DL Retiring its 777 Fleet

[warbirdfinder]

Perhaps if Bastian had not been doing stock buybacks for the last 3 years ( 12 billion dollars worth) they would be in good shape economically. But as long as they want to line their own pockets with more millions they will keep doing stock buybacks. Same stupid stuff that Mullin did before 9/11

[frieghtdog2000]

B777-300ER

Presently the entire BA 777-300ER fleet are operating continuously as freighters whilst the majority of the other fleets are in storage. I believe the seats are being removed from one or two to increase the capacity.

[procede]

Originally Posted by mattyj

Yeah in response to the person who said get them converted to freighter, there is no such conversion at this time and if there was there’d be bookings until 2030 right now..and the Israeli conversion is only for the 300 as far as I understand. My airline tried to give our 200s back to the lessor but they didn’t want that in the current climate. The ones we own outright we enquired about mothballing in the usual boneyards, and they said join the back of the queue..no one wants them for parts and the boneyards will only take them if you pay exorbitant parking charges as they have more than they need.

I thought the 200LR is basically the same airframe as the 200F. Converting a 200 should not be an issue, if you can convert a -300, as long as you can find airframes that are worth it (not too many hours and cycles) and there is enough demand.

[neilki]

Big Motors

Originally Posted by MichaelKPIT

The engines are WIDER than a 737/757 fuselage!

It's always fun when the new type you're training on has a bigger engine than the fuselage of your previous type

[tdracer]

Originally Posted by procede

I thought the 200LR is basically the same airframe as the 200F. Converting a 200 should not be an issue, if you can convert a -300, as long as you can find airframes that are worth it (not too many hours and cycles) and there is enough demand.

It's still far easier said than done - note that the 777-300ERSF program is ~30 months from launch to first deliveries. There is a lot of engineering and cert work that goes into turning a passenger aircraft into a dedicated freighter. I'm guessing they'd need to get commitments for around 10-12 conversions just to make the nonrecurring costs worthwhile.

Originally Posted by neilki

It's always fun when the new type you're training on has a bigger engine than the fuselage of your previous type

I used to have a photo at my desk of a PW4084 on a cradle sitting next to a 737 (both from the front) - and there was no observable difference in diameter.
The GE9X fan is something like 18 inches bigger than the PW4084

[Australopithecus]

Originally Posted by neilki

It's always fun when the new type you're training on has a bigger engine than the fuselage of your previous type

The last flight in my log book before my 737-200 course was a glider, so yeah, I know what you mean.

[Una Due Tfc]

Originally Posted by procede

I thought the 200LR is basically the same airframe as the 200F. Converting a 200 should not be an issue, if you can convert a -300, as long as you can find airframes that are worth it (not too many hours and cycles) and there is enough demand.

For starters, the floor on the F is significantly stronger than the LR, then there’s issues like where is all the wiring, ducting, cables etc in the fuselage and will they have to be moved to cut the cargo door? P2F development programmes are not cheap. Before everything went to hell, it was looking like plenty of 77Ws would be exiting passenger service in the coming years as they were replaced by newer models. Freighters tend to max out on volume before weight, so the 77W is a more attractive candidate than the 200 models.

[RAWLAW]

Pretty sure you are correct. Outdated propaganda for sure.

[1000tolevel]

DAL X-qualification

Not really related to the 777, but...
Can a DAL pilot be dual-qualified to fly a 737 one week then a 757 the next? What about Relief Pilots? THX.

[Airbubba]

Originally Posted by 1000tolevel

Not really related to the 777, but...
Can a DAL pilot be dual-qualified to fly a 737 one week then a 757 the next? What about Relief Pilots? THX.

I don't know about Delta specifically but I think in general the answer is no. In the past some airlines allowed management pilots to be qualified on more than one aircraft type but as far as I know this practice has been abandoned in the U.S. for the last couple of decades or so.

Similarly, relief pilots will normally be qualified on only one major aircraft type in my experience.

But I may be wrong, after all the mergers over the years some interesting legacy procedures and practices still exist.

Some type ratings normally cover different variations of an aircraft with a similar cockpit e.g. B-757 and B-767, A310 and A300-600 and B-747-400 and B-747-8.

[bafanguy]

Originally Posted by Airbubba

I don't know about Delta specifically but I think in general the answer is no.

