DL Retiring its 777 Fleet

[mattyj]

777s are a hauler..especially the 300’s. All the pax all the freight all the fuel. (Almost ) License to print money if you can fill them up (which is the current problem)

I heard someone say they had the best underfloor cargo capability in class.

[Loose rivets]

777 SLF-ing to Texas with BA, our captain explained that someone had stuffed a wooden crate in the hold and they were waiting to see if the wiring had be affected.

It had.

[LostWanderer]

Originally Posted by procede

The 777s could be easy to sell for freighter conversions.

Very true, I'd almost put money on the fact they already are sold or maybe have some deal pending.

[Drc40]

The power plants look almost as big as the fuselage! Damn...

[MichaelKPIT]

Originally Posted by Drc40

The power plants look almost as big as the fuselage! Damn...

The engines are WIDER than a 737/757 fuselage!

[tdracer]

Originally Posted by LostWanderer

Very true, I'd almost put money on the fact they already are sold or maybe have some deal pending.

Boeing in conjunction with Israeli Aerospace is developing a 777-300ER Freighter Conversion (777-300ERSF). But it's not scheduled to fly until the end of this year and certify in 2022.
Given the current environment, they may want to work to accelerate that schedule...

[lomapaseo]

Originally Posted by MichaelKPIT

The engines are WIDER than a 737/757 fuselage!

Is there an engine pix somewhere with six seats across and a trolly in the aisle

[Pilot DAR]

using those secret airline codes like SQ, CX, QF and BR here on the so-called Professional Pilots Rumour Network.

Yes, some codes are better known than others. Yes, I could look up DL, to find Delta. I've flown as a Delta passenger many times, I just don't have their code memorized, and would be more happy to see the full name in the title of a thread. And, about secret airline codes, I worked for WB here in Canada (not Rwanda) decades back: Three 707's, then four DC-8-63's, and two L1011's. The Air Canada ramp guys would tell me that "WB" stood for "Water Buffalo", but that wasn't it!

That airline was forced to end its service due to changes in the economy, so I can empathize with the airline's challenges these days....

[Airbubba]

Originally Posted by Pilot DAR

I'm sure that many people reading this know who DL is, and what company Ed Bastian works for. For what it's worth, I'm not one of those people....

Originally Posted by Airbubba

I always feel apologetic about using those secret airline codes like SQ, CX, QF and BR here on the so-called Professional Pilots Rumour Network. It's an airline thing I suppose.

Originally Posted by Pilot DAR

Yes, some codes are better known than others. Yes, I could look up DL, to find Delta. I've flown as a Delta passenger many times, I just don't have their code memorized, and would be more happy to see the full name in the title of a thread.

I'd say that that most pax outside the U.S. are familiar with those codes in my experience. It's probably an international thing that folks who fly domestically in the U.S. don't see much. Once again, apologies for the technical pilot stuff on PPRuNe.

For example:

NRT (Narita, Japan - Near Tokyo)



LHR (London, England)



CDG (Paris, France)

[misd-agin]

Originally Posted by mattyj

777s are a hauler..especially the 300’s. All the pax all the freight all the fuel. (Almost ) License to print money if you can fill them up (which is the current problem)

I heard someone say they had the best underfloor cargo capability in class.

Almost. On our longest flight they pumped the gas until the plane wouldn't take anymore. Typically 312-315,000 lbs vs the 320,000 lbs advertised. Fuel was slightly warmer than 15C/59F. Sometimes we'd be capped at approx. 40-60 less passengers than full. Carry that much weight for 16 hrs wouldn't leave enough reserve fuel on arrival. We'd laugh if the takeoff weight was undr 760,000 lbs - "we're light. This baby is going to stand on it's tail and rocket out of here!" Needless to say reality was that we didn't rocket out of town on departure at that weight. Another saying "there is no 'pull the nose up to make a crossing restriction.' The more you pull the nose up the farther you'll miss the restriction by."

[Chris2303]

Originally Posted by NG_Kaptain

Airbubba...
Don't feel apologetic about using the ICAO or IATA codes, after all this is a "Professional Pilots Rumour Network".

