Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Flight Deck Forums > Rumours & News
Reload this Page >

Pilot loads baggage

Rumours & News Reporting Points that may affect our jobs or lives as professional pilots. Also, items that may be of interest to professional pilots.

Pilot loads baggage

Old 2nd Jun 2022, 08:10
  #41 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 231
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
because most of us aren't made of match sticks.
Spunky Monkey is offline  
Old 2nd Jun 2022, 08:58
  #42 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: A place in the sun
Age: 81
Posts: 1,162
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
stilton, When visiting Tripoli at the start of the Six Day War when the Algerian air force was ferrying fighter aircraft through there to help the Egyptians. The authorities refused us permission to unload and load the holds, and surrounded us with armed soldiers to stop us. Eventually we managed to persuade them to let us go and we threw everything from the holds of our VC10 out onto the tarmac, loaded the bags of the uncoming pax, started up and got the hell out of the place before they changed their minds. It was a case of all hands to the pumps!
Bergerie1 is offline  
Old 2nd Jun 2022, 09:47
  #43 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Oz
Posts: 1,524
Received 22 Likes on 9 Posts
I have seen CEO's do this, as well as serving drinks/cart run etc. But ONLY if a camera is around.
PoppaJo is online now  
Old 2nd Jun 2022, 10:27
  #44 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2018
Location: Ferrara
Posts: 5,493
Received 31 Likes on 17 Posts
"Before that all new Ryanair chiefs had to do a stint in ground ops to get a feel for the airline."

Years ago I shared an office with a guy who'd worked at Mars i Slough as a student.

he said Ol Mr Mars quite commonly turned up from the USA without warning and could be found operating some new or recalcitrant bit of machinery on the production line to "find out just how it's going"

And of course the guy who founded IKEA who used to book his own hotels as he could find the cheapest ones to stay in close to the office - Travlelodge or Premier Inn in the UK were his favourites
Asturias56 is offline  
Old 2nd Jun 2022, 11:57
  #45 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Spain
Posts: 13
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Bad idea

In my opinion he should never do so.

Aviation itís not what it used to be anymore because of these things.

There will be no better time to push for a better working conditions and salary, itís now when everybody struggled when we have a chance.

Everybody has his role, a pilot is there to fly the aircraft and to ensure the flight goes safely. If there is a lack of ground staff which triggers delays and caos itís the solely responsibility of the airlines for not paying enough to the ground handling services or for not having their own staff under a permanent contract.

EU261 seems to be the only way airlines step aside of the peanuts contracts, donít help them for the sake of a facebook post or a goodwill from a manager.

Holidays and air travel is a LUXURY, not a right in any country constitution (may be the British will consider so butÖ) so if someone wants to travel in an airplane, the price should be in accordance with occidental working conditions and not slavery, therefore if there is no staff, itís due to the industry not being attractive and low attrition.

Anytime this happens, take a breath, make coffee, refuse to work on discretion and report it.

I am shock to see how the pilots will humiliate themselves to be in a piece of metal tube for peanuts.
Stabmotion is offline  
Old 2nd Jun 2022, 14:48
  #46 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: uk
Posts: 731
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Many years ago I was co-pilot of a flt divertrd from Luton to Heathrow. The ramp agent informed us that with a lot of diversions it would be hours before the bags would be unloaded. Captain turned to me and said "We could make a start, are you game for it?" Before I could say anything, the rampie said "If you touch a bag, the baggage handler's union will black the aircraft, and it will be here for a week.". We headed for our taxi back to base.
Years later I was a captain with Ryanair during the handler's strike, and as Viking said, saw M O'L loading bags with half the office staff of Ryanair.
oxenos is offline  
Old 2nd Jun 2022, 16:34
  #47 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2018
Location: Anvya
Posts: 73
Likes: 0
Received 5 Likes on 3 Posts
6 years in GA unloading and loading was the job , flying was the easy bit . Regionals and the loader was the life of the party so we helped him after last sector so we all got to the bar earlier . Airline level is full of politics but Iíll pickup up bag thatís fallen off a trolley or loader and hand it to someone . If I had to load the belly of a NB Iíd do it and if I got injured it be twisting in a seat or retrieving my nav bag a few minutes after the last bag was loaded .

Iíd never cross a line though .
KAPAC is online now  
Old 2nd Jun 2022, 17:54
  #48 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Location: in the sky
Posts: 118
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by pilot-737 View Post
Maybe if you are on biz jet you don’t realize the airline ops implications:
........
It’s different to load 5 bags on a Biz Jet and completely different story to load a 737 or 320.......
I take it then you have never operated on a BBJ or ACJ? Such things are pretty common place. Although for 19 pax or so, but you would be surprised what some Oligarch or Saudi Prince/Princess can pack and expect to have in the hold/cabin .
Also cleaning the aircraft and stocking it as well, although that normally is the domain of the Cabin Crew.