1000tolevel,

Airbubba is correct. That'd be a BIG no-no at Widget Wonderland. Same for relief pilots

[Sailvi767]

Delta actually does not even have relief pilots like some international airlines. All pilots are fully type rated in the aircraft and landings are rotated amongst all pilots.

[1000tolevel]

Thanks

That’s what I thought. Just stumbled upon this guy commenting on aviation news website saying he flies a 37 one day and a 57 the next. I knew it was very unlikely but had to check before calling him out.

[tdracer]

Originally Posted by 1000tolevel

That’s what I thought. Just stumbled upon this guy commenting on aviation news website saying he flies a 37 one day and a 57 the next. I knew it was very unlikely but had to check before calling him out.

Are you sure he said "37" (or perhaps was misquoted)? Delta has taken full advantage of the 757/767 common type rating - regularly swapping pilots between the two.
It's been a several years now, but I was once seated next to an 'in transit' Delta pilot who flew 757s and 767s. He mentioned that he often didn't know if he was going to be flying a 57 or a 67 until after he arrived at the airport.

[Airbubba]

Originally Posted by tdracer

Are you sure he said "37" (or perhaps was misquoted)? Delta has taken full advantage of the 757/767 common type rating - regularly swapping pilots between the two.

I think just about every carrier that has both swaps pilots on either plane. However some pilots may not maintain overwater quals in a domestic domicile. Perhaps a moot point by now but is the B-764 a separate fleet at Delta?

And as I've commented elsewhere here, I've seen augmented crews done every which way over the years.

I ran into one of these larger than life guys a while back as I posted on another thread and I did some checking:

Years ago I ran into a guy who claimed to have flown for NASA, flown helos in the Army and F-4's in the Air Force. When I asked if he had any airliner time he said he had flown 727's, 737's, 747's, 757's, 767's and 777's and a few other non-Boeings. I started wiping off my shoes.

Somebody told me he was legit, I didn't believe it.

I looked up his FAA license.

[Check Airman]

Originally Posted by 1000tolevel

Not really related to the 777, but...
Can a DAL pilot be dual-qualified to fly a 737 one week then a 757 the next? What about Relief Pilots? THX.

As far as I know, no US airline allows this. 757/767, yes. Some management, or maintenance pilots, yes. But the average line pilot will only fly one type. The 767-400 is a different category as well.

Likewise for relief pilots. US airlines train you as either CA or FO. You'll be assigned the position on some flights (CA or FO, as appropriate) depending on what your bid preferences are.

[Anti Skid On]

Coming back to topic, Air New Zealand already announced their 5 772's are being retired and the 773's were going to be parked up, possibly to return. If they don't they'll be replaced with 787's. Seems to be a bit of a theme.

[Airbubba]

Originally Posted by Anti Skid On

Coming back to topic, Air New Zealand already announced their 5 772's are being retired and the 773's were going to be parked up, possibly to return. If they don't they'll be replaced with 787's. Seems to be a bit of a theme.

Meanwhile, over at Emirates:

Sources also told Arabian Business the airline is considering laying off the majority of its A380 pilots, maintaining only 20 of its superjumbo fleet, to focus on the Boeing 777s instead.

https://www.arabianbusiness.com/trav...er-a380-future

[mattyj]

Coming back to topic, Air New Zealand already announced their 5 772's are being retired and the 773's were going to be parked up, possibly to return. If they don't they'll be replaced with 787's. Seems to be a bit of a theme.

well that’s sort of part of the reduce costs at all costs Walmart/standard business practice 21st century model. There’s a few problems with that plan a/ they’ve made approaches with lease firms and desert storage outfits about disposal of the 200s and they can’t get rid of them. Some have been bubble wrapped for long term storage at NZ airports now..parking fees have necessitated the 300s find work..it’s cheaper to run them at break even than pay parking fees. and..b/ the trouble with the 787 is that the issues with the rollers haven’t gone away and cargo is the white horse at the moment and the 78 can’t carry any

[Spooky 2]

Originally Posted by Check Airman

As far as I know, no US airline allows this. 757/767, yes. Some management, or maintenance pilots, yes. But the average line pilot will only fly one type. The 767-400 is a different category as well.

Likewise for relief pilots. US airlines train you as either CA or FO. You'll be assigned the position on some flights (CA or FO, as appropriate) depending on what your bid preferences are.

I believe UAL pilots include the 767-400 in their 767 category bid?