PIA A320 Crash Karachi

[jewitts]

Originally Posted by ZH871

Did they forget to lower the gear on the first landing attempt?!

Looking closely at the lower edge, definitely looks like a little bit of damage? (Both engines) It could be heat haze or graininess of the image though.

[gtaflyer]

Can hear the master warning going off after localizer established on the video, sounds like dual engine failure. Very sad day ....

[VH DSJ]

Originally Posted by DIBO

https://twitter.com/PlaneSpottersPK/...152330752?s=20

That twitter post is saying it attempted a belly landing but went around? Were there reports of a landing gear malfunction requiring a belly landing?

[atr-drivr]

The pictures from post 19 shows one of the engines....all the front blades are intact....no power at impact...?

[jthg]

Originally Posted by logansi

WOW! Those engines look like they've been run around the ground to me..... Gear up landing, lifted of again, engines failed due to damage, crashed?

It does look like that would fit the reports as well as the photographs and perhaps the engines made their imminent departure apparent which explains the truncated GA

[Maninthebar]

Image on AVH shows much reduced black marks on engines and gear down, unclear what sequence the images occur in.

[andrasz]

Originally Posted by Maninthebar

Image on AVH shows much reduced black marks on engines and gear down, unclear what sequence the images occur in.

I think the image on AVH is not from today, it is inconsistent with the images from PlaneSpottersPK.

[CodyBlade]

Danger of fasting for aircrew is dehydration and low sugar.

[PoppaJo]

Originally Posted by Maninthebar

Image on AVH shows much reduced black marks on engines and gear down, unclear what sequence the images occur in.

No RAT in that photo I don’t think it’s related.

AH usually pretty good for detail so no clue why Simon uploaded that.

[DIBO]

Originally Posted by andrasz

I think the image on AVH is not from today, it is inconsistent with the images from PlaneSpottersPK.

Indeed; also doubting someone would take the time to add "Through the lens" titles....

[aerobus123]

The Airblue crash in 2010 happened with a highly religious captain who was fasting, and diabetic. Regulators should definitely mandate regular meals for pilots before and during flights!

[a3twenty]

U get a master warning at 700 ft if the gear is not lowered. It's kind of difficult to FORGET..

[reverserunlocked]

It’s easy to leave the gear down and it’s been done more than once, especially if the PM gets distracted during the ‘gear up’ call. However an A320 would be very unhappy indeed if you tried to land with the gear up. Was the belly landing intentional?

And I’m struggling to understand going around from a belly landing as it seems the inevitable damage to the engines left them with a double flameout.

Unless somehow (and I don’t know how - they forgot AND the gear config failed AND they didn’t do the checklist) they landed without the gear and then were shocked into going around at the resulting cruncher.

[Toryu]

The pictures with the supposedly scraped engines seem to show a whiff of white smoke (oil?) coming from below the nacelles.
Could the black marks also indicate thermal damage as opposed to or on top of scrapes?

#2 certainly looks a bit banged up.

+1 on at least one engine without rotation on impact.

[DIBO]

Originally Posted by Maninthebar

Image on AVH shows much reduced black marks on engines and gear down, unclear what sequence the images occur in.

That image from "PAF Falcons" Twitter (copied onto the AVHerald page), was preceded a few minutes before by this completely fake CGI image
https://twitter.com/PAF_Falcons/stat...480334339?s=20
So AVHerald, do us a favour and remove the fake news.

[PoppaJo]

Originally Posted by reverserunlocked

It’s easy to leave the gear down and it’s been done more than once, especially if the PM gets distracted during the ‘gear up’ call. However an A320 would be very unhappy indeed if you tried to land with the gear up. Was the belly landing intentional?

And I’m struggling to understand going around from a belly landing as it seems the inevitable damage to the engines left them with a double flameout.

Unless somehow (and I don’t know how - they forgot AND the gear config failed AND they didn’t do the checklist) they landed without the gear and then were shocked into going around at the resulting cruncher.

They probably found out about the gear not down on climb out. Which is why I assume they conducted the missed app, thought it was a just a bad touchdown. Certainly is not an engine I would be wanting on the wing for a gear up arrival. Let alone slamming a CFM on the deck.

[Chris Scott]

Originally Posted by drdino

Bloody hell...
Are we sure this is the aircraft from today? RAT looks deployed, the engine undersides look quite bad... The left one has bits hanging off oft he lip?

If the two photos by Plane Spotters Pakistan (Post #60) are of the accident a/c on the accident flight - rather than simply on a previous, routine air test - the deployment of the RAT suggests failure of both engine-driven generators. The accessory gearboxes that drive each one are mounted on the bottom of each engine.

Re. Bob Viking's post #59, and the altitude trace on Dave Reid UK's post #55, the FR24 altitude data has to be interpreted with care. I think you may find it is referenced to an altimeter sub-scale setting of standard (1013 hPa). The 0955Z METAR gives a QNH of 1004, and the airfield elevation is 100 ft. Therefore, an altimeter set to 1013 hPa on its sub-scale would have read about 350 ft on the ground.

[reverserunlocked]

Originally Posted by PoppaJo

They probably found out about the gear not down on climb out. Which is why I assume they conducted the missed app, thought it was a just a bad touchdown. Certainly is not an engine I would be wanting on the wing for a gear up arrival. Let alone slamming a CFM on the deck.

Agreed, but still doesn’t explain how they managed to land it with the gear up.

[Bob Viking]

Chris Scott

You’re absolutely correct and I was dumb not to think of it like that.

TBH I am not a regular user of FR24 (I only use it to check on status of flights I’m waiting for!) so assumed it was showing AGL.

I will learn to keep my mouth shut in future!

BV

[ChicoG]

Originally Posted by Bloated Stomach

4 years ago, a PIA crashed in Ramadan. Pilot error was the nominating factor whilst dealing with an engine failure.

Today we see another accident in the month of Ramadan. If this accident was caused by yet more pilot error, then there must be an investigation to see if the crew were observing their fasts whilst operating. I think this may be an underlying issue with pilot judgement and decision making.

You are exempt from fasting when you are travelling. Unfortunately some people don't adhere to this because it means making up the lost fast later on = a longer Ramadhan.