Having said that, in an airline...maybe not, but good on him for doing it.

Last edited by Brian Pern; 2nd Jun 2022 at 18:04.
Brian Pern is offline  
Old 2nd Jun 2022, 18:23
  #49 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Centre of Universe
Posts: 346
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by ericferret View Post
https://www.msn.com/en-gb/lifestyle/...out&li=AAnZ9Ug

Had to say this makes me smile.
At Liverpool some time back I was walking back up the ramp with a colleague.
We came across a Ryan Air pilot loading his own aircraft.
"Need a hand there captain said my mate"

Cue the unusual sight of a Ryan Air 737 being loaded by the captain and two Easyjet engineers.
Of such things memories are made..
UK Charter Airline 1980 something. Handling strike at CFU. 4 of us got sent down to load Company 737. Had a little too much ouzo night before.
Got a call in the Hotel 'where are you' oops all 4 slept in. Now way we could go without bfast so even later. Day went well until some German outfit (LTU?) sent in a A310
and we got asked to offload, No chance as we couldn't even reach the doors


Twiglet1 is offline  
Old 2nd Jun 2022, 19:52
  #50 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: England
Posts: 1,408
Likes: 0
Received 9 Likes on 6 Posts
Originally Posted by Stabmotion View Post
In my opinion he should never do so.

Aviation itís not what it used to be anymore because of these things.

There will be no better time to push for a better working conditions and salary, itís now when everybody struggled when we have a chance.

Everybody has his role, a pilot is there to fly the aircraft and to ensure the flight goes safely. If there is a lack of ground staff which triggers delays and caos itís the solely responsibility of the airlines for not paying enough to the ground handling services or for not having their own staff under a permanent contract.

EU261 seems to be the only way airlines step aside of the peanuts contracts, donít help them for the sake of a facebook post or a goodwill from a manager.

Holidays and air travel is a LUXURY, not a right in any country constitution (may be the British will consider so butÖ) so if someone wants to travel in an airplane, the price should be in accordance with occidental working conditions and not slavery, therefore if there is no staff, itís due to the industry not being attractive and low attrition.

Anytime this happens, take a breath, make coffee, refuse to work on discretion and report it.

I am shock to see how the pilots will humiliate themselves to be in a piece of metal tube for peanuts.
I wish to be humiliated as well.
I would be truly offended to be in a job where there is poential to earn over £100k a year and retire on a plus £1million pension.
As one of our T.R.E's said recently.
How many jobs are there where you spend all day sitting on your arse and looking out of the window for this sort of money!!!!
ericferret is offline  
Old 2nd Jun 2022, 20:45
  #51 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2018
Location: Spain
Posts: 13
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Typical

Originally Posted by ericferret View Post
I wish to be humiliated as well.
I would be truly offended to be in a job where there is poential to earn over £100k a year and retire on a plus £1million pension.
As one of our T.R.E's said recently.
How many jobs are there where you spend all day sitting on your arse and looking out of the window for this sort of money!!!!
May be your TRE is earning a decent amount but everybody else is struggling to repay the high debt amount after training, buying a house itís utopian and 100k gross only means you will be a high tax payer, nothing else.

I can talk about working 20 days on late reports including weekends for those with kids and about fatigue and night flying. I never though that becoming a pilot I would still feel like at the bottom of the rat race.

You can always compare yourself against Cuban pilots of course.
Stabmotion is offline  
Old 3rd Jun 2022, 09:13
  #52 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Athens
Posts: 32
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Originally Posted by ericferret View Post
I wish to be humiliated as wellÖÖ..
How many jobs are there where you spend all day sitting on your arse and looking out of the window for this sort of money!!!!
Reading the above I conclude that:

Either you are not a professional pilot and you try to underestimate the profession, or you are one of those who do nothing during the flight (line training for new pilots, briefing for abnormals, wx for alternate airports, fuel checks etc). Then yes I agree, loading some baggage will help you to get out of your boredom especially on cloudy days.

I also feel so sorry for the Captains of the ships, who spend months looking out of the window and do not even have the opportunity to load some baggage for the salaries they are getting.

