Icelandair fires ALL cabin crew

[Bittair3000]

After failing to reach an agreement with FFI (the Flight Attendant's union), including rejecting a new contract, Icelandair has decided to lay off all cabin crew!
As a temporary measure from July 20st and onwards, the airline will use company pilots to ensure safety onboard, until an agreement with a different union has been reached!

[TBSC]

Not sure I'd be a passenger on one of those flights.
https://onemileatatime.com/icelandai...m=BoardingArea

[an.other]

I flew Icelandair from KEF to LHR last weekend and was due to travel back on Thursday. I've just bought a one-way ticket back with easyJet as I would be surprised if this doesn't translate into reliability issues.

I have a number of friends at Icelandair. I've heard a lot of bad feeling towards the cabin crew union from other staff groups over allowances (e.g. cabin crew getting an allowance to read emails before starting duty, but other staff groups not). I know a lot of laid-off ground staff at Keflavik who'd jump at the chance to become cabin crew (and were actively looking for openings before COVID), plus a lot of former Wow crew who are still out of work.

So Icelandair probably can do this, but I'll take my business elsewhere.

[Banana Joe]

On a serious note, I would expect all the pilots to go on strike until the cabin crews are reinstated.

[nicolai]

Remember back when the longer-serving BA staff on the gold-plated contracts went on strike - and ground staff and pilots crewed the cabin?

[b1lanc]

Originally Posted by Banana Joe

On a serious note, I would expect all the pilots to go on strike until the cabin crews are reinstated.

I would expect the same in normal circumstances but not necessarily now. What I'm suggesting is that times are tough for all and self-survival is now a big concern.

[tonytales]

Cabin Crew not a Luxury

Hard to believe that Iceland's erquivalent the USA FAA wouldn't stop them from flying. Cabin staff are absolutely required on airliners. I went through the agony of obtaining FAA passenger certoificasion at Orion Air (the US one), Pace Airlines and Treadewinds Airline (the US one). Although I was head of Maintenance and had to get my end ceetified, I also saw the Cabin Staff getting certified. It was thorough and was mainly safety related. Not a luxury, an absolute necessity.
The FAA required a minimum number of trained cabin crew dependoimg on aircraft type and seating. I also took part in evacuation trials on 747. 737 and L-1011. We failed the first trial on the L-1011 because the slide rafts which rode up on the doors, were then pulled out by the door action then deployed. In this case they jammed and would not come out and so held the doors only psrtially opened. The slides, it turned out, had been improperly packed by the manufactirers own repair station in Miami. Worse than embarrassing, it had a dreadful possibility of trapping a whole planeload of pax. FAA of course was present and notified Miami FSDO of problem. I took it up with the repair station and on the next try, all slide/rafts worked properly. Pardon thread drift.

[Longtimer]

'so, will all the pilots, AMEs etc go out in support? I would bet not.

[InZed]

Originally Posted by b1lanc

I would expect the same in normal circumstances but not necessarily now. What I'm suggesting is that times are tough for all and self-survival is now a big concern.

It is a global pandemic, worldwide crisis and the start of a recession.. where airlines are going to shut down and people are going to lose their jobs. For a country of only 350,000 people... If you vote down a collective agreement during this time, I unfortunately can see why the airline has walked away.

Everyone in the global aviation industry is taking huge pay cuts to keep their jobs, facing down training to stay employed, or losing their jobs - you have to be able to meet the company halfway to help them out.

[krismiler]

Those cabin crew must be living in La La land. Everyone needs to pull together at the moment to keep as many of us employed as possible. Pay cuts are the norm for the foreseeable future, with those at the top taking the biggest hit. If I have to suffer a reduction in income for a while but someone keeps their job because of it, then it's money well spent.

[Dannyboy39]

"This is a pilot forum" - just getting that line in there before someone tries to justify not backing their colleagues...

[Krautwald]

Originally Posted by krismiler

Those cabin crew must be living in La La land. Everyone needs to pull together at the moment to keep as many of us employed as possible. Pay cuts are the norm for the foreseeable future, with those at the top taking the biggest hit. If I have to suffer a reduction in income for a while but someone keeps their job because of it, then it's money well spent.

1. Are you sure about that?
2. Except if people spend that money buying back their own jobs alone, while profits, bonuses etc. remain untouched. I get that big profits are unlikely as of now, but not at all sure this scenario is unthinkable.

Some things that disappear in crises just never come back, and that includes things that where right and just and fought for.

[an.other]

I have to agree. I do feel sorry for the crew who could see this and voted in favour of the agreement. They are now losing their jobs because of their colleagues.

I wonder if this will end up in a 'scab' conundrum, with some crew going back on Icelandair's new terms.

[PilotLZ]

Expect a massive round of landing bans for Icelandair across its route network. As far as I am aware, operating a passenger flight without cabin crew is illegal anywhere in the world. And for a good reason. While pilots are trained how to operate the doors (and have to open and close them for real on some ferry flights without cabin crew), the functions of the cabin crew aren't limited to the doors and the trolley service. What if there's a cabin or lavatory fire? What if a passenger becomes unwell or disruptive? What if an actual in-flight emergency happens? The pilots will have plenty on their plate and there's no chance they will be able to also prepare and possibly evacuate the cabin.

The only way this might work is if the idea is to use pilots who are not flying in the cockpit for the time being as cabin crew (after appropriate training). But even then, are there going to be enough pilots for that, given that the normal crew ratio is at least 2-2,5 cabin crew per pilot? And how long will training and checking them take?

Loads of unanswered questions. Hopefully this will not become the final nail in the coffin of an otherwise good airline.

[krismiler]

A previous employer of mine occasionally used pilots ac CC on regional turboprops if numbers were lacking due to excess leave or sickness. Needless to say it wasn't a popular duty.

If pilots have done the same emergency training as the CC, first aid, fire fighting, planned ditching etc, then it might be acceptable to the authorities however a cabin crew in charge would be needed and none of the pilots would qualify for that position, which normally has experience requirements.

[PilotLZ]

The last one is completely true, I think that 500 hours in CCM capacity is the legal requirement to become a SCCM.

[MANAGP]

I don't think there will be any "landing bans", the pilots will be licensed cabin crew, no big deal! Let's be honest British Airways did it with pilots and ground staff.

[Kirks gusset]

Article 1 (2)(11) defines ‘cabin crew member’ as follows:

(11) “Cabin crew member” means an appropriately qualified crew member, other than a flight crew or technical crew member, who is assigned by an operator to perform duties related to the safety of passengers and flight during operations;
To fulfil this definition the company may have to stand the pilots down as "pilots" and redefine them as "cabin crew" A SCCM can be anyone the company deems fit to be so with the appropriate training, for instance, if the SCCM becomes incapacitated the Commander would elect whom would do the task of SCCM , may not be the next most senior member, but whomever the Commander feels can do the role.

I remember when BA hold pool newbies were working as cabin crew, but quite how long horn skippers from IcelandAir will fair!

[750XL]

Strikes always have and always will be a huge thing in Iceland, just as recently with the nurses strikes, ferry workers strikes etc...

Madness from the cabin crew union in my opinion, there's thousands who would be willing to step up and take their role in a moments notice (both in Iceland and Europe as a whole!)

[iggy]

I can be a cabin crew if they want me to all right. But I just can't reach the pax sitting next to the window, back ache, and also can't bend over to the lower drawers in the galley, too big of a belly.

Oh, and I don't think the life vest fits me. And I just suck at blowing... the life vest during the safety demo.