And Google is your friend

[Springbok614]

I am writing under correction, but did Delta not make an extensive investment in refurbishing their 767 fleet’s interiors? Apart from the large fleet of 767 which they operate, that may also play a role?

[RAWLAW]

Delta has become Airbus Industries favorite customer and at this time I would bet Airbus gave Delta a sweet deal along with government sponsored savings based on the quantity of aircraft Delta has committed to. Knowing that Delta and the industry has excess capacity, for now, Delta probably did not want to eliminate one of the most popular and capable aircraft in their fleet but had no choice based on the numbers and the goal to maintain a newer fleet. This situation will test every airline management to make very tough and unpopular decisions. Next will be furloughs and pay cuts. There will be a lot of pain and disillusions as the various airlines, and travel industry, employees unwind their budgets to this reality. One moment there was unlimited prosperity and the next moment there was unemployment, not what all those new pilots and Flight Crew ever expected. Contract negotiations are going to be pretty rough.

[WHBM]

It always seemed the two small 777 sub-fleets at Delta were a bit out on a limb in their overall set of aircraft, so it's no real surprise they look to remove them. A number of 777-200s from the era of their first half of the fleet had already been scrapped by other carriers.

[Pilot DAR]

Don't feel apologetic about using the ICAO or IATA codes, after all this is a "Professional Pilots Rumour Network".

Sure. And there are professional pilots on this forum who have nothing whatever to do with airline operations (anymore), other than to ride as a passenger from time to time. It's fair enough to use codes in the discussion when most people understand the context. Using a code in the opening title of the thread will send some people to Google, where simply writing the three extra letters would have let everyone understand from the beginning without distracting the effort with a google search.

For those times I fly as a crew member (knowing that most of my professional piloting is solo), the pre takeoff briefing will include: "Is that understood?" meaning that the pilot preforming the briefing would like to assure understanding with the crew. I hope that professional effort toward effective communication can extend to posts, or at least the titles....

[SeenItAll]

Originally Posted by Check Airman

My bold. If the 777 is that much less efficient than the A350, how is Boeing still selling them? What am I missing here?

What Boeing is still selling are the 777-300ERs, much more efficient on a CASM basis than the 777-200ERs and 777-200LRs that Delta has.

[nicolai]

The aircraft everyone loves for mixed cargo/pax ops is the 777-300ER - not the small predecessor 777-200s (ER/LR). Those are being replaced by either the 787 or the A350,

Of course, you have to have the cargo and pax volume. One of those is currently missing...

[PAXboy]

I guess Bastian used the term 'iconic' for the 777 to big up the crews. I have nerv thought of it as 'iconic'. It was just a very good, very big, twin. What i liked about it was that it was built 'old style' and any prangs it has been in show that it holds up very well.

[Airbubba]

Originally Posted by RAWLAW

One moment there was unlimited prosperity and the next moment there was unemployment, not what all those new pilots and Flight Crew ever expected. Contract negotiations are going to be pretty rough.

Looks like the Delta entry on the Alpa.org website is a few weeks out of date:

In 2019, the pilots helped fuel the company’s unprecedented run of profitability. During the summer, the pilot group flew record amounts of overtime, which enabled Delta to execute and capitalize on an aggressive flying schedule. The pilots’ continued leadership on the line fueled Delta’s stellar operational performance. As the company looks to continue to build its brand and create loyal customers, the pilots are proud to deliver a product that generates a revenue premium.

“We’re negotiating for a new pilot working agreement during the most favorable environment in Delta’s history,” said Schnitzler. “Delta is earning record profits, has built a diversified business model able to weather negative economic cycles, has the cash flow to invest in shareholders and joint ventures, and has dedicated employees willing to go the extra mile to maximize revenue and serve our customers.”

https://www.alpa.org/en/about-alpa/o...t-groups/delta

[mattyj]

Yeah in response to the person who said get them converted to freighter, there is no such conversion at this time and if there was there’d be bookings until 2030 right now..and the Israeli conversion is only for the 300 as far as I understand. My airline tried to give our 200s back to the lessor but they didn’t want that in the current climate. The ones we own outright we enquired about mothballing in the usual boneyards, and they said join the back of the queue..no one wants them for parts and the boneyards will only take them if you pay exorbitant parking charges as they have more than they need.