Boeing - Embraer Deal Cancelled

[vikingivesterled]

Originally Posted by ORAC

BEA_71,

This week’s issue of AW&ST has an analysis stating precisely that in the expected market it is the Airbus A220 and the EMB aircraft which are at the sweet spot for range and payload.

But they are missing a middle seat to keep free so social distancing would be a problem if governments go that way. That could ultimately mean 1/2 load only instead of 2/3.
Unless loaded with halve and halve of couples and singles whch could mean 3/4 load.
It would mean that somebody will have to come up with some smart planning software for seating and loading and that slf load limits will depend on the passengers normal cohabitation arrangements.
In all the commuter planes takeover of the 73x/32x market could be shortlived.

[Spooky 2]

Originally Posted by procede

Not just that. The US taxpayer would also have to spend money to save what is now Embraer...
As for the repercussions of cancelling the deal: when has the US ever complied with international law when it was not in their own interest? Especially with the current president...

In case you have not figured it out, the US is tired of doing things that are not in our own best interest. You'll get over it so don't worry.

[DaveReidUK]

Originally Posted by Spooky 2

In case you have not figured it out, the US is tired of doing things that are not in our own best interest.

Gosh, when was the era that the US ever did anything other than that ?

[Spooky 2]

Originally Posted by DaveReidUK

Gosh, when was the era that the US ever did anything other than that ?

You may be right but I seem to recall the LEND LEASE ACT along with a few others way back when. No need to respond as the thread drift takes away from the original content

[WHBM]

Originally Posted by neilki

As good as ever. Alaska does not operate any Ejets. The only Major Airline EJet operators are American & JetBlue.

The old saying "The proof is in the paint"
https://www.airliners.net/photo/Alas...-200LR/5445073

Originally Posted by ProPax

What China REALLY need now is the know-how of airplane manufacturing and marketing. Embraer has oodles of it,

I wouldn't say that producing a new type aimed at the US commuter market which does not meet the US scope agreements so none of them will order it is the height of marketing acumen.

[tdracer]

Originally Posted by ProPax

If Airbus has any cash left in their coffers, now is a good time to buy Embraer on similar conditions as Bombardier. Only this time, instead of 1 dollar, Brazil may want Airbus to keep the national pride afloat. It will give Airbus absolutely nothing in terms of model range expansion (unless they want to dive into the business jets market) but will eliminate a competitor for their A220 for at least the next decade.

Airbus is facing a financial nightmare as well - requiring them to dump tens of thousands of workers and quite possibly needed government assistance to remain viable.
I doubt the European taxpayers would look to kindly on Airbus dumping billions of Euros into a foreign acquisition at the same time they are cutting workforce and asking for government assistance.

[FlightDetent]

Originally Posted by tdracer

I doubt the European taxpayers would look to kindly on Airbus dumping billions of Euros into a foreign acquisition at the same time they are cutting workforce and asking for government assistance.

I am sourly afraid you overestimate the lucidity of the average EU taxpayer, as well as the means any set of citizens - who are constrained by voting within their national entities - may have on forming the top-level polices. Let alone holding accountable those who make them. [/rant

[Ejector]

CHINA Expected To Buy Embraer - Reuters

Noted earlier in Boeing news that the proposed takeover the Brazilian firm has fallen through

• $4.2 billion proposed takeover deal between the two fell apart over the weekend.

UBS have noted that China may be interested in buying up Embraer's commercial planes

• "We believe China still aspires to a global aerospace leadership position and, in our view, (Embraer) would bring both the talent for design and development."

(via Reuters)

[neilki]

Youre looking at the wrong bit

Originally Posted by WHBM

The old saying "The proof is in the paint"
https://www.airliners.net/photo/Alas...-200LR/5445073


I wouldn't say that producing a new type aimed at the US commuter market which does not meet the US scope agreements so none of them will order it is the height of marketing acumen.

Thats a SkyWest 175.....

[WHBM]

Originally Posted by neilki

Thats a SkyWest 175.....

Um ... what do the big letters on the side say ?

[ATC Watcher]

Originally Posted by WHBM

Um ... what do the big letters on the side say ?

It is like with all things, it is the small letters at the bottom that counts ..and it is SkyWest.. read the legend of the photo. the paint on the hull is not ownership

[DaveReidUK]

Originally Posted by ATC Watcher

It is like with all things, it is the small letters at the bottom that counts ..and it is SkyWest.. read the legend of the photo. the paint on the hull is not ownership

Quite so.

[atakacs]

We believe China still aspires to a global aerospace leadership position and, in our view, (Embraer) would bring both the talent for design and development

That would be the logical move, but I don't see Boeing (aka the US government, for all intent ad purpose the same thing at this point) let it happen. They will apply the "right" amount of pressure on Brasil.

[Less Hair]

Could Brasil afford to finally give away what they have created over tens of years for billions? I think Embraer should cooperate with other guys, Japan, Korea and such. Maybe Indonesia, Malaysia, Turkey.

[turbidus]

The best bet for Airbus would be to swoop in and buy a bunch of the options out there...It would prevent a sale to COMAC.

As we have seen in the press, Boeing is reducing their workforce with early outs...they were doing this in anticipation of moving Engineering offshore...consolidating 787 production in SC, and shutting down the 747 line in Evertt, and moving the 737 Renton line to Everett (a much better location)
Now, what will they do for engineering, everyone with experience is gone....

[tdracer]

Originally Posted by neilki

Thats a SkyWest 175.....

Yes, but it just as easily could have said Horizon.
Given that Horizon is a wholly owned subsidiary of Alaska Air Group, I think it would be accurate to say that a Horizon E-175 can be considered to be owned by Alaska.

[neilki]

Originally Posted by tdracer

Yes, but it just as easily could have said Horizon.
Given that Horizon is a wholly owned subsidiary of Alaska Air Group, I think it would be accurate to say that a Horizon E-175 can be considered to be owned by Alaska.

The article states "Alaska Airlines, for example, flies the 76-seat E-175"- While you could argue the layman wouldn't take exception to this, there's much confusion, especially in Europe over scope, and why the US airline industry breaks down around the 76 seater.
This is a distinction that may become very important in the comming months as 'United" retire their CR 200's for example...

[tdracer]

Originally Posted by neilki

The article states "Alaska Airlines, for example, flies the 76-seat E-175"- While you could argue the layman wouldn't take exception to this, there's much confusion, especially in Europe over scope, and why the US airline industry breaks down around the 76 seater.
This is a distinction that may become very important in the comming months as 'United" retire their CR 200's for example...

What distinction? A wholly owned subsidiary of Alaska flies the E-175. How can you possibly claim that a wholly owned subsidiary is not part of Alaska?

[HarryMann]

With any President...

Originally Posted by procede

Not just that. The US taxpayer would also have to spend money to save what is now Embraer...
As for the repercussions of cancelling the deal: when has the US ever complied with international law when it was not in their own interest? Especially with the current president...

With any President...

[West Coast]

Originally Posted by ATC Watcher

It is like with all things, it is the small letters at the bottom that counts ..and it is SkyWest.. read the legend of the photo. the paint on the hull is not ownership

No it doesn’t. Any number of mainline aircraft are owned by leasing companies and banks.