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Just How Badly Can You Treat Passengers - And Get Away With It?

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Just How Badly Can You Treat Passengers - And Get Away With It?

Old 19th Sep 2023, 02:01
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Seat cushions, covers and belts.

Several airlines I have worked for as a Licensed Aircraft Engineer have carried spare covers and belts. But 1 I can think of never even had sick bags on the aircraft, even after speaking with the Senior Airline Hostess, nothing changed, eventually they where looking at putting a few sick bags in the toilets, I remarked do you think someone is going to que for one, eventually they put one bag in each left hand Aisle row seat, regularly there was mess over the walls and carpets. But still no fresh covers. Ended up cabin crew and mechanics moving cushions around the fleet, causing other issues as the aircraft where built with differing airlines seats, cushions and covers. Meaning unrecorded seats with no cushion.

Last edited by allthatglitters; 19th Sep 2023 at 02:03. Reason: Typo
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Old 19th Sep 2023, 09:02
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To me, the biggest spit-in-your-face declaration is random seating of tickets bought together. That's going out of your way to purposely screw your consumers.
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Old 19th Sep 2023, 09:14
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Originally Posted by Private jet
Too many airline pax want "Champagne service" in return for "Lemonade money". Maybe they should pay more, & get more. It's simple stuff.
Remember that nobody forces anyone to fly anywhere, it's not like food, or oxygen, it's not essential to life. Aviation is a discretionary product. The industry might well do better, for both users and those that make their living from it, if the industry contracted.
That comment might make sense, in general, if the pax in question had booked their tickets on a ULCC, rather than a full-service legacy carrier. Air Canada arent exactly charging "lemonade money". Regardless, it doesnt matter if the customer pays $60 or $600, its never acceptable to force them to sit in vomit or be placed on a "no-fly list"...
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Old 19th Sep 2023, 09:44
  #44 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by robocoder
To me, the biggest spit-in-your-face declaration is random seating of tickets bought together. That's going out of your way to purposely screw your consumers.
It's so they can make families pay extra to sit together. Disgraceful.

The solution is that when the CC realise that they need to swap pax around so children can sit with parents, smile sweetly and refuse. I know that goes against common decency and is very difficult to do in practice but as long as pax solve the problem, the practice will continue.
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Old 19th Sep 2023, 11:22
  #45 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Out Of Trim
Air Canada Engineering staff or their agents would normally hold a stock of spare seat covers, belts and cushions for this very purpose. When the crew get on board their first task is to complete a security check at every sear row which would include checking the cleanliness etc. Normally cleaners would be recalled and engineers called to fix any cabin defects before boarding is commenced. Obviously, the checks were not carried out properly leading to an embarrassing incident. Then this was further mishandled by their staff.

Did they really expect their passengers to sit in wet vomit 🤮 and not protest about it!
As an engineer, we are frequently called for precisely this situation. It is possible that Air Canada did not to have spare seat cushions, covers or seat belts at the specific airport, and the airline I work for carries additional waterproof emergency covers that go over everything for this eventuality.


If this was not a base Air Canada regularly fly to and there were no engineers available to changes seat cushions, covers and belts, and there were no emergency waterproof over covers on board then this is clearly Air Canadas problem and threatening passengers is really poor behaviour from the captain
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Old 19th Sep 2023, 15:56
  #46 (permalink)  
 
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Originally Posted by Private jet
Too many airline pax want "Champagne service" in return for "Lemonade money". Maybe they should pay more, & get more. It's simple stuff.
Remember that nobody forces anyone to fly anywhere, it's not like food, or oxygen, it's not essential to life. Aviation is a discretionary product. The industry might well do better, for both users and those that make their living from it, if the industry contracted.
Good lord, expecting your seats to be reasonably clean is hardly "champagne service"!
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Old 19th Sep 2023, 16:19
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Originally Posted by B Fraser
The solution is that when the CC realise that they need to swap pax around so children can sit with parents, smile sweetly and refuse. I know that goes against common decency and is very difficult to do in practice but as long as pax solve the problem, the practice will continue.
I think you'll find that airline terms allow them to move your seat, and on that basis, refusing a request from CC to switch seat will likely have you moved off the plane.

Originally Posted by Private jet
Too many airline pax want "Champagne service" in return for "Lemonade money". Maybe they should pay more, & get more. It's simple stuff.
Where I live there's a choice between low fare service or low fare service. I'd love to pay more and get more, but the product isn't available.

Besides, I'd expect lemonade service to include the right not to sit in a vomit-covered seat.
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Old 19th Sep 2023, 19:02
  #48 (permalink)  
 
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Much of modern passenger travel in aircraft reminds me of the Monty Python sketch where one could get a session of Argument or Abuse. Of course Argument gets one put on a list that allows access to neither. Just as in the sketch, the staff are polite, but the product is the product.
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Old 21st Sep 2023, 01:43
  #49 (permalink)  
 
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Look away now, a good news story via Avweb

When young Broadway actress Mikayla Renfrow’s Delta Air Lines flight to New York from Europe was delayed, the casting director of Aladdin texted her not to worry. They’d find someone else to fill her spot in the ensemble for that night. But four hours into the flight, she got another text. Renfrow is also the understudy for actress Sonja Bolsara in the lead role of Jasmine, and Bolsara had taken ill. Could Renfrow get to the theater on time for the 7 p.m. curtain? The flight’s ETA at JFK was 5 pm.

Renfrow explained the situation to a flight attendant (so far, only identified as “Leisha”), desperately hoping for a seat nearer the front of the plane for a hasty exit. What she got was a lot more than that.