As I have worked in the cargo section of the airport before I started flying, I respect the right of my colleagues to strike, in order to avoid further degradation of their working conditions, and I also understand that if I do the work on their behalf (to avoid delays due to lack of personnel), the result will be a reduction in staff for the same number of flights.


pilot-737 is offline  
Old 3rd Jun 2022, 09:41
  #53 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: England
Posts: 1,408
Likes: 0
Received 9 Likes on 6 Posts
Originally Posted by pilot-737 View Post
Reading the above I conclude that:

Either you are not a professional pilot and you try to underestimate the profession, or you are one of those who do nothing during the flight (line training for new pilots, briefing for abnormals, wx for alternate airports, fuel checks etc). Then yes I agree, loading some baggage will help you to get out of your boredom especially on cloudy days.

I also feel so sorry for the Captains of the ships, who spend months looking out of the window and do not even have the opportunity to load some baggage for the salaries they are getting.

As I have worked in the cargo section of the airport before I started flying, I respect the right of my colleagues to strike, in order to avoid further degradation of their working conditions, and I also understand that if I do the work on their behalf (to avoid delays due to lack of personnel), the result will be a reduction in staff for the same number of flights.
I f you had actually read my initial post you would know what I do for a living.
In English we have an expression called "tongue in cheek" My tongue was firmly in cheek for my last post.

ericferret is offline  
Old 3rd Jun 2022, 12:20
  #54 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: South East.
Posts: 850
Received 4 Likes on 2 Posts
No sense of humour, ericferret.
Imagine having to spend the day with such a starchy skipper. He knows all the rules but doesn't apparently recognise the sheer joy of competently operating his aeroplane with a happy crew, no matter what..........
Sleeve Wing is offline  
Old 3rd Jun 2022, 12:54
  #55 (permalink)  

Only half a speed-brake
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Not commuting home
Age: 45
Posts: 4,116
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
So the people who opine against the reflex reaction of offering a hand freely at all times are not social enough to be given professional respect.

Glad that one is sorted and the thread can be put to rest.

Last edited by FlightDetent; 3rd Jun 2022 at 13:05.
FlightDetent is offline  
Old 3rd Jun 2022, 16:09
  #56 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Athens
Posts: 32
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
ericferret

Indeed, I did not connect you with the initial post. I apologize if I misunderstood the sense of what you wrote.

Sleeve Wing

Is there any objective argument on our subject, other than assumptions about my person?

I'm sorry to dissapoint you, but my definition of a ďhappy crewĒ does not include loading luggage at 0200 am just before the last leg.
pilot-737 is offline  
Old 3rd Jun 2022, 18:49
  #57 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2001
Location: London,England
Posts: 1,364
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I suppose how far you are prepared to go to help out depends on much goodwill you have towards your employer. I have none whatsoever so I fly the aircraft safely from A to B and make sure that I and the crew have as nice a day as possible. Anything else, no thanks.

Last edited by Max Angle; 4th Jun 2022 at 11:29.
Max Angle is offline  
Old 3rd Jun 2022, 20:41
  #58 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Europe
Posts: 1,086
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Few years ago SAS flight arrival ARN remote parking stand, no baggage loaders around due to whatever problems. The Cpt and FO went to offload it themselves along with a male FA, pretty remarkable for a heavily unionised carrier.
CargoOne is offline  
Old 3rd Jun 2022, 22:09
  #59 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2015
Location: Usually firmly on the ground
Posts: 99
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
As SLF I have been reading this thread with interest.
I find a useful tool for looking at this kind of situation to be what I have heard called the "ethical square". It is a box with "people" in the centre; the four sides are "the law", "motivation"; "the situation at hand", and "consequences".
The idea is that good decisions are ones that focus on the intrinsic value of people and that take into account the four sides. The "law" can be company regs, a national law, a religious law, or any other form of written code. It is there, but it alone will not help to determine the best outcome. As someone once said, the Sabbath is made for man, not man for the Sabbath.
The sides I think are the hardest to factor in when considering a decision are "motivation" (it's hard to be really sure of one's own motivation) and "consequences" - we cannot foresee them all, and we must not overlook the consequences of *inaction* either.
A final thing about this square is that the outcome from one instance cannot be held up as a precedent or justification.

Tl;dr: it's impossible to generalise from the actions of this pilot, but it made for a fun social media post.
Eutychus is offline  
Old 4th Jun 2022, 01:54
  #60 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: england
Posts: 799
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I think the issue is many of us that have been in the industry for a while recognise the danger of doing such things to help,out. It won’t be long before the pilots will be required to load and unload pax bags as part of their duties. I’m all for helping out here and there if I get the relevant pay for doing so. I’d also like the H&S training and top cover in case of injury.
I won’t hold my breath. I’ve no wish to “help out” in order to make O’Leary richer.
hunterboy is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service - Do Not Sell or Share My Personal Information

Copyright © 2023 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.