago when I was driving an airbridge in DUB and an Aer Lingus A330 came right for me!!!

Stand Guidance
 

Please Guys read your Jepp plates it state very clearly in the procedures. Unlesless C/o decided to hand over to F/o in which case distance might could expain. Dare I say it.

Why do we always have to have high tech range finders;AGNIS lights which can't,for some reason,be left switched on all the time and are therefore dependant on the dispatcher's arrival;or two markers that are suposed to be read simultaneously even though they are miles apart etc....The whole mess is the result of design by committee meeting in bright neon lit rooms.
How about a low tech system..useful to the pilot for much more than just coming onto stand... something that would let you could see the centre line..see what's around the plane for efficient push backs ..see the cargo doors closing..see the engines are clear/still there/on fire etc..get a feel for the traffic behind you.WHY DON'T WE HAVE A CONVEX MIRROR nailed to the terminal.
'Corse you'd have to have someone with an oily rag to give them a wipe over every now and again.(but the committee would probably have a fan blowing a piece of old towelling a la the truckie's mirrors...then the fan would not be left switched on all the time,or the towelling would break off and be ingested as FOD..no forget I mentioned it..AGNIS is wonderful!)