a350 Abnormal skin problems
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The latest dispute also shines a spotlight on the fate of a four-year-old Qatar Airways A350 that has been sitting in Toulouse since January, after initially being sent by the airline to Ireland to be repainted in World Cup livery.
Two industry sources said problems had emerged when the old paint was stripped away, triggering discussions over whether it was a one-off repair problem or evidence of deeper issues.
The plane was then sent to Toulouse, home to both Airbus and facilities of Satys Group, a major paint contractor that handles work for both Airbus and Qatar Airways, industry sources said.
It has remained in Toulouse since Jan 5, according to tracking data.
While the jet had been expected to go to Satys, which is repainting other jets for the 2022 tournament, it ended up on the forecourt of Airbus amid a standoff over who was to blame for exposing metal mesh on the aircraft's skin, they said.
A spokesman for Satys said it had no involvement with the A350 in question nor any disagreement with Qatar Airways and declined further comment.
Airbus said it does not comment on customer operations.
Two industry sources said problems had emerged when the old paint was stripped away, triggering discussions over whether it was a one-off repair problem or evidence of deeper issues.
The plane was then sent to Toulouse, home to both Airbus and facilities of Satys Group, a major paint contractor that handles work for both Airbus and Qatar Airways, industry sources said.
It has remained in Toulouse since Jan 5, according to tracking data.
While the jet had been expected to go to Satys, which is repainting other jets for the 2022 tournament, it ended up on the forecourt of Airbus amid a standoff over who was to blame for exposing metal mesh on the aircraft's skin, they said.
A spokesman for Satys said it had no involvement with the A350 in question nor any disagreement with Qatar Airways and declined further comment.
Airbus said it does not comment on customer operations.
So is the spat about one single airframe and paint removal only? Why don't they seem to take other new builds for the moment then?
The question is, did the company/people carry out the paint removal "in accordance with" Airbus correct procedures? Or was it a matter of "always this way for years" and surely the airline had a representative or two watching over the task?
Irregularities found on Qatar Airbus A350 during Painting in Shannon
From January this year:
https://flyinginireland.com/2021/01/...ng-in-shannon/
A Qatar Airways Airbus A350 was in Shannon recently for a repaint into a special paint scheme when some irregularities were found on the coating of the aircraft. The aircraft had arrived in Shannon on 13th November for a repaint by International Aerospace Coatings (IAC) into a special colours to promote the FIFA World Cup being held in Qatar in 2022. This is one of the first Airbus A350’s to receive a full new paint scheme. The repainting of the aircraft should take around ten days. However, when the aircraft was stripped engineers discovered surface coating irregularities. Engineers from Airbus in Toulouse travelled to Shannon to inspect the aircraft. It was decided that the aircraft would remain hangared in Shannon while temporary work was carried out. It was decided the aircraft would be ferried to Toulouse for further inspections by Airbus.
In a statement released by Airbus regarding the aircraft, it said “Whilst undergoing a repaint at Shannon, Qatar Airways’ Airbus A350-900 aircraft was observed to have some irregularities on the surface coating. The issue is superficial/cosmetic and only visible when the top coat of paint is stripped. It is not a structural composite issue! In agreement with Qatar Airways the aircraft will be flown to Toulouse for further inspection, as a precaution, and re-painting. There is no safety concern.”
In a statement released by Airbus regarding the aircraft, it said “Whilst undergoing a repaint at Shannon, Qatar Airways’ Airbus A350-900 aircraft was observed to have some irregularities on the surface coating. The issue is superficial/cosmetic and only visible when the top coat of paint is stripped. It is not a structural composite issue! In agreement with Qatar Airways the aircraft will be flown to Toulouse for further inspection, as a precaution, and re-painting. There is no safety concern.”
https://flyinginireland.com/2021/01/...ng-in-shannon/
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I wonder how many other A350’s haven been through repainting yet. I understand this one wasn’t due for a few years but only resprayed for the World Cup so a bit early to know if there is a fleet issue (as Qatar is suggesting).
IIRC the Eurofighter is good for only three to four full new coats of paint (including removal of the old paint) over the entire lifetime as the CFRP skin is pretty sensitive stuff. Who knows how they removed the old layer being used to metal skins?
golfyankeesierra
That's the worrisome thing - very few other A350's (if any) have been stripped and repainted, yet this one has an issue. If the painters didn't strip properly (for CF construction), Airbus needs to get on top of that and make sure the correct processes are out there and being used. If it's something more fundamental with the CF construction, Airbus needs to get on top of that as well.
I don't buy that this is 'just' a PR stunt by Qatar.
That's the worrisome thing - very few other A350's (if any) have been stripped and repainted, yet this one has an issue. If the painters didn't strip properly (for CF construction), Airbus needs to get on top of that and make sure the correct processes are out there and being used. If it's something more fundamental with the CF construction, Airbus needs to get on top of that as well.
I don't buy that this is 'just' a PR stunt by Qatar.
If I was Airbus I'd say "fine - all your orders are cancelled, here's your deposits, do not call us again"
Last edited by Chris2303; 10th Jun 2021 at 22:54.
How does "the mesh" work? Does it sit on top of the skin or is it embedded in the upper layer? Can it be replaced easily?
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I was at canadair in the early 80"s as i recall the mesh and a layer of film adhesive were the first items layed in the moulds before the first layer of pre preg. . Part of the inspection was to verify conductivity between to points after cure, it was often a problem to achieve the correct figures. I would think replacement of any of the mesh would be nearly impossible while keeping conductivity with the rest of the mesh .
If the A350 is similar to other Airbus aircraft composite bits such as wing to body fairings etc. the mesh is embedded into the upper gel coat so I would assume that the production process is as Widgeon has described.
There are repair procedures for repairing the mesh, but these are for fairly minor parts such as fairings. I've never worked on a A350 but I would assume there must be some sort of repair scheme for minor damage.
I think in this case it must be large area or several large areas that need repair if Airbus haven't figured out how to repair it yet.
There are repair procedures for repairing the mesh, but these are for fairly minor parts such as fairings. I've never worked on a A350 but I would assume there must be some sort of repair scheme for minor damage.
I think in this case it must be large area or several large areas that need repair if Airbus haven't figured out how to repair it yet.
So, the chemical paint remover also destroyed the gel-coat, or the sander operators didn't understand when the paint ended and the gel-coat started? Is this one of those occasions where the instructions should have been more vigorously read (apply to small area first)?
There is no gel coat on carbon prepreg parts. As widgeon notes above, the first layer into the mold, which will be the outer skin after pulling the part, is a ply of adhesive to give a finished surface. Gel coat is used for things like fiberglass pools, kayaks, etc.
On the monolithic carbon parts of the A350 the skin is made up of this inside to out, carbon fiber plies, then pore filler, primer and the paint system top coats. Between the primer and top coats there can also be anti-static coats and anti-erosion paint. The metallic foil (mesh) is in between the the paint system and the CFRP. So sanding too deep would certain carry a risk to the metallic foil and as it is part of the skin panel it would surely be almost impossible to replace if large enough areas are affected. Of course certain tolerances will allow limited amounts to be damaged, but that will probably be a area limit and would be found in the Structural Repair Manual.
Who picked that paint shop? Qatar or Airbus?
Or is this spat about the paint removal procedures by Airbus?
Or is this spat about the paint removal procedures by Airbus?