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Bombardier clocking out of aviation

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Bombardier clocking out of aviation

Old 7th Feb 2020, 23:41
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Wasn't me that said it, it was the Seattle Times.

Last time I checked they were American, ..... no?
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Old 8th Feb 2020, 08:05
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Originally Posted by Old Dogs View Post
No doubt the management made a lot of mistakes, however, America, at Boeings request, implemented a 292% tariff on the C-Series.

That killed the project and forced the sale of the now Airbus 220.

Few products can survive a 292% tariff. 😏

https://www.seattletimes.com/busines...st-bombardier/
The tariff was implemented on December 20, 2017. Thirty-six days later, on January 26, 2018, the tariff was overturned. The article says little more, other than the supposition that Boeing antagonized Delta. If a $6bln+ 8-years-long programme can be "killed" by a month long tariff dispute which didn't affect the sales or deliveries, whose fault is it?
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Old 8th Feb 2020, 14:43
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The tariff announcement was made in Sept/2017 and finalized later that year. It would be disingenuous to suggest the tariff only existed for 30 days when the damage was done months before. While there might be some blame to lay at the feet of Quebec comparing Bombardier to AB is another fallacy. Both companies where in completely different positions at the government bailout juncture.

Bombardier suffered death by a thousand spears. The tariff only amount to a few dozen of those.
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Old 9th Feb 2020, 02:46
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Jobs in QC are "a" factor

Seattle Times article notes that acquisition by Airbus also granted AB "option" to buy out remaining ownership interests held, after the AB deal, by Bombardier and Quebec government. Without any access to the pertinent transaction documents - and while accepting as accurate the news reporting as far as it goes - what conditions for exercise of that option may exist at present, as opposed to what was projected for 2026 as referenced in the article, we can only guess.

Probably the CAQ party currently in charge of Quebec government would find nice advantage in giving a superior performance on the matter of retaining good, well-paying jobs in the province, as comparrd to Trudeau's party rather botching similar interests with engineering firm SNC-Lavalin. And quite plausibly there is a path forward that could work out well.

Instead of buying the interest AB didn't originally acquire, it should consider a modified consortium arrangement. The jet reportedly is a strong seller, correct? - and it is in the market ahead of other potential rivals. Don't shift production to Mobile - Quebec's aerospace heritage and its accomplished workforce not only match up well but surpass even strong resources in Mobile. Use an "earn-out" structure for taking a greater ownership interest now, and a reconfigured option later on. The more revenue and earnings, the more paid to Bombardier and QC for the fractional additional interest conveyed now, as well as under the later-deferred option.

It's innovative as a structure if you want to call it that, but it's really about dropping the pretense of resolving "who did what to whom" until now and instead getting on with, you know, the business of building airplanes.
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Old 9th Feb 2020, 06:07
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Originally Posted by WillowRun 6-3 View Post
Instead of buying the interest AB didn't originally acquire, it should consider a modified consortium arrangement.

It's innovative as a structure if you want to call it that.
Yes, that would be very noble and innovative but why would AB do it? Business is business and they are about to buy the entire 220 program on the cheap. AB isnít in the business of being a charity. They made one of the best deals ever now its about to be all theirs for a bargain basement price. The 220 could be the best investment AB ever made.
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Old 9th Feb 2020, 13:40
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However are Bombardier, and in the background the QC Province, bargaining smartly enough? Of course if there is no business incentive for AB, then it can drive the reportedly imminent deal to their own optimal terms - I wouldn't dispute that.

But allow a reference to the prior deal. Press reports indicated that AB was becoming obligated to bring its worldwide marketing, sales and support, and presence to bear in favor of the A220 program. Has AB done that sufficiently, and in accord with and fulfillment of the deal's terms (assuming the contract and related documents from the original deal, in the hands of a competently assertive attorney, provide a realisitic basis for "pushing back" on AB)? From QC's perspective, one could realistically expect that no stone will go unturned in endeavoring to keep jobs in aerospace here. AB has plenty of finance capacity, or so its apparently unblinking response to a four billion dollar civil penalty would suggest. And QC, and more broadly Canada (and its friends) could have pretty long memories. Not least the intensity of loyalty to the French-speaking tradition is easy to underestimate - but the sting when resentment is applied is not easily forgotten.

I don't know what the deal documents from the first AB deal say, but I do know that the entire earlier deal occurred in the grips of a strange, totally uncalled-for Tariff Delusional Fever from someplace south of Mirabel and Dorval, and it stands to reason there is leverage to be found from that earlier, hasty or hasty-seeming deal, if wise business people only will look for it. (Notice, no possible wisdom is claimed for any lawyers, SLF here included.)
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Old 10th Feb 2020, 01:13
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Scoop!

I'm going to say that Bombardier is going to sell their train division and keep the Business Jet division.
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Old 11th Feb 2020, 23:49
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An interesting and detailed read.

https://montrealgazette.com/news/loc...ier-everything


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Old 12th Feb 2020, 17:50
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Great write up from the Gazette. Yup, death by a thousand spears. Big economic hit to Quebec and Montreal. Sad.
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Old 13th Feb 2020, 01:19
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Apparently not only getting out of aerospace:

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montr...ster-1.5461294

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Old 13th Feb 2020, 13:53
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QUOTE:

"Adieu, A220. Farewell, commercial aviation.

Bombardier Inc. is transferring its 33.6-per-cent stake in the partnership that builds the plane formerly known as the C Series to Airbus SE and the government of Quebec, the companies said in a statement issued early Thursday. Airbus paid Bombardier $591 million to boost its stake to 75 per cent, while Quebec now holds the remaining 25 per cent.

The deal, which is effective immediately, cements Bombardierís exit from commercial aerospace. It also frees the Montreal-based manufacturer of future capital requirements to Airbus Canada LP, as the venture is called, just as production is ramping up. Bombardier put the future contributions at US$700 million."

Full article
https://montrealgazette.com/business...series-chapter
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Old 13th Feb 2020, 17:02
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Quebec’s only option and it’s a good one. They are positioned for a ROI while saving some jobs and getting rid of Bombardier’s corporate malfeasance impacting their bailout money. Not what they hoped for but the best they can do now.
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Old 13th Feb 2020, 19:06
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Not to worry,those poor exec's will do fine on the 30 million bonus they voted themselves after the last fiasco.
Surprised that JT isn't trying to throw some more bonus money their way.

Fog

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Old 13th Feb 2020, 23:22
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The Beaverton (a Canadian satirical news outlet) sums things up well: https://www.thebeaverton.com/2020/02...-a-jet-engine/

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Old 17th Feb 2020, 00:59
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WSJ reporting Bombardier in preliminary transaction, to be announced Monday if terms completed, to sell train unit to Alstom, for reported approx. $7 billion.
If completed (per Journal reporting) this deal would mean recently reported talks with Textron for sale of business jet unit would be terminated.
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Old 17th Feb 2020, 15:49
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I can't keep up!
https://www.avweb.com/aviation-news/...ary+17%2C+2020
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Old 17th Feb 2020, 21:37
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https://www.bombardier.com/en/media/...ardiercom.html

Official announcement.
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Old 17th Feb 2020, 21:53
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So the CSeries almost took Bombardier bankrupt
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Old 17th Feb 2020, 22:39
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Originally Posted by The Range View Post
So the CSeries almost took Bombardier bankrupt
It left them shadows of their former selves.
Just terrible for those poor exec's, how does one survive on a measly 30 million bonus?
Maybe another bonus for unloading the rail as well.
Sad
fog
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