PIA A320 Crash Karachi
Originally Posted by Aeromech3
Why offer "pilot discretion proceed direct MAKLI" if this would entail a follow on LH hold pattern (over a populated areas), what advantage?
As the Capn implies, short cuts and “straight-ins” are not uncommon but it’s up to both pilots to agree about their aircraft’s potential and kinetic energy. If the crew is unhappy with the offer, possibly because tiredness, either a polite refusal or a request for more track miles is the correct response and is always respected.
So a very quick mental calculation and discussion for those who are well trained, well rested and well fed.
So a very quick mental calculation and discussion for those who are well trained, well rested and well fed.
Last transcripts
At least crying Inshallah sounds better than Alahu Akbar in their final CVR during their final minutes and shows they had not lost their nerve completely.
I looked into this accident today.
I'm really shocked to find out that most likely all of the deadly mistakes that day were committed by the F/O.
Of course you could say that the captain stubborness to land at all costs was the cause of this accident. But the F/O really didn't help.
He was most likely the one to retract the landing gear before landing. Had he not done that, the aircraft would have probably been able to stop on the runway with the gear down.
He's the one who called for a go around, with engines scraping the runway. Had he not done that, they would just have made a runway excursion, with possibly 100% survivors depending on how much the airplane would have slowed before encountering the first obstacle.
He was the one calling for right engine idle after the "go around". Had he not done that, the airplane would have had more altitude when the engines would give up (after having lost all of their oil)
He was most likely the one to get the landing gear out again after the ATC called them about it. Had he not done that, the airplane most probably could have flown the 1300 meters that it was missing from the runway. And it's likely everybody would have survived, if the gear had been extended at the right time (30s before touchdown).
To sum up, the captain would have transformed a normal standard flight, into a very unstandard flight but certainly without any scratch to the passengers or airplane. The captain could have crashed the airplane, but some other day.
On the other hand, the first officer transformed the very unstandard flight without any damage, to a fatal crash, then and there.
And he committed at least 4 actions that all converged to do so. Abstaining from just one of them could have saved most of the lives involved and even the airplane serviceability (first one).
It's surprising that his role is not emphasized more.
Of course I'm not advocating for 7° slope approaches over stabilized approaches, but I will advocate for messy landings that don't kill anybody over crashes, all day long, all year round.
I'm really shocked to find out that most likely all of the deadly mistakes that day were committed by the F/O.
Of course you could say that the captain stubborness to land at all costs was the cause of this accident. But the F/O really didn't help.
He was most likely the one to retract the landing gear before landing. Had he not done that, the aircraft would have probably been able to stop on the runway with the gear down.
He's the one who called for a go around, with engines scraping the runway. Had he not done that, they would just have made a runway excursion, with possibly 100% survivors depending on how much the airplane would have slowed before encountering the first obstacle.
He was the one calling for right engine idle after the "go around". Had he not done that, the airplane would have had more altitude when the engines would give up (after having lost all of their oil)
He was most likely the one to get the landing gear out again after the ATC called them about it. Had he not done that, the airplane most probably could have flown the 1300 meters that it was missing from the runway. And it's likely everybody would have survived, if the gear had been extended at the right time (30s before touchdown).
To sum up, the captain would have transformed a normal standard flight, into a very unstandard flight but certainly without any scratch to the passengers or airplane. The captain could have crashed the airplane, but some other day.
On the other hand, the first officer transformed the very unstandard flight without any damage, to a fatal crash, then and there.
And he committed at least 4 actions that all converged to do so. Abstaining from just one of them could have saved most of the lives involved and even the airplane serviceability (first one).
It's surprising that his role is not emphasized more.
Of course I'm not advocating for 7° slope approaches over stabilized approaches, but I will advocate for messy landings that don't kill anybody over crashes, all day long, all year round.
I'm really shocked to find out that most likely all of the deadly mistakes that day were committed by the F/O.
