727 stolen from Angola
Join Date: Mar 2000
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This type of setup is certainly not new to aviation.
Good friend of mine years ago outfitted two DC-6's with extra cabin tanks (2000 gallons) , for a south pole series of flights.
The extra fuel was used to re-supply ground tanks, and in addition was plumbed to feed the engines enroute.
This all worked fine until one day the bonehead pilot, who insisted to keep the mixtures in autolean during approach/landing (ISO autorich, as the checklist mentioned), wanted to overshoot, cobbed the throttles, found no power available, and crashed.
Everyone walked away, but the aeroplane was a total loss.
Moral to the story...listen to the Flight Engineer.
Good friend of mine years ago outfitted two DC-6's with extra cabin tanks (2000 gallons) , for a south pole series of flights.
The extra fuel was used to re-supply ground tanks, and in addition was plumbed to feed the engines enroute.
This all worked fine until one day the bonehead pilot, who insisted to keep the mixtures in autolean during approach/landing (ISO autorich, as the checklist mentioned), wanted to overshoot, cobbed the throttles, found no power available, and crashed.
Everyone walked away, but the aeroplane was a total loss.
Moral to the story...listen to the Flight Engineer.
Join Date: Jun 2001
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My understanding
411A--My understanding of that crash is that they were low on fuel. That's why the mixtures were left leaned out.
I'm not defending the action but there's a little more to the story (as usual). Anyone who's flown over remote terrain or transoceanic knows how unforgiving a simple mistake can be.
And, yes, the FE should be listened to.
Fly safe.
I'm not defending the action but there's a little more to the story (as usual). Anyone who's flown over remote terrain or transoceanic knows how unforgiving a simple mistake can be.
And, yes, the FE should be listened to.
Fly safe.
Join Date: Dec 1998
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Stolen 727's internal tankage installation
This is the photo of that stolen 727's internal tankage setup (allegedly 6000 US gallons) - not sure if it is usable for range extension - or just A to B tankerage.
IMHO that aircraft is still a terrorist threat until such time as its fate is credibly determined - and proof positive of any claims being ascertained. Disinformation is still a useful terrorist tool.
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Thanks to Fesmokie for providing it. Faces are blanked out due to provider's request.
IMHO that aircraft is still a terrorist threat until such time as its fate is credibly determined - and proof positive of any claims being ascertained. Disinformation is still a useful terrorist tool.
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Thanks to Fesmokie for providing it. Faces are blanked out due to provider's request.
Join Date: Jul 2002
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I can assure you that this tank setup was not used for range extension for the aircraft. Loading and unloading of the fuel was performed from a connect point at the aft end using a single hose to the ground and to a gas powered pump. All the tanks had shutoff valves and were connected to a common manifold to the aft of the aircraft.
Do a Hover - it avoids G
Join Date: Oct 1999
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Nerik
Assessing whether you are on a collision course with another aircraft is remarkably simple. The other aircraft will not move in your transparency. It just grows bigger. This applies regardless of the aspect.
So, if you look (say) 85 deg left and happen to see another aircraft at about your height and on a similar heading, place a chinagraph spot over the other aircraft and if it stays behind the spot you made you WILL hit it in due course unless one of you changes something.
This is a very useful thing to appreciate.
It is also why some guys make better fighter pilots than others - they find it easier to set up such a situation deliberately.
Assessing whether you are on a collision course with another aircraft is remarkably simple. The other aircraft will not move in your transparency. It just grows bigger. This applies regardless of the aspect.
So, if you look (say) 85 deg left and happen to see another aircraft at about your height and on a similar heading, place a chinagraph spot over the other aircraft and if it stays behind the spot you made you WILL hit it in due course unless one of you changes something.
This is a very useful thing to appreciate.
It is also why some guys make better fighter pilots than others - they find it easier to set up such a situation deliberately.
Join Date: Sep 2000
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Hmmm?
If you can't hijack a 767 full of fuel, why not fly a smaller, less obvious plane laden with extra fuel tanks --on a legitimate flight plan.
This plane needs to be found -and quickly.
PT
If you can't hijack a 767 full of fuel, why not fly a smaller, less obvious plane laden with extra fuel tanks --on a legitimate flight plan.
This plane needs to be found -and quickly.
PT
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Oversight
Unless this aircraft is being flown unpressurised, which is structurally inadvisable for the 727, there would be considerable engineering problems in using these tanks for range extension. They are in the cabin and the aircraft fuel system is outside.
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Considerable engineering problem? Actually it is quite easy. Ferry fuel systems on pressurized aircraft rarely need fuel transfer pumps. The pressure differential is used to move the fuel. "T" into existing lines and simply open the valve when you are ready for transfer
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So with that senerio, how far could that aircraft fly with the additional 6000 US gallons of fuel?
I wish that aircraft and the people on board would be found...
LPJ
I wish that aircraft and the people on board would be found...
LPJ
Last edited by littlepuddlejumper; 27th Sep 2003 at 08:15.
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Explore these links, and look for a common link. Is the seller a convicted bogus aircraft parts dealer ? It seems that this story is rotten to the core? http://www.landings.com/evird.acgi?p...number=N844AA+ http://77.aviatorsale.com/aix708 http://www.businessweek.com/1996/24/b34791.htm
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littlepuddlejumper,
The extra fuel effectively doubles the range of the 727. I don't think you will see them try to jump across the pond from Africa and fly a completely empty airplane into anything. Any 727 flying across the pond probably ends up with a fighter inspection these days anyway. More likely they would try for a high speed jump across the Mediteranean and make a stab at Buckingham Palace.
I wish they would find it too.
The extra fuel effectively doubles the range of the 727. I don't think you will see them try to jump across the pond from Africa and fly a completely empty airplane into anything. Any 727 flying across the pond probably ends up with a fighter inspection these days anyway. More likely they would try for a high speed jump across the Mediteranean and make a stab at Buckingham Palace.
I wish they would find it too.
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Most 727s are flown domestically in the USA with some flying in from the South and north. Only Private 727s with long range tanks fly the pond. Pretty easy to check that few out. The EU has 727s coming from all directions, especially Africa. Not hard to copy Air Algerie paint scheme and make it look like your going to Heathrow.
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OK, so how disruptive to the few existing operators would it be to ban all 727s from existing UK airspace - at least without the most exhaustive pre-flight planning and authorisations...?
And I realize that it may set a dangerous precedent once a country starts banning an aircraft type....
And I realize that it may set a dangerous precedent once a country starts banning an aircraft type....
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Not so sure that is doable. Besides, they would then just steal a transponder from a similiar size aircraft(ie. 757) that is in for maintenance and fly as that airplane.