When Leisha notified the flight crew of the situation, the pilots first arranged for a gate closer to Customs, then asked if Renfrow was aware of Blade’s helicopter service from JFK to Manhattan. “I’m a normal person,” she told Playbill magazine. “I have no idea what that is. I was shocked that they cared.” The Delta crew booked her for the seven-minute ride to Manhattan—price $175, which the Aladdin casting director gladly paid. Perhaps the bargain of a lifetime for the Broadway hopeful.

For the rest of the flight, Renfrow tried to relax and rest up for her opportunity. The captain came back for a visit, cheering her on with her adventure. After landing (one can likely assume there was some throttle-bending and negotiations with ATC from the seats up front), Delta staff members whisked the young actress through Customs and into a car to take her to her Blade flight. Just like in … a Broadway show, she arrived at the stage door of the New Amsterdam Theater 30 minutes before curtain, not a minute to spare for getting into costume and makeup.

After the drama just to get her there, performing on stage might have felt like an anticlimax. But Renfrow told Playbill, “There were a lot of moments during that show where I was [thinking], ‘I’m going to open my mouth and hope the right thing comes out.”

After the final curtain, she was surprised to see Leisha, still in uniform, waiting to congratulate her on her performance. The theater had comped her a ticket. “It was just special moment after special moment after special moment,” Renfrow said.
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Old 21st Sep 2023, 14:28
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Originally Posted by Magplug
Now in this case time was not limited as, being the land of the free, the crew would have to clear immigration before getting back on exactly the same aircraft to go back to base. (I never understood why a turnround crew is not allowed to remain on the aircraft in the US like any other country.)
On that point, when going to the USA from major a Canadian airport (Montreal, Toronto Pearson, Vancouver, etc...), you actually clear immigration at the departure airport, so the crew would not have had to deal with customs in Vegas in that case. You get off the plane and it is exactly the same as if you had come off an American domestic flight, walk straight to baggage collection or out of the terminal.
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Old 22nd Sep 2023, 00:45
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Earlier this month, a Singapore Airlines flight had passengers stuck on their plane for 8 hours at Shanghai (with no Aircon) before the flight was cancelled and they could eventually disembark
https://www.channelnewsasia.com/sing...-plane-3753721

Last edited by daelight; 22nd Sep 2023 at 00:45. Reason: Shanghai
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Old 23rd Sep 2023, 08:58
  #52 (permalink)  
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Originally Posted by RdKetchup
On that point, when going to the USA from major a Canadian airport (Montreal, Toronto Pearson, Vancouver, etc...), you actually clear immigration at the departure airport, so the crew would not have had to deal with customs in Vegas in that case. You get off the plane and it is exactly the same as if you had come off an American domestic flight, walk straight to baggage collection or out of the terminal.
Admittedly pre COVID.... Several times in the crew line at passport control in LAS a Canadian crew of 5 or 6 would arrive behind my 747 crew from London. The skipper asked nicely if they could skip in front of us as they had to turnaround to go home. I asked how long they had been on duty? My reserves of sympathy are pretty exhaused at the end of a 13 hour duty. He saw my point and returned to his place in the queue.

Why was it that CBP agents in LAS were the most miserable in the USA?
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Old 24th Sep 2023, 00:48
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Originally Posted by Magplug
Why was it that CBP agents in LAS were the most miserable in the USA?
Perhaps they fed off the attitudes around them.
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Old 24th Sep 2023, 18:05
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Originally Posted by Noxegon
I think you'll find that airline terms allow them to move your seat, and on that basis, refusing a request from CC to switch seat will likely have you moved off the plane.



Where I live there's a choice between low fare service or low fare service. I'd love to pay more and get more, but the product isn't available.

Besides, I'd expect lemonade service to include the right not to sit in a vomit-covered seat.
Re moving seats: What is the “need”? The pax could have selected or paid to sit together.

11 hour flight…I had booked, 8 weeks before, an aisle exit row seat as I am 6 foot + tall and have neck and back issues.
They asked me to change to a centre seat in the centre row of the 747 to supposedly allow a father to sit next to his teen age daughter.
I refused and politely explained why. I suggested that the father change centre seats with his daughter and she could sit with her mother and brother. I thought the father just wanted an aisle seat but did not say so.

The flight attendant agreed with my refusal. Case closed.
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Old 25th Sep 2023, 00:56
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Forwarded to me with the question "should I bring hazmat gear?..."

---

Sept 7 23

"Wouldn't be surprised at all if this were true. A few months ago, a gate agent approached me to say that the previous passenger in my (paid) J seat had vomited on it, but the groomers, in her opinion, had done a great job cleaning up. She had inspected it herself. However, if I were unhappy with the prospect, there was a seat in economy waiting for me.


I went to my seat. There was vomit on it, on my neighbor's seat, on the armrest divider, on the seat in front of me, and the floor. One of the flight attendants gave me and my neighbor some wet wipes to improve on the "great job" done by the groomers.

I sent a note to AC and they did respond with the "we are concerned" template, but I doubt they've made any efforts to improve their procedures."

https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/air-...it-them-5.html



Sept 24

"AC 8192 - more vomit on plane

Some poor guy just ran down the aisle before take off with his hand over his mouth, and spray vomited between his fingers over all of us in rows 12/13.

Mostly liquid for the upside, but not good…"


"We all got given disinfecting hand wipes by the FA, we wiped ourselves (and my case my iPad) and parts of the plane down before it dripped from the overhead bins. Groomers were called, they milled around, one guy got changed in the washrooms.


SD didn’t even talk to us…."

https://www.flyertalk.com/forum/air-...mit-plane.html
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